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Featured "For many are called, but few are chosen." (Matthew 22:14)

Discussion in 'General Theology' started by redleghunter, Sep 5, 2019.

  1. redleghunter

    redleghunter Thank You Jesus! Supporter

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    Yes the proper application of exegesis. Which is why I strive to put entire passages up for examination.
     
  2. genez

    genez Contributor Supporter

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    The plan was according to whom He chose for who will enter into our kind of salvation. The Bride of Christ = the Church.

    God could have chosen David to be alive after the Cross took place. David could have been an apostle if God so desired. If God had done so? Then David would have been chosen IN Christ before the foundations of the world.

    "For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy
    and blameless in his sight. In love he predestined us for adoption
    to sonship through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure
    and will.."
    Eph 1:4-5​


    God in his omniscience looked upon all who would believe. Then He chose out from all souls He knew would believe, that only certain ones to be born at the given time of the Church age. So, that when they believed? They would be found in Christ. In Christ for adoption to become sons of God.

    In doing so God chose us in the Church to have our eternal homes in Heaven. For other great believers like David, Moses, Jeremiah? God chose them before the foundations of the world to be born when they were to believe. As to have their eternal home on the New Earth - the home of righteousness.

    God does not choose who is to believe. He chooses what is to take place with those whom He knows will believe.

    All unbelievers will all share the same after life. No differences to be found according to dispensations. Differences will only be found amongst those who believe. Some will have their home in the New Heaven = Church. Others believers will have their home on the New earth = all believers outside of the Church age.

    grace and peace...
     
  3. redleghunter

    redleghunter Thank You Jesus! Supporter

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    The text you quote does not support your claim.
     
  4. genez

    genez Contributor Supporter

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    Did you just say something?

    "For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy
    and blameless in his sight. In love he predestined us for adoption
    to sonship through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure
    and will.."
    Eph 1:4-5​

    Where was Eve before God revealed her? Hid IN Adam. Where are we now? Hid IN Christ.

    When were we chosen IN Christ? Before the foundation of the world.

    What we are to be is yet to be revealed. Just like the woman was his in Adam until the time to reveal here took place.

    While Adam was still alone the woman was predestined to come from Adam's side. And, because we are now IN Christ we are predestined to be sons of God in Resurrection bodies. Now we can only qualify to be called sons of God is while we are controlled/led by the Spirit.

    The text supports what I just claimed, as well as other Scriptures.

    grace and peace...
     
  5. redleghunter

    redleghunter Thank You Jesus! Supporter

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    This is what I responded to:

     
  6. genez

    genez Contributor Supporter

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    You mean to tell me God did not choose in his omniscience when you were to be born?
     
  7. danielmears

    danielmears Member Supporter

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    They were clothed in righteousness. The Father knows who's spirit is one with his Spirit. It takes some spiritual work to know you are attached to the vine when you accept Christ, to do as he said. Everything is spiritual, everything. The seen is created in the unseen. That is why we are told about calling things which are not as though they were, then believing. That is why when we pray asking for whatsoever ye desire you must believe you receive; everything works by faith! That is why it is written that man was created in Our image, the three fold nature of God's image. God creates by the word of his power. Out of the abundance of the heart comes corresponding fruit, good or evil. That is why Christ said by your words you are justified or condemned, paraphrased. Perfect law creates perfectly so if we are attached to the vine we have real life! And our words/thoughts will be correct, righteous.
     
  8. redleghunter

    redleghunter Thank You Jesus! Supporter

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    That’s not what you posted.
     
  9. roman2819

    roman2819 Author, "Understanding Prayer, Faith & God's Will" Supporter

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    What Jesus meant is not many will believe in God. Consider our time today, how many precent of world population are Christians ? Only 20% to 30% at most, I think. America and some african nations may be the nations where half the population are Christians. In fact, some Americans will argue that in USA, only 30% to 40%
    believe. In Europe and many Asia countries, majority are not Christians, maybe only 15% believe.

    I don't think the word Chosen should be interpreted so technically. In the bigger context of the bible, people need to repent and believe on their own accord. Jesus said you must repent. Im OT, same emphasis.

    Also, during biblical times, they don't say they choose God or they accepted Him (which is the way we say today). Instead, they said God chose them - - it is a humble way of saying they believe. Back then, people were more subservient to God. And this was not exclusive to the Jews only, even the ancient Persians, babylonians, Greeks and Chinese worshipped divine elements.

    Today, 2000 years later, things have changed. In an age of science and technology, people have less reverence for God. Now we say we accepted Jesus as saviour, but this would have sounded arrogant during biblical times.
     
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2019
  10. zoidar

    zoidar Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I believe God chooses us when we repent. It's God who gives the new birth, not us.

    Of course God can predestine someone to something He chooses from forknowledge. I just don't believe God predestines salvation, but the gift from salvation.
     
  11. Hammster

    Hammster Buckeye Newshawk Award Winner Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Then He really doesn’t choose. He just ratifies.
     
  12. zoidar

    zoidar Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I believe God also leads us to repentance.
     
  13. Hammster

    Hammster Buckeye Newshawk Award Winner Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    He wants to, anyway. He really has to be hands off to be a respecter of our free will.
     
  14. inquiring mind

    inquiring mind associate with those you can learn from Supporter

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    I agree... God knows everything, and has a sovereign plan.

    Being God, I know He does anything, in any way, He so desires... but, somehow this viewpoint seems more understandable to my my Baptist upbringing, than one of man having no choice whatsover in the matter. And, yes, I know His ways aren't our ways, but when reasoning, I can only do it as a man. Having said that, God's plan is sovereign, the right way, and I'll accept what understanding He lays on my heart, as He reveals it to me.
     
  15. zoidar

    zoidar Well-Known Member Supporter

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    It's a mystery why some people repent others don't.

    Btw, funny avatar ^_^
     
  16. Hammster

    Hammster Buckeye Newshawk Award Winner Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    It’s not a mystery. It’s right in God’s word.

    When they heard this, they quieted down and glorified God, saying, “Well then, God has granted to the Gentiles also the repentance that leads to life.”
    — Acts 11:18

    The Lord’s bond-servant must not be quarrelsome, but be kind to all, able to teach, patient when wronged, with gentleness correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth,
    2 Timothy 2:24-25

    Jesus answered them, “I told you, and you do not believe; the works that I do in My Father’s name, these testify of Me. But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep.
    John 10:25-26
     
  17. zoidar

    zoidar Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The Bible says why some people aren't granted repentance.

    Acts 7
    51 "You men who are stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears are always resisting the Holy Spirit; you are doing just as your fathers did."


    And then Jesus told them how to become his sheep.

    John 10
    37 "If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; 38 but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father."
     
  18. Hammster

    Hammster Buckeye Newshawk Award Winner Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Well, Jesus said why they didn’t believe. And not once did He say that those who aren’t His sheep can become His sheep. One can believe who Jesus is and not be His sheep.

    As to your first quote, do you not understand that it describes all of us before conversion? That’s why we must be granted repentance. And perhaps you should deal with the texts I posted instead of trying to get scripture to contradict itself.
     
  19. zoidar

    zoidar Well-Known Member Supporter

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    He doesn't just say believe who he is. He is leading them to understand he is the Messiah. There is no contradiction. A contradiction would be if he is telling them to repent which they can't do.

    Not just Jews also Gentiles.

    It doesn't say why some are not granted repentance. They may be resisting the Holy Spirit.
     
  20. PROPHECYKID

    PROPHECYKID Veteran Supporter

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    Well in keeping with the same parable, many were called (invited to the wedding) but those who were chosen had to meet 2 conditions.
    1. They had to accept the invitation.
    2. They had to show up with the right garment.

    The right garment is the robes of righteousness that you get only from Jesus Christ. If you show up with your own garment (your own righteousness) you will be lost.

    This is the application for us but in Jesus day this was a direct message to the Jewish Nation. They are the ones who the call was first made to. Not only did they reject the call but they killed the messengers who were the prophets. Jesus later on spells this out clearly. SO because they rejected the invite, the gospel call had to go out to whosoever will. Paul himself said that. When Jesus comes for his bride there are only going to be 2 sets of people. Those found worthy of being with him and those who are found not worthy.
     
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