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February 19th Democratic Debate

Discussion in 'American Politics' started by mark46, Feb 18, 2020.

  1. wing2000

    wing2000 E pluribus unum Supporter

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    I thought the way in which Warren attacked was tactless - literally on the very first question of the night...she barged in - and it wasn't her question. It seemed like a gang up on the "rich guy who doesn't deserve the money me he made" night. But yes, I understand the Democrat's angst....a Rockefeller Republican with a billion dollars to burn may be the nominee of their party.

    I
     
  2. Silmarien

    Silmarien Existentialist

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    Well, I actually think Warren is a species of distributist, and therefore espousing something a bit different than socialism. I suppose it depends on how broadly you define "socialism," but the more standard socialists are frustrated with her specifically because they think she's a capitalist.

    It probably all looks like the same thing if you're not already on the far left, and I don't think it helps that some Democrats are trying to downplay the fact that Sanders really is a fullblown socialist, but Warren is... different. She would probably be better able to compete against Sanders if she were a real socialist, but as it stands, I think she'd have trouble escaping the label despite not fitting it terribly well.

    Yeah, this I agree with. I kind of think it's an issue for women in general, though. It can be hard to not come across as shrill and hyperactive rather than forceful, especially when people start talking over each other.

    Oh, I don't really agree with this. Sanders has always struck me as shrieky and running more on populist rage than on policy. He's more consistent, given that he's an ideologue, but I don't really see him as more organized or lucid.

    I thought he did pretty well last night, since he had a fantastic target for all that pent up revolutionary energy in Bloomberg, but I find his "Revolution Now, we'll work out the details later" approach a bit... uh, less than organized.

    (Oddly enough, he's still my second choice, but I'm a little bitter all the same since I think Warren is a much better left-wing option if you actually want to get anything done.)
     
  3. ChristianForCats

    ChristianForCats Bible Reader

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    You are thinking about something else. The first question was not about Michael Bloomberg's "apology" of his "stop and frisk" policy causing too many minority arrests.
    The tax code part was, but not what I already talked about.

    One criticism Democrats have is because Bloomberg's campaign is totally self-funded, he is trying to "buy his way into office." I totally agree.
     
  4. Albion

    Albion Factchecker

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    I agree it's hard to peg her from her public statements, but that shows us how well she has been able to appeal to both radicals on the one hand and more conventional liberals on the other.

    I may be wrong about this (as you are thinking is the case). The opinion I offered concerned only how he has come across in the debates, especially last night's debate. He's trying, IMO, to be 'to the point.' That isn't a bad strategy, given how everyone else was rushing their comments and trying to get in as much data as possible before getting shut down or cut off.

     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2020
  5. ChristianForCats

    ChristianForCats Bible Reader

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    When I was doing presidential candidate match quizzes to get an idea who I most agree with (and there's a good selection of them), my results were consistently Bernie Sanders on top and Eizabeth Warren close behind. Two of them show which issues they agree and disagree with the users on. It looked like they are very similar. So I assumed whoever likes one should also like the other.
     
  6. Silmarien

    Silmarien Existentialist

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    Well, I think if you like one, the other is usually your second choice, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's a close thing. The most radical of the Sanders supporters view Warren as a center-right capitalist, so... yeah. Not exactly interchangeable. ^_^
     
  7. ChristianForCats

    ChristianForCats Bible Reader

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    Bernie Sanders is definitely farther left than Elizabeth Warren. When it comes to their differences, I agree with him on some issues and her on others. Popularity was the reason I decided to vote for Sanders since I like both of them.
     
  8. Aldebaran

    Aldebaran Star Power!

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    Isn't it possible that the reason they sign the contract is because they agreed to the terms? That's usually what the sentence says above the line they sign. If the agreement is to not talk about it anymore in exchange for a given amount of money, then that's what they agreed to.
     
  9. ChristianForCats

    ChristianForCats Bible Reader

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    Women actually did publicly criticize Bloomberg for their supervisors making sexual advances at work. No way would they do that if there really were contractual agreements to stay slient.
     
  10. Aldebaran

    Aldebaran Star Power!

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    That's the one biggest reason I was anxious to see Bloomberg be on the debate stage. He stands as an icon of much of what the democrats say they value. That sets him up to be attacked, and yet his money is what allows him to strike back as much as he wants. In the end, Trump and America wins.
     
  11. ChristianForCats

    ChristianForCats Bible Reader

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    Care to explain Aldebaran? Bloomberg was attacked all night because he deserved it. Trump will not have a chance to run against him.
     
  12. Silmarien

    Silmarien Existentialist

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    Non-disclosure agreements can be used as part of settlements to prevent victims from actually coming public with abuse allegations. It's one of those problematic contractual practices rising from the huge power imbalances in the corporate world, so the whole issue is that these agreements are being enforced.
     
  13. Aldebaran

    Aldebaran Star Power!

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    Division in the ranks of the opposition is always beneficial to the other side. I mean, a meg-billionaire in the same camp as those who always portray the rich as being what's wrong with America, and being the cause of so much grief in America, and also attempting to buy the election....how is there not going to be squabbling going on? And when that happens, their focus is on attacking each other which makes them look bad to the voters. It also gives these candidates time to dig up and fling dirt at one another while the Republicans get to sit back and watch it happen rather than have to spend any money on TV ads to say, "Vote for us instead". The dems are already giving the voters reason to do just that!
     
  14. mark46

    mark46 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Yes, Warren is much more acceptable to Democratic moderates, and to moderates of all kinds.

     
  15. wing2000

    wing2000 E pluribus unum Supporter

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    I should hope there is division in the ranks...it is primary season after all.
     
  16. ChristianForCats

    ChristianForCats Bible Reader

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    You just told me the opposite of what I told you. If there were agreements, the female employees did not come out. They did. So Bloomberg can't be believed. He did not back down on his claim that they agreed to be silent (despite the proof they didn't by speaking publicly) while being attacked repeatedly.
     
  17. Aldebaran

    Aldebaran Star Power!

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    Even in the general, there will be division when taking into consideration how polarizing many of them are:

    Bloomberg: A billionaire with a financial advantage--something the party in general frowns on.

    Biden: Falling in the polls.

    Sanders: To far to the Left for moderates.
     
  18. bhsmte

    bhsmte Newbie

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    Warren comes accross like a whiney baby. I take anything she says, with a grain of saltnas well.

    I believe this thing is going to come down to sanders and bloomberg. Bloomberg was off his game last night and will likely perform better, when he gets back in the flow of things.
     
  19. Aldebaran

    Aldebaran Star Power!

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    You mean when he's back to running campaign ads again? That's all he's had so far to get him the rating that he had before the debate. He might want to stick with that. However, it runs counter to the democrat message against "millionaires and billionaires" running the country, so the voters may not be swayed in his direction in November.
     
  20. Silmarien

    Silmarien Existentialist

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    But the whole issue is that there are agreements, and that because of them, the employees in question are not able to come out fully about whatever happened. Bloomberg was not making the claim that the NDAs existed, but trying to defend his refusal to release people from them.
     
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