- Aug 11, 2017
- 22,113
- 7,243
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Non-Denom
- Marital Status
- Married
Would he have been Peter ... if he hadn't repented ?
I’m not sure what you mean.
Upvote
0
Would he have been Peter ... if he hadn't repented ?
Except for Judas ...
I think that your illustration is a good one ... perhaps one which demonstrates what Jesus said in John 3:19-21A feral cat had somehow found a way in and ended up in our basement in the dead of winter. She was cold and through an old fireplace she managed to make her way inside, but couldn't find her way back out.
It was dark, no light at all, and no food. eventually she found herself so hungry that her hunger overcame her fear of us, and one night when I was making salmon for dinner she began crying and meowing for help.
It took us some time, but we finally figured out the noise was coming from inside the house, from the basement door... and we stood back while my husband opened the basement door, not quite knowing what to expect..
When we opened the door she was afraid, and ran back to the darkness of the basement.. but I put some salmon on a plate and coaxed her into the main part of the house where we live..
She ate until she was full, she was a starved scrawny thing near death, and then found a place in a quiet corner and went to sleep after some time..
We went to walmart and got a litter box and some cat food and a few toys and random other things she would need, and she's lived with us ever since.
We were her first experience with humans, but she seemed at first like this was heaven. There was light up here, and warmth, and food in plenty, and people who loved her.
She wouldn't go outside for months because she seemed afraid we may not allow her back if she went to play, although in time that dissipated..
Here's the thing.. she didn't want to come up into the house at first. She'd been down there long enough we could see every bone in her body. It was a miracle she was even alive still..
We had to entice her, to get her into the house, but once she had the experience of it, of how wonderful it truly is, we couldn't get her back out.. she would literally hide under the bed at the very suggestion of her leaving to go out and play for a long time.
When God says here I Am, this I have for you is good, people don't want to leave God's presence once its been experienced - you couldn't force them out if you tried.
There are two calls that are experienced. 1) is the external call of the Gospel preached by human beings and 2) is the internal, effectual call of God which we see in places like Romans 8:30
The first call can be refused or misunderstood or, or, or as it's not a full experience of God, but God's internal effectual call is certain..
But there's no force involved, it's the starving man being given a plate of food they didn't know existed which, once tasted there's no force needed at all..
Just because God chooses doesn't mean the people he chose haven't also chosen Him in return. We love because He first loved us..
Jesus was a Rabbi, and it was typical of Rabbis and disciples in His day for prospective students to ask to disciple with a teacher of the law and then be told yes by the Rabbi if there was space.
A Rabbi going out and choosing his disciples was unheard of, yet Jesus did so. And its pointed out specifically more than once - You did not choose me, I chose you. John 15:16..
This is an important theme of the scriptures. God chooses in His perfect sovereignty, according to His good pleasure.
Why? Because God's children are children of the Spirit not children of the flesh, and this can only be proven out by God doing the choosing - because anything done in the flesh is of the flesh and God's promises must stand, His children are the children of promise therefore, not of works but of Him who calls.
God's people aren't forced into anything. What disciple of Jesus said man I'm tired of this slavery to discipleship.. ? None. They were happy to disciple.. It wasn't always easy, but if you asked any if they'd trade it for gold I'm certain they would laugh at you..
A feral cat had somehow found a way in and ended up in our basement in the dead of winter. She was cold and through an old fireplace she managed to make her way inside, but couldn't find her way back out.
It was dark, no light at all, and no food. eventually she found herself so hungry that her hunger overcame her fear of us, and one night when I was making salmon for dinner she began crying and meowing for help.
It took us some time, but we finally figured out the noise was coming from inside the house, from the basement door... and we stood back while my husband opened the basement door, not quite knowing what to expect..
When we opened the door she was afraid, and ran back to the darkness of the basement.. but I put some salmon on a plate and coaxed her into the main part of the house where we live..
She ate until she was full, she was a starved scrawny thing near death, and then found a place in a quiet corner and went to sleep after some time..
We went to walmart and got a litter box and some cat food and a few toys and random other things she would need, and she's lived with us ever since.
We were her first experience with humans, but she seemed at first like this was heaven. There was light up here, and warmth, and food in plenty, and people who loved her.
She wouldn't go outside for months because she seemed afraid we may not allow her back if she went to play, although in time that dissipated..
Here's the thing.. she didn't want to come up into the house at first. She'd been down there long enough we could see every bone in her body. It was a miracle she was even alive still..
We had to entice her, to get her into the house, but once she had the experience of it, of how wonderful it truly is, we couldn't get her back out.. she would literally hide under the bed at the very suggestion of her leaving to go out and play for a long time.
When God says here I Am, this I have for you is good, people don't want to leave God's presence once its been experienced - you couldn't force them out if you tried.
There are two calls that are experienced. 1) is the external call of the Gospel preached by human beings and 2) is the internal, effectual call of God which we see in places like Romans 8:30
The first call can be refused or misunderstood or, or, or as it's not a full experience of God, but God's internal effectual call is certain..
But there's no force involved, it's the starving man being given a plate of food they didn't know existed which, once tasted there's no force needed at all..
Just because God chooses doesn't mean the people he chose haven't also chosen Him in return. We love because He first loved us..
Jesus was a Rabbi, and it was typical of Rabbis and disciples in His day for prospective students to ask to disciple with a teacher of the law and then be told yes by the Rabbi if there was space.
A Rabbi going out and choosing his disciples was unheard of, yet Jesus did so. And its pointed out specifically more than once - You did not choose me, I chose you. John 15:16..
This is an important theme of the scriptures. God chooses in His perfect sovereignty, according to His good pleasure.
Why? Because God's children are children of the Spirit not children of the flesh, and this can only be proven out by God doing the choosing - because anything done in the flesh is of the flesh and God's promises must stand, His children are the children of promise therefore, not of works but of Him who calls.
God's people aren't forced into anything. What disciple of Jesus said man I'm tired of this slavery to discipleship.. ? None. They were happy to disciple.. It wasn't always easy, but if you asked any if they'd trade it for gold I'm certain they would laugh at you..
A feral cat had somehow found a way in and ended up in our basement in the dead of winter. She was cold and through an old fireplace she managed to make her way inside, but couldn't find her way back out.
It was dark, no light at all, and no food. eventually she found herself so hungry that her hunger overcame her fear of us, and one night when I was making salmon for dinner she began crying and meowing for help.
It took us some time, but we finally figured out the noise was coming from inside the house, from the basement door... and we stood back while my husband opened the basement door, not quite knowing what to expect..
When we opened the door she was afraid, and ran back to the darkness of the basement.. but I put some salmon on a plate and coaxed her into the main part of the house where we live..
She ate until she was full, she was a starved scrawny thing near death, and then found a place in a quiet corner and went to sleep after some time..
We went to walmart and got a litter box and some cat food and a few toys and random other things she would need, and she's lived with us ever since.
We were her first experience with humans, but she seemed at first like this was heaven. There was light up here, and warmth, and food in plenty, and people who loved her.
She wouldn't go outside for months because she seemed afraid we may not allow her back if she went to play, although in time that dissipated..
Here's the thing.. she didn't want to come up into the house at first. She'd been down there long enough we could see every bone in her body. It was a miracle she was even alive still..
We had to entice her, to get her into the house, but once she had the experience of it, of how wonderful it truly is, we couldn't get her back out.. she would literally hide under the bed at the very suggestion of her leaving to go out and play for a long time.
When God says here I Am, this I have for you is good, people don't want to leave God's presence once its been experienced - you couldn't force them out if you tried.
There are two calls that are experienced. 1) is the external call of the Gospel preached by human beings and 2) is the internal, effectual call of God which we see in places like Romans 8:30
The first call can be refused or misunderstood or, or, or as it's not a full experience of God, but God's internal effectual call is certain..
But there's no force involved, it's the starving man being given a plate of food they didn't know existed which, once tasted there's no force needed at all..
Just because God chooses doesn't mean the people he chose haven't also chosen Him in return. We love because He first loved us..
Jesus was a Rabbi, and it was typical of Rabbis and disciples in His day for prospective students to ask to disciple with a teacher of the law and then be told yes by the Rabbi if there was space.
A Rabbi going out and choosing his disciples was unheard of, yet Jesus did so. And its pointed out specifically more than once - You did not choose me, I chose you. John 15:16..
This is an important theme of the scriptures. God chooses in His perfect sovereignty, according to His good pleasure.
Why? Because God's children are children of the Spirit not children of the flesh, and this can only be proven out by God doing the choosing - because anything done in the flesh is of the flesh and God's promises must stand, His children are the children of promise therefore, not of works but of Him who calls.
God's people aren't forced into anything. What disciple of Jesus said man I'm tired of this slavery to discipleship.. ? None. They were happy to disciple.. It wasn't always easy, but if you asked any if they'd trade it for gold I'm certain they would laugh at you..
Wait for it... I’m sure it’s coming... someone will surely say Judas wasn’t really chosen.
I'm saying that the heart of Peter ... was bent toward repentance of his betrayal ...Except for Judas ...
In this analogy you made the offer the and cat chose to accept it and was grateful. This symbolizes a synergistic relationship not a predestined relationship.
John 17:12
Well ... scripture does say that Jesus knew him to be a devil.Wait for it... I’m sure it’s coming... someone will surely say Judas wasn’t really chosen.
Not synergistic when I had to put forth all the effort to convince her to begin with..
The cat was drawn ...The cat still had to make the choice to accept your offer.
Well ... scripture does say that Jesus knew him to be a devil.
Can a devil be chosen ... and, if so, for what purpose ?
1 Kings 22:19-23
Then Micaiah said, ...
'Therefore hear the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on His throne, and all the host of heaven standing by, on His right hand and on His left.
And the LORD said, ‘Who will persuade Ahab to go up, that he may fall at Ramoth Gilead?’ So one spoke in this manner, and another spoke in that manner.
Then a spirit came forward and stood before the LORD, and said, ‘I will persuade him.’
The LORD said to him, ‘In what way?’
So he said, ‘I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets.’
And the LORD said, ‘You shall persuade him, and also prevail. Go out and do so.’
Therefore look! The LORD has put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these prophets of yours, and the LORD has declared disaster against you.”
The cat was drawn ...
John 12
32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.
33 This he said, signifying what death he should die.
The cat was drawn ...
John 12
32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.
33 This he said, signifying what death he should die.
Peter believed and yet he denied Jesus 3 times. Would he have been saved if he had not repented?
Actually, that's interesting now I come to think about it - because nowhere do we read that Peter repented, or told the Lord that he was sorry.
Yes, he wept bitterly, and would not have done that were he not sorry - but when I've written, on here, that Judas repented because he threw the money back, said he had betrayed an innocent man and then took his life; some have insisted that was not repentance.
Okay. Do you hold to Pelagianism?All Christians still sin and yet they believe. So I don’t understand how our sinful nature can keep someone from believing.
God apparently desires real love more than forced obedience. He could save every one by force, but would that be loving?
He was already saved.Peter believed and yet he denied Jesus 3 times. Would he have been saved if he had not repented?