Gay Marriage

[AmusingMargaret]

That is a virtual impossibility. Why would a person
do something that they says others should not do?
Explain how a person would knowingly be a hypocrite.
It's practically in the definition of hypocrisy is being
unaware that one does the same thing they chide others for.

But I'll challenge you with a question:
Why do you accuse someone of sinning, when you sin as well?
Becasue you...are...a..________.

A definition to help you understand:

hy·poc·ri·sy
həˈpäkrəsē/
noun

1. the practice of claiming to have moral standards or beliefs to which one's own behavior does not conform; pretense.
   synonyms: dissimulation, false virtue, posturing, affectation, empty talk, insincerity, falseness, deceit, dishonesty, mendacity, pretense, duplicity;
   sanctimoniousness, sanctimony, pietism, piousness;
   informalphoniness, fraud

People do indeed know when they are insincere, fraudulent, dishonest, and deceitful; and they most certainly know, whether they admit it or not, when they are pretending to have high moral standards but in reality (and usually in private) live like the devil. But they know, my friend. Unless they are mentally challenged, they definitely know when they are hypocrites.

 

[salt-n-light]

If you lead a gay friend to Christ who happens to be legally married to a same-sex partner...would it be a sin for them to divorce? What about remarriage in a heterosexual relationship?

No, because the grounds for the divorce would be based on sexual immorality.

 

[Followers4christ]

Sin is a contract between you and God and does not apply to your neighbors.
Jesus tells us that we all sin and therefore are not qualified to judge others.

The most misused line in Christianity is "only God can judge me" as referring to the most misused verse Matthew 7:1. But let's see what the Bible really says about judging others.

Matthew 7:1-5 "Do not judge, or you too willbe judged.For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with themeasure you use, it will be measured to you. Why do you look at the speck of sawdust inyour brother's eye and pay no attention tothe plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye."


It's not saying that Judging is wrong, what it is saying is if you judge someone you should not be doing the samething that you are judging the other person for (for that would make you a hypocrite). Just as Ted Haggard condemned sexual sins and yet in close doors was committing the very act he was condemning (he refused to look at the sawdust in his own eyes), the church has seen alot of hypocrites. This is what Matthew 7:1-5 is condemning. If we are to judge let us not be hypocrites about it.


1 Corinthians 5:12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?

1 Corinthians 6:1-6 If any of you has a dispute with another, dare he take it before the ungodly for judgment instead of before the saints? Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases? Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life! Therefore, if you have disputes about such matters, appoint as judges even men of little account in the church! I say this to shame you. Is it possible that there is nobody among you wise enough to judge a dispute between believers? But instead, one brother goes to law against another—and this in front of unbelievers!

Titus 2:15 These, then, are the things you should teach. Encourage and rebuke with all authority. Do not let anyone despise you.

 

[SkyWriting]

It's not saying that Judging is wrong, what it is saying is if you judge someone you should not be doing the samething that you are judging the other person for (for that would make you a hypocrite)

You missed the sliver and the plank "secret" message.
You gots da plank.

 

[SkyWriting]

A definition to help you understand:

hy·poc·ri·sy
həˈpäkrəsē/
noun

1. the practice of claiming to have moral standards or beliefs to which one's own behavior does not conform; pretense.
   synonyms: dissimulation, false virtue, posturing, affectation, empty talk, insincerity, falseness, deceit, dishonesty, mendacity, pretense, duplicity;
   sanctimoniousness, sanctimony, pietism, piousness;
   informalphoniness, fraud

People do indeed know when they are insincere, fraudulent, dishonest, and deceitful; and they most certainly know, whether they admit it or not, when they are pretending to have high moral standards but in reality (and usually in private) live like the devil. But they know, my friend. Unless they are mentally challenged, they definitely know when they are hypocrites.

No. I afraid that you don't.
Plank in your eye.

 

[Followers4christ]

You missed the sliver and the plank "secret" message.
You gots da plank.

If I was dealing with this sexual sin I could not condemn it. Just as I could not condemn murder if I was a murderer. Which I do not pertake in that sin so I can judge the action of that sin.

 

[SkyWriting]

The most misused line in Christianity is "only God can judge me" as referring to the most misused verse Matthew 7:1. But let's see what the Bible really says about judging others.

Other than the two misused verses allowing for righteous (are you really righteous?) judgment:

Matthew 7:1-5
“Judge not, that you be not judged. For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you.
John 8:7
Luke 6:37
John 7:24
James 4:11-12
James 4:12 But who are you to judge your neighbor?
Romans 2:1-3 Therefore you have no excuse, O man, every one of you who judges.
Ephesians 4:29 Let no corrupting talk come out of your mouths...but only such as is good for building up, as fits the occasion, that it may give grace to those who hear.
Matthew 7:5
Titus 3:2-7
To speak evil of no one, to avoid quarreling, to be gentle, and to show perfect courtesy toward all people. For we ourselves were once foolish, disobedient, led astray, slaves to various passions and pleasures, passing our days in malice and envy, hated by others and hating one another. But when the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior appeared, he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit, whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,

 

[SkyWriting]

If I was dealing with this sexual sin I could not condemn it. Just as I could not condemn murder if I was a murderer. Which I do not pertake in that sin so I can judge the action of that sin.

Only in yourself,
not others.

You do not recall Jesus telling accusers to get lost?
Then what did He say? "I don't either."

 

[SkyWriting]

If I was dealing with this sexual sin I could not condemn it.

Plank in your eye again. That means you cannot see your own sin.

 

[Followers4christ]

Plank in your eye again. That means you cannot see your own sin.

That's why I have accountability partners in my life as I encourage every believer to have. Everyone should have accountability partners who will tell them the hard truth and hold you to a higher standard. But I do know my flaws through both my own observations and by the ones keeping me accountable. So yes I do know my flaws and continue to work on them. But since it's not this that we are discussing I can comment on this topic. As believers we are all supposed to be held to a higher standard.

 

[Followers4christ]

Only in yourself,
not others.

You do not recall Jesus telling accusers to get lost?
Then what did He say? "I don't either."

Did I say get lost? No I didn't.

Jesus said in Luke 17:3 "Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him,"

 

[Followers4christ]

Other than the two misused verses allowing for righteous (are you really righteous?) judgment:

Matthew 7:1-5
“Judge not, that you be not judged. For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you.
John 8:7
Luke 6:37
John 7:24
James 4:11-12
James 4:12 But who are you to judge your neighbor?
Romans 2:1-3 Therefore you have no excuse, O man, every one of you who judges.
Ephesians 4:29 Let no corrupting talk come out of your mouths...but only such as is good for building up, as fits the occasion, that it may give grace to those who hear.
Matthew 7:5
Titus 3:2-7
To speak evil of no one, to avoid quarreling, to be gentle, and to show perfect courtesy toward all people. For we ourselves were once foolish, disobedient, led astray, slaves to various passions and pleasures, passing our days in malice and envy, hated by others and hating one another. But when the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior appeared, he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit, whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,

First I used more then just two verses. I used Matthew 7:1-5, 1 Corinthians 5:12, 1 Corinthians 6:1-6, and Titus 2:15. Plus there are a lot more that I won't find them all for you but here are a few 2 Tim 4:2, 1 Tim 5:20, Matthew 18:15-17, John 7:24, and Luke 17:3. Also let's not forget that God rebukes those He loves to as He rebuked Peter in Mark 8:33.

 

[SkyWriting]

First I used more then just two verses. I used Matthew 7:1-5, 1 Corinthians 5:12, 1 Corinthians 6:1-6, and Titus 2:15. Plus there are a lot more that I won't find them all for you but here are a few 2 Tim 4:2, 1 Tim 5:20, Matthew 18:15-17, John 7:24, and Luke 17:3. Also let's not forget that God rebukes those He loves to as He rebuked Peter in Mark 8:33.

God has the authority to rebuke.
I don't give that authority to anyone else.
My exact point.

 

[SkyWriting]

People do indeed know when they are insincere, fraudulent, dishonest, and deceitful; and they most certainly know, whether they admit it or not, when they are pretending to have high moral standards but in reality (and usually in private) live like the devil.

Generally they do not know it.
That's why they are hypocrites.

 

[SkyWriting]

Did I say get lost? No I didn't.

Jesus said in Luke 17:3 "Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him,"

That passage is actually not about you birdwatching for the sins of others.
Many translations read "trespass against you."
Or....if you are offended by someone of the faith, let them know of your discomfort.

 

[SkyWriting]

That's why I have accountability partners in my life as I encourage every believer to have. Everyone should have accountability partners who will tell them the hard truth and hold you to a higher standard. But I do know my flaws through both my own observations and by the ones keeping me accountable. So yes I do know my flaws and continue to work on them. But since it's not this that we are discussing I can comment on this topic. As believers we are all supposed to be held to a higher standard.

So they have told you that you're not open to criticism?

 

[SkyWriting]

If I was dealing with this sexual sin I could not condemn it. Just as I could not condemn murder if I was a murderer. Which I do not pertake in that sin so I can judge the action of that sin.

Actually when Jesus said "Who among you is without sin?"
He was not asking them if they were all prostitutes, as you imply.

 

[SkyWriting]

The most misused line in Christianity is "only God can judge me"

I have never heard that line from somebody.
Doing a Google search for the phrase, the results are
very low and not significant. Mostly songs and tattoo's.

 

[Followers4christ]

God has the authority to rebuke.
I don't give that authority to anyone else.
My exact point.

If that was true then all the scriptures I listed would be false as they tell believers to judge. The truth is Christ wants us to follow Him and the example He set for us all. We as followers are supposed to show the love of Christ to everyone. But we are also supposed to judge believers in the regards of right and wrong, not harsh or unforgiving judgment. If you couldn't judge anyone then who are you to judge when your child does something wrong? Or if you are a boss of an organization or church who would you be to judge or fire anyone? The truth is if your child does something that is not right you judge and correct. If you are a boss of a company or organization you judge and fire someone that is not filling their obligations to the company. If your brother is sinning would you not rebuke it and give him corrective criticism? Judging people is apart of life and the Bible gives us instructions of what type of judging is acceptable and what isn't.

 

[Followers4christ]

So they have told you that you're not open to criticism?

No if I was not open to criticism I would of not got to where I am today. Also if I was not open to correction I would of not done 60 push-ups for not keeping a promise I made. If I mess up I try to fix it immediately if possible. So yes I am held accountable to a strict standard as I hold my family to a strict standard.