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Geological Sciences v. YEC/Flood Geology

Discussion in 'Creation & Evolution' started by Mechanical Bliss, Apr 4, 2003.

  1. Mechanical Bliss

    Mechanical Bliss Secrecy and accountability cannot co-exist.

    +211
    Atheist
    US-Democrat
    It has to do with getting an education.

    Of course you can read geology texts and journals on your own without formal education via college, but you clearly have shown no desire to learn but instead resort to posting falsehoods and mistakes any trained geologist who is not a religious fanatic would not make.

    The sources you turn to for your information are lying to you by witholding information. It would be better to study the subject rather than reading propaganda.
     
  2. Arikay

    Arikay HI

    +175
    Taoist
    I agree.

    The reason why I was asking was because if you are going to college, there are many habits I would suggest you changed. From citing your sources (you still need to site the specific page), to writing in your own words instead of copy and paste, to doing research, etc.

    I am not in college and probably wont go to a "normal" :))) college for awhile, however I have done quite a bit of research on multiple topics relating to this subject. I would suggest you do the same, if you expect anyone to take you seriously, or even respond anymore. :)



     
  3. Alessandro

    Alessandro Alive In God

    +374
    Christian
    I have university education if that is what you mean, not being aware that the reference site wasn't included in reply is another matter, of which I stand corrected. Thanks anyway.

    I have enough information, but when I come accross something of interest, which is not often, I like to include.
     
  4. Arikay

    Arikay HI

    +175
    Taoist
    So, if you have a university education, then you should probably understand what "research" means, and why you should probably do more if you want anyone to take you seriously.

    Did they allow you to get away with this at the university?
     
  5. Frumious Bandersnatch

    Frumious Bandersnatch Contributor

    +304
    Unitarian
    Of course that site was full of nonsense. Mechanical Bliss has already shown how false most of it is while I was writing this but I going to post it anyway.

    Then why have you been totally unable to identify exactly where the flood deposited part of the sedimentary layers begins and ends. If they really bore strong witness to the historicity of the the worldwide flood this should be easy rather than impossible.

    Leonardo Da Vinci first explained why fossils on mountaintops are not evidence for a worldwide flood. You are only 500 years out of date. Further it is simply false that all the mountains of the world have marine fossils on them.

    Most volcanoes have pillow lava? I don't think so. Now consider all those huge volcanic provinces such as the Deccan traps that have no pillow lava.

    Many sandstone deposits are eolian. That means they were deserts. Limestone takes time to form. The limestone layers of the world could not have formed during a worldwide flood. I am sure Mechanical Bliss can tell you more(He has already shown that the statement is false anyway). What about paleosols and massive evaporite deposits? How did they form during a global flood.

    Of all the things that YECs talk about it seems to me most strange that they talk about fossils when the fossil record so clearly falsifies the flood myth. Yes much of the fossil record was deposited under water. In case you haven't noticed the majority of the earths surface is underwater.

    This is just nonsense. There are unconformities and angular unconformites which falsify the flood myth. I also find it amazing that creationists will on one hand say the geologic column doesn't actually exist and on the other say it is evidence for the flood.

    Mechanical Bliss has already explained to you why this is false.

    The is complete nonsense. The fossil record is not based on flagrant circular reasoning and the fossil record falsifies the flood myth as clearly as anything else. If you don't think so have a try at the coincidences thread.

    A combination of myths don't add up to reality. There are also widespread myths of the dead coming back to life and people changing to animals. This doesn't mean that Dracula versus the Wolfman was a documentary.

    Except of course that is was a group of Christian Geologist who believed in creation who first discovered the unequivocal evidence that the earth was far older than the a strict literal interpretation of Bible allowed and that there never was a worldwide flood.

    You have still not given any hint as to exactly which layers are flood layers and ignored the many flood falsifications that have been presented. All you can do is cut and paste nonsense and false claims from some web site put together by people who have sworn to uphold the young earth and flood myth no matter what the evidence.

    The Frumious Bandersnatch
     
  6. Alessandro

    Alessandro Alive In God

    +374
    Christian
  7. Mechanical Bliss

    Mechanical Bliss Secrecy and accountability cannot co-exist.

    +211
    Atheist
    US-Democrat

    Don't be so quick to point the finger at us when you are doing exactly that.

    You trust other "men" who run creationist organizations such as ICR and AiG (despite how it has been shown that they omit, ignore, and distort data to suit their own objective).

    You trust yourself (and other "men") to correctly interpret your religious text (for you) despite the fact that you are a part of this "fallen world" you talk about and despite the fact that you are not infallible.

    The evidence speaks for itself and disproves your position. Science is self correcting and is a methodology that will get you as close to the best explanation of all available facts that you can get. Creationist organizations abuse this by not performing science and lying.

    Now either stick to the topic by looking at the features in the opening post that falsify your position (Grand Canyon, unconformities, varves, Hawaiian Islands, etc.) and stop quoting scripture and pasting nonsense from sources without credibility, or start your own thread dealing with off topic issues.
     
  8. Frumious Bandersnatch

    Frumious Bandersnatch Contributor

    +304
    Unitarian
    Could it be that no creationist can answer these falsifications? Looks like it. That's why they won't stick to the topic.

    The Frumious Bandersnatch
     
  9. Alessandro

    Alessandro Alive In God

    +374
    Christian
    Who's pointing the finger at anybody my friend, even your interpretation of what I quoted is mislead. I trust God's word and that's it.
     
  10. Mechanical Bliss

    Mechanical Bliss Secrecy and accountability cannot co-exist.

    +211
    Atheist
    US-Democrat
    No, you trust your own ability to interpret it correctly.

    Are you infallible? If not, then you are "cursed" for trusting men.

    You also trust creationist organizations that have a propensity for distorting and ignoring data.

    Are they infallible? If not then you are "cursed" for trusting men.


    In the end, however, if reality doesn't jive with your interpretation that means either your interpretation is wrong or the authors of your religious text are liars. And reality doesn't correspond to your interpretation. The earth is clearly not 6,000 years old and a global flood definitely did not happen.

    Now are you going to address the topic? You've avoided the topic in almost every post in every thread. Otherwise, there's no reason to bother.
     
  11. Alessandro

    Alessandro Alive In God

    +374
    Christian
    My friend one of the two views are wrong, we will ALL know soon enough. If their view goes with what God Says then I trust its true. Please pay attention to what the verse says and its context.

    Thank You

    God Bless
     
  12. Mechanical Bliss

    Mechanical Bliss Secrecy and accountability cannot co-exist.

    +211
    Atheist
    US-Democrat
    We already know which view is wrong: yours. A global flood definitely did not happen and the earth is definitely not 6,000 years old. Case closed.

    I did pay attention to that verse. Apparently trusting "men" is a bad thing. However you do it to justify your position and then use it against those of us with actual evidence.
     
  13. Alessandro

    Alessandro Alive In God

    +374
    Christian
    Not closed nor is it over, yet.
    None of us ALL were there when it all happenend, so none of us ALL know for sure. Only God who created it all, and WAS there knows for sure.
     
  14. Frumious Bandersnatch

    Frumious Bandersnatch Contributor

    +304
    Unitarian
    Another of the big lies of Young Earth Creationism. We weren't there so we don't know what happened. We can certainly rule out certain things and show that they didn't happen. A major feature of the way science works is by falisfication of hypotheses and the global flood hypothesis was falsified long ago. You haven't answered any of the falsifications or presented any valid evidence that could only be explained by a worldwide flood and you certainly haven't answered any of the questions raised in the first post on this thread because like so many falsifications of the flood myth they can't be answered.

    The Frumious Bandersnatch
     
  15. Pete Harcoff

    Pete Harcoff PeteAce - In memory of WinAce

    +64
    Other Religion
    I wasn't there when Columbus landed in North America. Neither were you. In fact, neither was anyone who was alive today. Therefore, nobody knows for sure that Columbus landed in North America.

    We have now entered indefensible philosophy land, where we can make all sorts of philosophical statements about the past which cannot be "proven" either way, because the baseline for proof can be shifted at the whim of the individual. Therefore, there's little point in using such a line of thought when debating a point because it will go nowhere.
     
  16. Mechanical Bliss

    Mechanical Bliss Secrecy and accountability cannot co-exist.

    +211
    Atheist
    US-Democrat
    It was over almost two centuries ago. Geologists have known that the earth must be much older than 6,000 years and that a global flood didn't happen for quite some time now. These same geologists were set on substantiating a literal interpretation of the flood and using it to explain geologic observations. However, the more these geologists learned, the more they realized that their position must be false. You're 200 years too late.

    There are consequences of events that leave evidence.

    IF a global flood is responsible for earth's geology, THEN there are certain consequences that would reflect that event and THEN there would not exist certain consequences that would falsify that supposition.

    IF a global flood is responsible for earth's geology, THEN there should be enough water on earth for this to occur. There is not.

    IF a global flood is responsible for earth's geology, THEN the sedimentary rock record should not be stratified, should be relatively thin, and should contain NO evidence of hiatuses in deposition. The rock record clearly indicates large scale stratification, hundreds of meters of sediments, and deposition hiatuses.

    IF a global flood lasting less than one year is responsible for earth's geology, THEN the Redwall Limestone should not exist. It does.

    You get the idea. There are consequences of claiming that a global flood occurred and is responsible for earth's geology. Those consequences are decidedly not reflected in the geologic record. It doesn't matter whether we were there or not.

    IF a global flood happened and IF the earth is 6,000 years old, then WHY are creationists unable to actually address the questions and features put forth in this thread? Why do creationists continue to derail the discussion and try to ignore the points? It seems clear that there are no answers.
     
  17. Alessandro

    Alessandro Alive In God

    +374
    Christian
    God did not say when He Created the planet, nobody knows how long ago it was, but since the creation account in Genesis it would be around 6000 years.
    The planet's age before the creation account is unknown. But whatever it was before Genesis add to that around 6000 years for the creation of God that is written in Genesis.
     
  18. Mechanical Bliss

    Mechanical Bliss Secrecy and accountability cannot co-exist.

    +211
    Atheist
    US-Democrat
    Stay on topic.
     
  19. Alessandro

    Alessandro Alive In God

    +374
    Christian
    :(
     
  20. Mechanical Bliss

    Mechanical Bliss Secrecy and accountability cannot co-exist.

    +211
    Atheist
    US-Democrat
    Stay on topic or don't bother posting. Wasting space with a smiley is pointless.

    Either address the features you've been ignoring or start another thread where you can throw around your bald assertions. Stop cluttering up threads with your nonsense. Put up, or shut up.
     
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