• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.
  3. Please note there is a new rule regarding the posting of videos. It reads, "Post a summary of the videos you post . An exception can be made for music videos.". Unless you are simply sharing music, please post a summary, or the gist, of the video you wish to share.
  4. There have been some changes in the Life Stages section involving the following forums: Roaring 20s, Terrific Thirties, Fabulous Forties, and Golden Eagles. They are changed to Gen Z, Millennials, Gen X, and Golden Eagles will have a slight change.
  5. CF Staff, Angels and Ambassadors; ask that you join us in praying for the world in this difficult time, asking our Holy Father to stop the spread of the virus, and for healing of all affected.

Former (current?) atheist, finding myself drawn towards Christ--desperately seeking comfort!

Discussion in 'Exploring Christianity' started by Davoarid, Sep 24, 2017.

  1. 2PhiloVoid

    2PhiloVoid Pushing the Pillars of the Status Quo! Supporter

    +6,246
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    US-Others
    That sounds fine, Davoarid. Whatever you feel floats the boat gently down the stream.... but I'd alter it a little, just for both the sake of practicality and the fact that the first 3 Gospels have a whole lot of overlapping--although not all identical-- material. Here's what I'd suggest as a slight alternative.

    Genesis, Exodus, Daniel, Matthew (or Luke, your choice), John, Acts. As you can see, it's one book less, and you'll actually be pulling in some needed theological/eschatological 'Jewish framing' for context and continuity.

    But, it's your call. :cool:
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2017
  2. tonemonkey

    tonemonkey New Member

    18
    +12
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    True, and maybe not necessary for a first read of the Bible. Feel free to skip Mark and Luke for now. You could probably do John, Matthew, and then Acts through Hebrews. You'll get enough of Jesus and the Gospel writings to get a pretty full understanding.

    One more thing I thought of. Context is important. It's important not to apply our understanding of concepts to what is said in the letters, but to understand the context of the city cultures being written to.

    In the case of 1st and 2nd Corinthians, the people in Corinth believed in and worshiped a false deity and they "prayed and worshiped" this false deity through temple prostitution. When some of them became believers many of them were temple prostitutes and the men who frequented the temples.

    Paul gave instruction that women shouldn't preach in the churches, which to our ears sounds like sexism/misogyny, but it would have been super awkward for former temple prostitutes to be spiritually leading the men who frequented the temples. There are examples in other letters of women being in spiritual leadership, so it wasn't a no women in leadership everywhere thing.
     
  3. Steve Little

    Steve Little New Member

    5
    +6
    United States
    Lutheran
    Single
    You Can join our community anytime! I will pray for you sir and your lovely family! Jesus LOVES you! Nothing you have done in the past can stop him from loving you! It is never too late to convert! God bless you and your family!
     
  4. Dirk1540

    Dirk1540 Well-Known Member Supporter

    +13,520
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Single
    I have a suggestion. There's an old school radio broadcast called Thru The Bible by J Vernon MeGee. It was a 5 year brodcast (1967-1972) where he went through the entire Bible...he would read a little, then explain...read a little more, than explain...from Genesis to Revelation. Very inexpensive download. Very convenient!! You might find some disagreements with him but it's a great intro, and you can listen straight from your smartphone!
     
  5. Steve Little

    Steve Little New Member

    5
    +6
    United States
    Lutheran
    Single
    I Like that suggestion! I am always trying to find ways to gain more wisdom. I am going to take you up on this offer and listen! Thank you and God bless you!
     
  6. aiki

    aiki Regular Member

    +3,042
    Canada
    Baptist
    Married
    CA-Conservatives
    Nope. Start with the Gospel of John first. Christ is the primary figure of the Bible, its centerpiece, its loftiest thought and you will find him best revealed in John's Gospel.
     
  7. Sketcher

    Sketcher Born Imperishable

    +6,024
    Non-Denom
    Single
    US-Republican
    Welcome. I'm happy to answer any questions you may have to the best of my ability.
     
  8. Davoarid

    Davoarid New Member

    10
    +29
    United States
    Baptist
    Married
    Dirk—I found those “Thru the Bible” recordings online—going through them now. It’s almost exactly what I need! When I read it on my own, I’m missing so much context, no matter where I start it’s all a blur of “Who’s writing this? When did he write it? Who’s he writing to? What’s he writing it *for*?” etc.

    “Thru the Bible” is answering all of those questions—it’s an amazing companion. Thank you!
     
    • Like Like x 4
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
    • List
  9. Dirk1540

    Dirk1540 Well-Known Member Supporter

    +13,520
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Single
    Also keep in mind that you have to crawl before you walk. There are levels of interpretation, the most important things in the Bible are also the most often repeated and most clear things. More obscure things will enter you into the world of various theological theories of interpretation.

    But it's always good to expose yourself to all the theories out there anyway, so I would just allow McGee to teach you his full flavor without resistance (to teach you the overall picture)...then later on AFTER you have a foundational grasp you could start looking into alternative theories of interpretation (from McGee's). The education process is on going!

    After you are seasoned it's not a big deal to listen to a preacher and only agree with 90% of him/her, it's the parts that we are in agreement with that are what C.S. Lewis referred to as 'Mere Christianity.'
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2017
  10. ToBeLoved

    ToBeLoved Well-Known Member Supporter

    +5,670
    Non-Denom
    Private
    There is s man in the Bible that prayed for more faith.

    God can and does do anything.

    And there is an excellent website called Got Answers that answers like 2,000 questions about the Bible. Www.gotquestions.com

    Very very good site
     
  11. Liza B.

    Liza B. His grace is sufficient Supporter

    +1,311
    United States
    Presbyterian
    Married
    Hi there, I'm late to this thread and hope you'll pop back in when you can and update us.

    I note you have a nose for stories. Art films, literary fiction. Do not forget this. Keep this on your radar. Why? The Bible is mostly a book of stories, rather than logical arguments and/or mathematical equations.

    Jesus our Savior told stories.

    The atheist axiom is that everything must be perfectly rationalized; everything must fit together like a puzzle. And it does. But not in a way we can understand, else God is not God.
     
  12. Adstar

    Adstar Well-Known Member

    +1,345
    Australia
    Non-Denom
    Single
    Welcome aboard Davoarid :)

    And may the Holy Spirit move you to know when you are recieving good advice and when decievers are trying to lead you to destruction...
     
  13. Adstar

    Adstar Well-Known Member

    +1,345
    Australia
    Non-Denom
    Single
    If you are seeking to understand Christianity i would strongly advise you to read the New Testament first.. The Gospels and then to the end of the Bible.. Then i would read the Old Testament to add depth to your knowledge..
     
  14. faroukfarouk

    faroukfarouk Fading curmudgeon

    +16,288
    Non-Denom
    Married
    It's wonderful to feed on the Scriptures of both Old and New Testaments and to gain gradually a whole panorama of revelation.
     
  15. Mountainmike

    Mountainmike Well-Known Member Supporter

    +1,150
    Catholic
    Married
    Welcome.

    I posted this on your other thread, but suspect it is more relevant here.
    As a postgrad (and one time professional) scientist involved in electronic physics, I too have to resolve an apparent (my view not real) conflict in rationality against theism. But in my case the deeper I went into science, the more I saw the cracks in it.

    Here my other post

    "If you found "mere christianity" thought provoking, it is also worth reading such as Chesterton several books eg "orthodoxy" who makes profound observations on how the world leads him to christianity, and ultimately catholicism.

    As a scientist -one time quantum physicist I have nothing but contempt for such as Dawkins - he goes way beyond his sphere of understanding, into such as quantum chemistry, and his arguments are often hopelessly flawed by his own misunderstanding but by aiming his conclusions at "the public" he knows few can challenge him, so he can present his a priori world view as though it was the verdict of science.. The problem is the hall of science presumes that the world is deterministic:, that is , progresses only because of present state and laws ( which even science disagrees with!) , and that consciousness is a chemical process, and life is a chemical accident then filters all it sees with that paradigm. It then guards what it "allows in" by whether it conforms to the paradigm.

    His basic premise that "the chemical event of abiogenesis may be unlikely, but give it enough plcaes to happen and it becomes likely, is a wholesale misunderstanding of quantum probabilities. Even the simplest of chemical accidents is not "billions against" it is "ten to the billions against" A number so small it did not happen.
    The wall has more chance of hitting every reader on the head, by its instantatneous wave funcition crystallising at your nose, than the idea that a self replicating chemical factory with pathways bigger than any factory we know appeared out of nowhere. And yet no part way house is even conjectured that fits the origin and the simplest cell. And we still have no idea how to make a self replicatinf factory other than the one we see in nature.

    The point I make is..Whatever your view on that, . the best abiogesnes adherents can claim using the language of science is pure conjecture. Abiogenesis is the name for a hole in a paradigm of life develpoed from a chemical accident, it is certainly not a theory. It does not qualify.
    It is interesting that abiogenesis does not even qualify as a hypothesis in real science (it does not repeat, cannot be repeated and there is no model - so nothing to test - which is the minimum for a hypothesis) - yet Dawkins ropes it into his "theory nearly fact". He abuses the very fondation of science when it suits him by sleight of hand. And so on.


    You only have to see how Dawkins reacts to (for example) slamdunk evidence on telepathy (which incidentally is beyond reasonable doubt, the question is how, not whether) - he apriori tries to debunk it, without even arguing on the evidence. Because It doesnt fit his worldview. And that is the antithesis of science.

    Consider the following: about philosophy of science.

    Start with what I call sagans folly. "extra ordinary claims need extraordinary evidence" which is a rallying cry of scientific relativism and atheism. It is also the antithesis of science, because the word "extraordinary" is totally subjective and is used as a bar to raise against evidence that does not fit your world view. The truth is an experimental correlation exists or it does not. You can aim to eliminate variables but in the end however extraordinary it is , and whether or not you can "explain it" more of that word later - it exists.. The evidence stands either in conformity or defiance of your world view.

    That leads on to what is science anyway? And the answer can only be, it is a model of patterns that are observed to repeat or are repeatable in the universe, and a process for adding to that model. In essence nothing is ever "explained" except in the context of that model.
    But the model is not the same as the universe. So what is an electron? the answer is an elegant bit of math, that helps with matching pattersn of observation. Indeed go deepeer and you find there are several models of electrons. The classical actually disagree with the quantum, and you have to know which to use. Hawking admitted this in one of his last books with the concept of "model dependent reality" which concluded that there was no unique model (and thereofer theory of everything) - that several contradictory models existed for phenomena, and you had to know which to use!
    In saying he destroyed the idea that the models are explanation of the universe, only how it behaves.
    He dealt a blow to the "paradigm".

    Quantum physics deals a blow to the idea of a deterministic universe anyway. Concluding "it does not exist till observed" and the philosophical problems with that are profound. A killer blow to the paradigm.
    A leading british quantum physicist said it was an embarassment, that quantum physics still had no rational explanation or indeed consensus on such as copenhagen interpretation (of whcih einstein said "I refuse to believe the moon does not exist till I look at it" but even he was forced to conclude that was true/. Indeed sciences current way of accounting for it "multiverses" of all possible futures and pasts, is irrencocilable with basic science. Like preservation of mass, and direction of entropy!

    Dawkins will say "i will believe it when I see peer reviewed repeats" knowing that
    1/ Journals are limited in wht they allow in.
    2/ The peers are like him, who will not allow in what they disagree with
    3/ YOu cannot get funding for repeats, and even if you do, no journal will ever publish a repeat!
    Point is...no "real science" passes the test that he gives things he does not like. Particularly 3! So Dawkinsian establishment keeps out all it does not like!
    Hence he can ignore what he doesnt like(eg telepathy) since he manages to keep it out.


    Of course the way out of the philosophical mess of scienctists own creation is simple.
    For as long as you accept that science is only a model. It is not the universe. So the lack of determinishm in the model holds no parallel in the universe, It explains nothing except it predicts normal observation but has little to say about what the world is, only what it does, all the philosophical problems disappear.
    But then the "god of the gaps" argument dies with it.
    There is then NO explaination for the world. And neither has science challenged God.

    And the more I saw of deep sceince, the more I concluded that was true.

    Now look at some of the fascinating forensic evidence. Like... the forensics of eucharistic miracles, and you start to wonder.. See white cells that should not exist in Vitro, that Darwin says prove his own theory is false! Life from inert, not from small change..... I can list many things that remain unexplained, with theistic overtones, despite being investigated by science which was left scratching its head.

    I am happy to discuss scientific issues, and how I at least rationalise them to theism if you wish.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2018
  16. ToBeLoved

    ToBeLoved Well-Known Member Supporter

    +5,670
    Non-Denom
    Private
    A lot of people like to listen to the Bible on audio. Good suggestion, especially if the OP commutes a ways to and from work!
     
  17. joshua 1 9

    joshua 1 9 Well-Known Member Supporter

    +3,541
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    I saw my grandmother go through that. She wanted to believe but it was not until she was 99 that she got saved. I believe that last year of her life was the best because she experienced a peace that she had never known before.

    "And the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus." Phil4:7
     
Loading...