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Fallng Away...Hebrews 6:1-8.

Discussion in 'Exposition & Bible Study' started by justbyfaith, May 27, 2017.

  1. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Member

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    Read Hebrews 6:1-8.

    I don't think that I am mistaken in my understanding that the devil loves this passage and tries to use it to heap condemnation on many Chrisitans in order to try and put them out of commission.

    I know he did it with me.

    It took me a lot of years to overcome the condemnation I found in this passage as I became acquainted with and then knowledgable about the grace and mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ as relates to sinners.

    The devil also took Hebrews 10:26-31 and coupled it with Hebrews 6:1-8 to try to hammer home his point that I was condemned because of sinning.

    But I found freedom in some things that are quite simple.

    First of all there is John 6:37. Go ahead and click on this reference or else look it up in your Bible. Whoever comes to Jesus He will in no wise cast out. That means that the people of whom Hebrews 6:1-8 is talking about, are people whose hearts are so hardened that they would never ever even seek the Lord or come to Him. Therefore if you feel condemned, and the devil is telling you that you can't ever repent in this passage, understand that if you are willing to come to Jesus, even in prayer, He will in no wise cast you out. He will receive you: I say that on the authority of God's word.

    Another passage of scripture is Job 14:7-11. Go ahead and click or else look this up in your Bible. In our faith all of us are like plants that grow. If a tree gets chopped down, it will bud and bring forth branches at the first scent of water. It may take time for it to grow, but it will be a living tree, and eventually it will produce an abundance of good fruit.

    I like to pray the following before reading my Bible every day: "Lord, plant good seeds in good soil and water them in me. I pray that I will not produce briers or thorns but only good fruit all year round. Make me a fruitful field whose end is not to be burned." I pray other things also; but this prayer is my safeguard against ever becoming the person spoken of in Hebrews 6:1-8.

    A few other scriptures to consider are Mark 10:27 and Matthew 19:26.

    Also I consider that when I fell into sin, it was like falling from the third story of a building (Romans 8) to the second story (living as a Romans 7 Christian). If I had fallen to the first story (to total unbelief and rejection of Christ) then that would have constituted falling away. (I have since come to the place of climbing from being a Romans 7 Christian back to living according to Romans 8. It took a lot of years.)

    But even if you feel that this latter thing is you, I say WOW! The Bible even makes provision for you. In Acts 20:5-12 is the story of how a young man named Eutychus fell from the third story of a building as he grew sleepy from Paul's preaching and was taken up dead. But Paul went down and fell on him and embracing him said, Trouble not yourselves; for his life is in him. Even if you fall from the third story to the first and die, God is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that you ask or think, and is able to raise you from the dead (Ephesians 3:20). Nothing is impossible with God!
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2017
  2. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Member

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  3. ByTheSpirit

    ByTheSpirit Pray always!!

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    So in one sense, I agree. Hebrews 6 has a much deeper meaning than probably most understand. Most people will have a falling away of sorts, but you also need to think of the context. The book is written to JEWS, (hence the name), and it is warning them of the dangers of reverting back to their law abiding ways before they came to Christ. Just as Paul did with the Galatians in Galatians 5. It is the same warning. The warning is still valid for today, that if a person who was in the faith should leave the faith to follow after another salvation, even if it were by works, they would fall from grace.
     
  4. mcarmichael

    mcarmichael Novice Supporter

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    I think the key word is "repentance", correct?
     
  5. Superhero Sam

    Superhero Sam Newbie

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    Isn't the word falling away unique in meaning?
     
  6. ByTheSpirit

    ByTheSpirit Pray always!!

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    I am not sure I understand your question
     
  7. Superhero Sam

    Superhero Sam Newbie

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    What is the greek/hebrew word for fall away?
     
  8. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Member

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    There is nothing wrong with abiding by the law (I know this is a little off subject of the OP but I wanted to address this...).

    The law is written on the hearts and minds of believers (Hebrews 8:10, Hebrews 10:16). If we walk after the Spirit and not the flesh, the righteousness of the law will be fulfilled in us (Romans 8:4). And also, those who are not carnally-minded but spiritually-minded are subject in their minds to the law of God (Romans 8:7). Finally, Paul as an apostle, and therefore we as even the nominal sort of believer, are under the law to Christ (1 Corinthians 9:21).

    Which seems to contradict Romans 6:14, Romans 7:4, Romans 7:6, Galatians 2:19, Galatians 3:21-25, Galatians 5:18, Galatians 5:22-23, Hebrews 7:18-19, Ephesians 2:15, and Colossians 2:14.

    We are both under the law and are not under the law, are delivered from the law, and are dead to the law.

    This means that while the law governs us from the inside of our hearts and minds, it can never again condemn us from the outside of us as a requirement written on tablets of stone. It is now written on fleshy tables of human hearts. Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute iniquity (Romans 4:7-8, Psalms 32:1-2).
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2017
  9. mark kennedy

    mark kennedy Natura non facit saltum Supporter

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    An interesting analogy but Eutychus fell asleep because he had been working so hard, he didn't fall away from the faith. We are all still trapped in Romans 7, but that does not change the fact that believers are still the children of God. I know what your saying, we all struggle, sin still keeps getting a foothold and wrestles us tooth and nail. When you hear the gospel, believe the message and receive the Spirit there is no turning back. When you reject the message, after you have understood it comes a time of decision, that choice comes once. It's not over till you quit, sin can't win if your born again, there are only degrees of losing.

    Grace and peace,
    Mark
     
  10. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Member

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    Jesus said, The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light. But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness! Matthew 6:22-23.

    And again in Luke: The light of the body is the eye: therefore when thine eye is single, thy whole body also is full of light: but when thine eye is evil, thy body also is full of darkness. Take heed therefore that the light which is in thee be not darkness. If thy whole body therefore be full of light, having no part dark, the whole shall be full of light, as when the bright shining of a candle doth give thee light. Luke 11:34-36.
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2017
  11. Ron Gurley

    Ron Gurley What U See is What U Get!

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    Hosea 14:4
    I will heal their apostasy,
    I will love them freely,
    For My anger has turned away from them.

    their apostasy...Hebrew 4878...meshuwbah...
    I.turning away, turning back, ...backsliding

    the "apostasy"...Greek 646...apostasia...I.a "falling away", defection,

    2 Thess. 2:
    Let no one in any way deceive you,
    for it (Second Coming) will not come unless the "apostasy" comes first,
    and the "man of lawlessness" (anti-christ 666) is revealed, the "son of destruction"

    Matthew 13:21
    yet he has no firm root in himself, but is only temporary, and when affliction or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he "falls away".(before he is saved...the "seed" does not sprout)

    he "falls away"...Greek 4624...skandalizo...
    B.to cause a person to begin to distrust and desert one whom he ought to trust and obey

    Matthew 24:10...Jesus' Prophecy of the "end times"
    At that time (3.5 YEARS of tribulation) many will "fall away" and will betray one another and hate one another...
    14 This "gospel of the kingdom" shall be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all the NATIONS,
    and then the end (of 3.5 YEARS of tribulation) will come.(NEXT: GREAT TRIBULATION of 3.5 years...verse 21)

    IMO: "apostasy" and "falling away" are forgivable sins for true believers. 1 John 1

    Sanctification is PROCESS. Salvation is an EVENT. Neither can be "lost" or "taken back" by God.
     
  12. mark kennedy

    mark kennedy Natura non facit saltum Supporter

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    The old Hebrew texts have an interesting literary feature, they often say the same thing twice, it's called a parallelism. It's the interesting how when the phrase is repeated with a different word it clarifies the intended meaning:

    the turning away H4878 of the simple=and the prosperity of fools (Pro. 1:32)

    There backslidings and/or wickedness reprove them, because they have forsaken the Lord because they no longer fear the Lord. (Jer. 2:19). Proverbs is written at a unique time in Israel’s history, an unparalleled period of wealth and prosperity. Here Solomon used prosperity and falling away almost synonymously. Jeremiah was there at the end, when the gate of Jerusalem were breached and write a heart rending book of Lamentations, describing the city in ruins. In the middle, during the eighth century Israel had enjoyed nearly a thousand years of health, wealth and prosperity. Ephraim was the wealthy and most prosperous of the 12 tribes, sometimes spoken of synonymously with Israel. The prophet Isaiah tracks down the prophets and priests who had abandoned their duties to go on a drunken binge.

    That wreath, the pride of Ephraim’s drunkards…

    And these also stagger from wine
    and reel from beer:
    Priests and prophets stagger from beer
    and are befuddled with wine;
    they reel from beer,
    they stagger when seeing visions,
    they stumble when rendering decisions.
    All the tables are covered with vomit
    and there is not a spot without filth. (Isaiah 3, and 7,8)
    There are actually two key things that can cause the falling away, the deceitfulness of riches and persecution. Leading up to the tribulation period the Apostle Paul warns of a 'falling away'. The letter to the churches of Asia Minor describe two churches, Smyrna that was faithful even though the had suffered the confiscation of their property. Then there was Laodicea, a city of great wealth but Jesus tells them they are poor, pitiful, blind and naked. Laodicea had seeded a church in Colossae but had become lukewarm.

    There is another reason that the falling away can happen, persecution

    Going into the Tribulation the church has major problems with apostasy, some say unparalleled. With the rise of the Antichrist you have war, famine and plague with the opening of the first four seals, the four horsemen. Then with the fifth seal there are the martyrs beneath the altar who were slain for the word of God and their testimony. They went through this falling away, eventually standing against the armies of the Antichrist predicting the judgment that would follow. Not everyone in the church made this stand, some may have been lured away with the promise of wealth and power, some surrendered out of fear of persecution. But fall away they did, I suspect in great numbers. Yet a remnant would remain faithful even unto death, not fearing the poverty and persecution it would cost them.

    Grace and peace,
    Mark
     
  13. Copperhead

    Copperhead Newbie Supporter

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    I know I am probably in a minority about how to view these passages, but I see Hebrews as pure apologetic delivered to Jews (why the book is called "Hebrews") that already are familiar with the details of Biblical faith, but had as yet taken that "leap" to fully accepting Yeshua as the goal, and placing their trust in Him.

    Just about the entire book is a showing how Yeshua is better than Abraham, Moses, Aaron, works righteousness, etc. In Hebrews 3:1, the beginning of the apologetic leading up to chapter 6 makes the assertion:

    Hebrews 3:1 (NKJV) Therefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our confession, Christ Jesus,

    That is an comment made to an unbeliever. The key word being "consider". What sense would it make to say to someone who had already "considered" and accepted Yeshua as the Messiah, to then ask them to "consider"? That is a non sequitur. Being Jews, they were partakers of the heavenly calling. God had called out Abraham and these are the physical descendents of Abraham and partakers in that calling. And the writer, most likely Paul, was also a Jew, so calling them holy (set apart) brethren is proper to call his Jewish brethren.

    After that statement, the writer then expounds on why they should consider Yeshua. Leading right up to Chapter 6. At which point, the author then makes the case that it is time to leave these elementary principles and act on it. And if they don't change their mind (the meaning of repentance) then it is impossible for them to be renewed, or made righteous. Essentially saying, there is no other path to salvation but thru Yeshua. That the goal all along was Yeshua and to ignore that is rebellion/falling away (one meaning of apostosia) from the Torah and the prophets which pointed to Yeshua.
     
  14. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Member

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    I don't believe that anyone can be holy apart from already having faith in Jesus Christ.

    As a believer in Christ I may consider Christ for any number of reasons. In context of the passage at hand I am to reconsider Christ on a regular basis so that I won't have an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God.

    Also, only those who believe in Christ are in the present tense partakers of the heavenly calling.
     
  15. Copperhead

    Copperhead Newbie Supporter

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    "Holy" simply means set apart or consecrated. The Abrahamic covenant declared that all his descendants were a holy people. The Abrahamic covenant is a heavenly calling. Abraham was called out. That doesn't mean declared righteous or "saved". That came later in Abraham's life. So the author calling these Hebrews "holy brethren" is proper of Jews to call each other and not mean believers.

    Always remember who the letter is written to.... Hebrews. Out of that context and things get all muddled up.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2017
  16. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Member

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    I reject the idea that holy only means set apart, I believe that there is a practical aspect to holiness. People take the idea of holy means set apart too far and don't think they need to be holy in the practical sense. They can say, "I am simply set apart", while practicing fornication and all kinds of iniquity.

    So NO: I contend that holy truly means HOLY.
     
  17. Copperhead

    Copperhead Newbie Supporter

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    Israel is called a Holy nation many times, but a nation isn’t saved, individuals are.
     
  18. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Member

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    Please give chapter and verse where Israel is called a holy nation. I know where the church is called a holy nation and a peculiar people--1 Peter 2:9.

    Here a corporate body of individuals are called holy, as each one within the body is an individual that is saved, and so a corporate body composed of individuals who are all saved is called holy.

    Now I certainly believe that the good news was preached even to those who lived in OT times (Hebrews 4:2) and there is the possibility that some of those to whom it was preached did mix faith with the message and get saved. Thus the ones saved through the message would be called out and saved, even made holy by the Lord.
     
  19. Copperhead

    Copperhead Newbie Supporter

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    You do know don't you, that concordances for scripture searching are online free of charge, right?

    Try Exodus 19:6

    Exodus 19:6 (NKJV) And you shall be to Me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words which you shall speak to the children of Israel.”

    And Israel is called a Holy People:

    Deuteronomy 7:6 (NKJV) “For you are a holy people to the Lord your God; the Lord your God has chosen you to be a people for Himself, a special treasure above all the peoples on the face of the earth.

    Deuteronomy 14:2 (NKJV Strong's,) For you are a holy people to the Lord your God, and the Lord has chosen you to be a people for Himself, a special treasure above all the peoples who are on the face of the earth.

    And at least 6 more times in scripture.

    And while many view "the elect" as being primarily the church from passages like Matt 24:24, Mark 13:22, Colossians 3;12, etc, Israel is also called the elect of God.....

    Isaiah 45:4 (NKJV) For Jacob My servant's sake,
    And Israel My elect,
    I have even called you by your name;
    I have named you, though you have not known Me.

    Isaiah 65:9 (NKJV) I will bring forth descendants from Jacob,
    And from Judah an heir of My mountains;
    My elect shall inherit it,
    And My servants shall dwell there.

    Or did you know that also angels are called elect?

    1 Timothy 5:21 (NKJV) I charge you before God and the Lord Jesus Christ and the elect angels that you observe these things without prejudice, doing nothing with partiality.

    The main problem comes from confusing Israel and the Church. Israel is an elect or holy nation from among all the nations, and made up of only physical descendants of Abraham, but not all those within Israel are justified. The church is only made up of justified people, both Jew and Gentile from all the nations, gathered into one body of Messiah.

    Israel (the Jewish people) gave us the Messiah and all of the scripture, both OT and NT. This is the reason they are considered a Holy nation along with the promise God made to Abraham. There has been tradition that Luke was gentile, but there is no scriptural support for that view, and actually more evidence that Luke was also Jewish. A very good article was done that went into whether Luke was Gentile or Jewish here:

    Was Luke a Gentile?

    Ruth was considered justified and is in the lineage of the Messiah. But even with that, she never was Jewish and was always considered a Moabite. She is a type of the gentile believers. She, as those in Messiah now, have the faith of Abraham and are justified.

    And while Israel is a Holy Nation, we know that not all of Israel are justified. Take a look at those that died the wilderness, after they were declared a holy nation, because of lack of trust in the Lord after the recon of the promised land. But those that did trust in the Lord after the recon of the promised land were allowed to enter. So Israel can be a holy nation while at the same time not all of Israel is justified. Paul expounds on this extensively in Romans.
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2017
  20. omega2xx

    omega2xx Active Member Supporter

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    Also consider Phil 1:6, Heb 12:2 and I p;et 1:23
     
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