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Godless peoples live in the Holy Land

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by keras, Jul 9, 2018.

  1. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    Psalms 79:1-7 The heathen have invaded Your domain, Lord – they have defiled Your Holy Place and ruined Your Land. Your servants have been killed and evicted from Jerusalem. Now we suffer the taunts of our neighbors and the threats of those around us.
    Lord: You are roused to a fury, Your indignation blazes like a fire. Pour out Your wrath onto the nations that do not acknowledge You, those peoples that deny Your existence, for they have taken over the heritage of Jacob.

    Psalms 79:8-13 Do not remember against Your people the guilt of past generations, rather let Your compassion come swiftly to meet us, for now we are brought so low. Help us, God our saviour for the honour of Your Name. For Your Name’s sake rescue us and wipe out our sins. Why should the nations ask: Where is their God?
    May we see Your vengeance for their treatment of Your servants.

    Let the supplications of Your people from around the world, reach Your presence and in Your great might save those who are dead in the spirit. Ezekiel 37:13-14

    Turn back sevenfold onto their own heads the contempt the godless nations pour upon You. Then, we; Your people: the flock whom You shepherd, will give You thanks forever and praise You to all generations. Ref: REB. Some verses abridged


    The heathen have invaded Your domain’- Most of the current inhabitants of the Holy Land, that is: the area from the Nile to the Euphrates, are atheistic, apostate or false religion worshippers. Isaiah 20:30-32, Psalms 52:1-5

    neighbors have taken over the heritage of Jacob’- Neighbours: the enemies of God, living in or adjacent to the State of Israel. Jeremiah 12:14, Ezekiel 21:13-14
    Jacob: now every faithful Christian. Galatians 3:26-29, Ephesians 3:6

    ‘Your indignation blazes like fire’ - The many prophesied punishment by fire that the Lord will bring upon the world, but especially devastating the Middle East. Ezekiel 30:2-5, Amos 1:3-15

    ‘onto their own heads’- The weapons prepared by the nations who attack will ‘recoil upon themselves’. Psalms 7:12-15, Obadiah 1:15, Joel 3:4

    ‘Your people, the flock whom You shepherd’, Righteous Christian people from every race nation and language, protected, saved and living in their heritage, the holy Land. Ezekiel 34:11-16, Isaiah 35:1-10, Romans 8:16-18

    Psalms 79 is another example of How the Lord will act when the Islamic confederation commences their attack on the State of Israel, as described in Psalms 83. It will be the literal fulfilment of the many prophecies of a terrible punishment by fire upon the nations, an explosion of the suns surface, instigated by the Lord, but He is not seen at this time, so it can be thought of as a natural disaster by the secular peoples. It is the sudden and shocking Lord’s Day of vengeance and wrath, that will virtually depopulate all the area given to Abraham, nearly four centuries ago. Zephaniah 1:14-18

    This will allow the gathering and settling of the true Israelites – natural and grafted in; all faithful Christians, to live in all the Holy land. The rest of the world will form a One World Government, as nations will cede their sovereignty because of this disaster. At least 10 years later, the Lord Jesus will Return for His Millennium reign. Ref; logostelos.info
     
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  2. Lost4words

    Lost4words Jesus I Trust In You Supporter

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    Last paragraph of yours is a bit far fetched i would say.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2018
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  3. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    But it is Biblical. Isaiah 62:1-5
    God's plan always was to have a people in His holy Land; His witnesses, Isaiah 43:10, John 15:27 and His Light to the nations. Isaiah 49:8, Matthew 5:14-16
    That is our destiny and our great privilege.

    I realize that this is a new concept for most Christians, as church teaching has failed to see how it is we Christians who are the true Israelites of God. They just put all the prophesies of God's people living in all the holy Land, onto the Jews and promote the fanciful idea of a 'rapture to heaven' of Christians.
    We are the 'sheep' of the Lord. He will gather us soon after the Day of His wrath, as per: Ezekiel 34:11-16, Isaiah 35:1-10, Romans 9:24-26, +
     
  4. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    Psalms 110:1-4 The Lord [Y’hovah] says to my Lord, [Jesus] sit at My right hand and I shall make Your enemies a footstool for Your feet. You are a priest forever in the order of Melchizedek. Hebrews 7:15-19
    Your people will give You homage on the Day of Your power. On the Day of Your wrath, in Your glorious majesty, You will judge the nations; heaping up the dead and crushing the rulers of the whole earth. Jeremiah 25:33, Isaiah 24:1-23, Luke 3:17, Hebrews 10:27, 2 Peter 3:7 & 10, Revelation 14:18-20

    Psalms 20:6-9 Now I know that the Lord saves His anointed, He answers from His holy heaven with the saving power of His Right Hand. Some boast of chariots, some trust in horses, but our trust is in the Name of the Lord. Those things are brought down, but we rise up and stand firm.

    Hebrews 10:12 Christ, having offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, took His seat at God’s right hand, where He now waits until His enemies are made His footstool.


    Psalms 17:13-15 Rise up, Lord and confront Your enemies and bring them down. Save us from the godless, by Your Hand; make an end to them, all those whose reward is of this world. May Your people, whom You cherish, have food in plenty, may their children have wealth and prosperity. Our plea to You is just: May we see and be blest with a vision of Your holiness.

    Psalms 21:8-12 Your Hand will reach Your enemies, God’s Right hand will seize His foes. In His anger, when He acts, He will engulf them in a fiery furnace. Fire will consume them and it will rid mankind of their posterity. Though they plot evil against You and devise wicked schemes, they cannot succeed, for the Lord will aim His wrath at them and force them into flight.

    Psalms 18:7-15 The earth shook because of His anger. Smoke, searing heat and devouring fire come out, as He parts the heavens. Thick darkness and vapour cover around Him, as a hail of glowing coals, lightning shafts and thunderous noise accompany Him. The earths foundations are laid bare at His rebuke, at the blast of His breath.

    This is the ‘Great and terrible Day of the Lord’s vengeance and wrath”, which is the Sixth Seal event and is described in many prophesies: Isaiah 2:14-18, Jeremiah 23:19-20, Ezekiel 20:47-48, Joel 2:1-11, Amos 8:8-9, Micah 1:4, Habakkuk 3:9-13, Zephaniah 1:14-18, Haggai 2:21-22, Zechariah 9:14, Malachi 4:1, Romans 1:18, 2 Peter 3:7
    A Day of darkness, not of light’, quite different from His Return in glory: Matt 24:30

    It is the next prophesied event, that will clear the holy Land in preparation for the great gathering of His people in the new country of Beulah. Isaiah 62:1-5

    Psalms 19:7-11 The Laws of the Lord are perfect and revive the soul, His instructions never fail, they make the unlearned wise. His commands and precepts are right and pure, they give joy and understanding. The Lord’s judgements are true and righteous, by them, Your servants are warned, in obeying Him there is great reward. Matthew 11:25 Ref: REB, NIV. Some verses abridged.
     
  5. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    We see in the passage below that the fire comes from the Son, instead of the sun.

    2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
    2Th 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
    2Th 1:9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
    2Th 1:10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.


    Based on the passages below, our promised land is found in the New Heavens and the New Earth.
    That is what Peter was looking for when the fire comes in 2 Peter 3:10-13.

    I am looking for the same thing.


    Gal 4:25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
    Gal 4:26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.


    Heb 11:15 And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.
    Heb 11:16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.


    Christ told the woman at the well that we will not be worshiping in the present Jerusalem.

    Joh 4:20 Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship.
    Joh 4:21 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father.
    Joh 4:22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
    Joh 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
    Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.


    The Word of God is like a sharp, two edged sword, that cuts to pieces man-made theories, and doctrines.

    Do we ignore the scripture that destroys our manmade theories and doctrines, or do we try to make corrections in an attempt to get our beliefs to line up with what is written in scripture?

    .

     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  6. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    I have a list of 117 prophetic scriptures that prove how the Lord will use the sun to reset our civilization, as He did with water in Noah's time.

    I see your beliefs as quite confused, at no stage, ever, do we humans go anywhere off the earth. Revelation is entirely about earthly events and at the end God Himself comes down to dwell with us here. Revelation 21:1-7

    2 Thess 1:8 does NOT say Jesus Himself is the fire, that is a rather ridiculous assertion.
    That it is the sun where the fire comes from, is proved by Isaiah 30:26a
     
  7. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Cinnnamon is my flavorite. Staff Member Supervisor Supporter

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    You are both wrong. It's a reference to the speed of his coming not using fire from himself or the sun to do anything to his enemies.

    2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
    2Th 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

    In flaming fire is regarding Christ not the unsaved. Flaming means a flash and fire is specifically lightning according to the Strongs. So Christ comes In a flash of lightning to take vengeance on the unsaved and that shouldn't be surprising because we were told that before:

    Mat 24:27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

    This denotes the speed of his return like a flash of lightning. It has nothing to do with using fire or lightning against the unsaved. To think that is to misread the verses.

    Just read Rev 19 where the battle is described and you will see ZERO fire or lightning used to kill anyone.
     
  8. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    2 Thessalonians 1:6-10 is not about the glorious Return, It refers to the Lord's Day of wrath against the nations, prophesied over 100 times in the Bible as a terrible worldwide disaster by fire, earthquakes, storms and tsunamis. Literal fire is specifically mentioned in more than 70 prophesies.
    This event will set the scene for a One World Govt and for a new nation of God's people in all of the holy Land. Isaiah 62:1-5
     
  9. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Cinnnamon is my flavorite. Staff Member Supervisor Supporter

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    It is actually. It is the day of wrath mentioned many places.
     
  10. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    It will not be on this rotten, sin-cursed world, which will be "burned" and "dissolved", based on 2 Peter 3:10-13.

    It is the heavenly city based on Hebrews 11:15-16, and Hebrews 12:22-24.

    In Galatians chapter 4 the Apostle Paul says our Jerusalem is now above.

    Gal 4:25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.

    Gal 4:26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.


    .
     
  11. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    Jesus Returns in His glory, not wrath. He disposes of the attacking armies by the Sword of His Word and chains up Satan. No fire, eq's, storms or tsunamis then.
    Explain why the Day of wrath should be just after the world has experienced the Great Tribulation.
     
  12. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Cinnnamon is my flavorite. Staff Member Supervisor Supporter

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    Not according to the bible:

    Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

    Obviously because of that trib having happened that the wrath of God is needed. You should know this already.
     
  13. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    The 'treading of the winepress' happens before the Return. Revelation 14:17-20, Isaiah 63:1-6 The reference to the 'winepress', in Rev 19:15 is of a past event.
    Revelation 15:1, then goes on to say; after the seven plagues, the wrath of God is completed. BEFORE the Return.
    You should know this.
     
  14. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Cinnnamon is my flavorite. Staff Member Supervisor Supporter

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    No, it happens at the second coming:


    Revelation 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
    Revelation 19:12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
    Revelation 19:13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
    Revelation 19:14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
    Revelation 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
     
  15. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    This is a flat denial of Revelation 15:1

    Isaiah 63:1 Who is this; coming from Edom, from Bozrah with His garments stained red, moving in His mighty power? It is I; proclaiming victory, I who am strong to save.
    Edom refers to all the ungodly peoples, all those opposed to the purposes of God.

    Bozrah means ‘sheepfold’, and is used here as a metaphor for those nations where His sheep – the lost tribes of Israel and where all the Christian peoples are at present. Matthew 15:24 The Lord, in His mighty power, proclaims victory and saves His people. This is His great Day of vengeance and wrath, at least 7 years before the Return. Isaiah 34:1-8, Isaiah 66:15-17, Zephaniah 3:8, Revelation 6:12-17

    Isaiah 63:2-6 Why are Your clothes splattered with blood? I resolved on a Day of vengeance, I trod the nations in My anger and My clothes were splashed by their blood. No one came to My assistance, by My own might, I brought victory. I shattered My enemies in My fury, their blood spilled on the ground.

    Luke 20:43 & Acts 2:35 The Lord said to my Lord: sit at My right hand until I make your enemies your footstool. Psalms 110:1

    Hebrews 10:12-13 Christ, having offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, took His seat at God’s right hand and now waits until His enemies are made His footstool.

    From these verses, it is made quite clear that Jesus does not Return in His glory until His enemies are ‘made His footstool’. That is they are punished and defeated. But it is ‘the Son of man’- that is: Jesus Himself who actually instigates this Day of vengeance. This accords with; Luke 3:16-17...the chaff He will burn on a unquenchable fire.

    Psalm 18:7-15...He makes darkness His covering, hail and glowing coals go before Him.
    But on that Day, He will be revealed to His people, those who believe and trust in His salvation:
    Zechariah 9:14-16 The Lord will appear over them, His weapon will flash like lightning – He will save His people. Ezekiel 20:9-11 & 36

    Isaiah 60:1-3 Over you the glory of the Lord has dawned, though darkness covers the earth, on you the Lord shines and over you His Glory will appear.

    2 Thessalonians 1:6-10....the Day the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven in blazing fire, punishing the godless peoples, He will reveal His glory among all believers.
    NOT to all the world, as yet.

    In Luke 4:18-19, At the commencement of His ministry, Jesus quoted only verse 1 and the first half of verse 2 of Isaiah 61:1-2. The second half is unfulfilled prophecy – ‘A Day of vengeance of our God and to comfort those who mourn’. Many other prophecies confirm that this Day of vengeance and wrath is the next action of the Lord on the earth and as the rest of Isaiah 61:3-11 state, it is also the time He will ‘ comfort those who mourn’. That is: people who grieve for Christ’s death and trust in Him for their salvation. Note that the Lord has blood stained clothes, then much later at His Return in glory, Revelation 19:13 He comes ‘robed in garments dyed in blood’. This proves that the Day of vengeance is before His Return.

    Isaiah 30:26 The sun will shine with 7 times its normal strength on the Day I save My people.

    Habakkuk 3:12-13 Furiously You traverse the earth, in anger You trample down the nations. You go forth to save Your people, Your anointed ones. You shatter the house of the godless to its foundations.

    Zechariah 10:5-6 Destruction of enemies, then restoration for the true believers of God.
     
  16. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Cinnnamon is my flavorite. Staff Member Supervisor Supporter

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    lol, it doesn't deny anything. You are simply wrong on Revelations chronology. It appears you think things in chp 15 happen before chp 19? This a poor way of understanding Rev but what it does mean is we won't be able to communicate well because I know Rev is not much chronological.
     
  17. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    All false doctrines are exposed not by the scripture quoted by its proponents, but rather by the scripture they must ignore to make the doctrine work. This makes them doctrines of "ignorance".

    Either the Apostle Paul is confused in the passage below, or you are confused.



    2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
    2Th 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
    2Th 1:9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
    2Th 1:10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

    .
     
  18. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    You are wrong about the chronology of Revelation, it is; excepting for flashbacks, linear.
    You fail to see that Revelation 15:1 says God's wrath is completed by the Seventh Plague. Revelation 16:17
    The wrath mentioned in Revelation 19:15, refers to the years before; Lord's Day of wrath.
     
  19. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    Ignorance about the 100 + Bible prophesies that vividly describe the Lord's Day of wrath by fire, earthquakes, storms and tsunamis, an event that simply does not match with the glorious Return, just leaves you in the dark.
     
  20. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    Ezekiel 35:1-5 Look toward all the lands of the Edomites and pronounce judgement upon them. The Lord says: I shall stretch out My hand to strike your land, I will reduce it to a desolate waste and your towns will be ruined. Then you will know that I am the Lord, for you have kept up an ancient feud and shed the blood of the Israelites by warfare, during the time of their punishment. Palestinians= Edomites

    Ezekiel 35:6-9 Therefore as I live, says the Lord: I shall make blood your destiny, since you do not hate killing and death, that will come upon you. Your land and cities will become desolate wastes forever and no one will travel there. I will cover the hills and valleys with the dead, your towns will not be inhabited.

    Ezekiel 35:10-14 You say: the two nations and two countries [The ten tribes of Israel and the two tribes of Judah] will be our possession, even though the Lord has been there. Therefore your anger and jealousy will be repaid, for I will do to the whole of Edom what you have done in your hatred for My people. I shall be known among you - for the way I judge you, you will know that the Lord has punished you. [by the means of a CME sunstrike, Isaiah 30:26-30] I have heard all your blasphemous talk about the Land of Israel, saying: the Land is ours to occupy. You have boasted and spoken against Me without restraint. So, now I will destroy you., while the whole world rejoices, As you rejoiced at the inheritance of the House of Israel, when it was desolated, so I will do to you, all your lands will be devastated. Reference: REB, NIV, KJV. Some verse abridged

    The Edomites can be identified as those nations and entities - that hate My people and have kept up their ancient feud with the Israelites, - that currently occupy a large portion of the area promised to the Patriarchs and who now threaten the State of Israel with annihilation. Psalms 83:13-15, describes how the Lord Himself will deal to them, as they commence their attack on Israel. Isaiah 30:26, Psalms 7:12-16, Isaiah 8:9-10, Obadiah 1:15, Micah 4:11-12

    Psalms 83:12 informs us that the goal of this alliance is total possession of all the Land of Israel. This is exactly as the Charters of Hamas and Fatah state; they are not interested in a two State solution, all the Jews must either leave or be killed. THEY love killing and death.

    Many people believe that the next prophesied event in our world will be the Gog/ Magog invasion. Others say it’s the tribulation – preceded by a rapture of the church. Some think the Return of Jesus will be next. That it will be none of these is told to us in the Book of the prophet Ezekiel, chapters 34, 36, 37, 38 & 39 they all speak about the Israelites being gathered out of the nations and settled back into the Holy Land of Israel.
    Those chapters are written in a fairly obvious sequence of events. Ezekiel 34:12-13 ‘I will rescue My people from where they were scattered in the Day of cloud and darkness, I will lead them out of the nations and bring them home to their own country’. Amos 5:18, Isaiah 13:9-10

    Then comes Ezekiel 35, where it is explained how this gathering and resettlement can take place.

    In conclusion, this attack by the peoples surrounding Israel will result in their destruction, but the Bible prophecies also say that Judah too, will be judged at this time and ‘only a holy remnant will survive’. The Land is not polluted by radiation and as the CME quickly passes, the vegetation soon regenerates. Psalms 68:9, Ezekiel 36:8 You, Land of Israel, grow your trees and bear fruit, for the homecoming of My people is near. This opens the way for all the faithful Christian peoples to emigrate to their heritage.
    Later will come the invasion by Gog/Magog – a different list of peoples and nations. They attack the Israelites ‘gathered from the nations and living in a land recently recovered from ruin’. Ezekiel 38:8
    Their total destruction is ‘to show Myself Holy and make Myself known to many peoples’. Ezekiel 38:23
    The rest of the prophecies will then unfold – the rise of the Anti Christ, the Tribulation and then, the culmination of the age: the Return of Jesus for His 1000 year reign.
     
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