Fake History

joshua 1 9

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I know there is a lot of fake news out right now. I had a history teacher tell me once that most of the history they teach in the public school system is fake. Can anyone explain why we would have fake history and how to tell the difference between real history as we read it in the Bible and fake history that people use to promote for their own agenda.
 

christianforumsuser

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If I told you how...how would you know I'm not also lying or quoting something false...or interpreting the Bible wrong
Have you seen Scripture? Do you have light? Truth?
Any man might tell you "believe me, I promise this is the truth"

And scientists can make a fancy math formula and machine that nobody understands...and say all the fancy lingo to confuse you and say "look, it proves it"
They punch in the data and bring in an expert with PhD (because PhD means you're smart)

You know by seeing me my skin color is white, but you can't stereotype me can you...
I'm a white guy saying words that mean something to me but not you. Because I either say what I see or secondhand was told...and try to translate to a parable that you can relate to from your life experience
 
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~Anastasia~

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I know there is a lot of fake news out right now. I had a history teacher tell me once that most of the history they teach in the public school system is fake. Can anyone explain why we would have fake history and how to tell the difference between real history as we read it in the Bible and fake history that people use to promote for their own agenda.

I doubt most of the history being taught is actually fake (some of it may be) ... but what you VERY likely get are particular interpretations that represent the slant the author puts on it.

Finding the truth is notoriously difficult and may be impossible in some cases.

You can seek out multiple sources, question their possible motives, and compare them. Even seek out opposite perspectives, and compare them. Sometimes I've found opposing histories to be blatantly false.

They say that history is written by the victors, and that tends to be true. Or in the case of today's world, those who control the dissemination of information in various forms have a huge influence on perception of truth.
 
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Ken Rank

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I know there is a lot of fake news out right now. I had a history teacher tell me once that most of the history they teach in the public school system is fake. Can anyone explain why we would have fake history and how to tell the difference between real history as we read it in the Bible and fake history that people use to promote for their own agenda.
Winners write the books, that is the fact of the matter. So... how do you find real truth? The only way is to work for it... there are no shortcuts. If our history books claim the South seceded to keep their slaves... then go read what those in the South claimed and weigh both sides out evenly and without bias. And always look for a time period source rather than some brainiac who wrote a book on the subject 100 or 1000 years later. Nothing wrong with his book but if you do read it... verify his sources IN CONTEXT. Meaning, if he quotes a line go read the chapter he quoted form and make sure the context is true.

There is a lot more but this is a good place to start.
 
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HereIStand

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I know there is a lot of fake news out right now. I had a history teacher tell me once that most of the history they teach in the public school system is fake. Can anyone explain why we would have fake history and how to tell the difference between real history as we read it in the Bible and fake history that people use to promote for their own agenda.
Historically, some of the Bible, especially the New Testament, can be corroborated based on history, archeology, or geography. This doesn't establish the truth of the Bible or falsify it. Some would view these fields as sitting on some lofty level above the Bible and judging it. Not so. The Bible is true as God's Word to us.

Biases have to be accounted for in any history, but the tendency to blatantly lie about events (in a way that can be disproven) is something that George Orwell commented on regarding his time in the Spanish Civil War in the 1930s:

“I remember saying once to Arthur Koestler, ‘History stopped in 1936’, at which he nodded in immediate understanding. We were both thinking of totalitarianism in general, but more particularly of the Spanish civil war. Early in life I have noticed that no event is ever correctly reported in a newspaper, but in Spain, for the first time, I saw newspaper reports which did not bear any relation to the facts, not even the relationship which is implied in an ordinary lie. I saw great battles reported where there had been no fighting, and complete silence where hundreds of men had been killed. I saw troops who had fought bravely denounced as cowards and traitors, and others who had never seen a shot fired hailed as the heroes of imaginary victories; and I saw newspapers in London retailing these lies and eager intellectuals building emotional superstructures over events that had never happened. I saw, in fact, history being written not in terms of what happened but of what ought to have happened according to various ‘party lines’.”

Orwell: ‘History Stopped in 1936’ (and Everything Since Is Propaganda)
 
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joshua 1 9

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Winners write the books, that is the fact of the matter. So... how do you find real truth? The only way is to work for it... there are no shortcuts. If our history books claim the South seceded to keep their slaves... then go read what those in the South claimed and weigh both sides out evenly and without bias. And always look for a time period source rather than some brainiac who wrote a book on the subject 100 or 1000 years later. Nothing wrong with his book but if you do read it... verify his sources IN CONTEXT. Meaning, if he quotes a line go read the chapter he quoted form and make sure the context is true.

There is a lot more but this is a good place to start.
Usually for the South and the situation with the slaves I look for autobiographies written by a slave or former slave. This may not make their story any more accurate but it does give an interesting first person eyewitness perspective.
 
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Original Happy Camper

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I know there is a lot of fake news out right now. I had a history teacher tell me once that most of the history they teach in the public school system is fake. Can anyone explain why we would have fake history and how to tell the difference between real history as we read it in the Bible and fake history that people use to promote for their own agenda.

Got to change history so as to propagate satan's interpretation of the bible. The bible rightly interpenetrated revels that history fulfills the prophecies.
 
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christianforumsuser

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I might not trust some arrogant guy with a PhD who quotes his textbooks and friends as gospel (FAKE NEWS?)
Nor some random guy who says he's not sure
No matter what, God's Word is true, but lots of men say what benefits them carnally...leaving some words out or twisting or adding things

If you're interested in having truth...people witness and quote and paraphrase...like a telephone game
And people even forge lies that sound nice or profitable. Carnal people seek what benefits them carnally
Even a fancy machine or math formula that has a feedback loop logic to spit out data you feed it is read by a man...a professed smart man who tells you to trust his reading of it

Why trust a sinful man? Of course they hide and lie a little....and a little is perhaps a lot more than a little
 
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christianforumsuser

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Traditions and suits and ties and meetings
Whatever sinful society does is accepted as normal
Why trust an economist with a huge salary and who spent all that money on college...and yet it's only for show because all the kings horses and men couldn't get humpty dumpty together
All the science research and medical work and men have no reason in mind to make good progress because there's more money in dragging their feet saying they haven't figured it out

Watch and see...they'd try casting me out for saying this because they don't like it said
They're not what they say. They're whatever money and status buys
 
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joshua 1 9

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Got to change history so as to propagate satan's interpretation of the bible. The bible rightly interpenetrated revels that history fulfills the prophecies.
I am reading a book right now called "Paradigm". The perspective here is that God works all events, actions, reactions (etc) for His purpose. God can be at different places at different times working to accomplish His plan & purpose. So there is more involved than just a prediction about the future. Or history repeating itself.

Romans8 "28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose."
 
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joshua 1 9

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Why trust a sinful man?
Very few people seem to be qualified to give us truth as we find truth in the Bible. This takes Holiness and Sanctification that most people are not willing to go along with. For many are called but few are chosen. I believe only a remnant or 10% of the people can actually be trusted to accurately handle the truth. Of course a lot more are saved but salvation is not based on works so being saved does not make a person a messenger for God. If they are not willing to live a Holy Sanctified life to be used by God in this way.
 
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christianforumsuser

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I'm an elephant, a doctor, and a priest. I'm certified

I realize that doesn't sound professional, but sounding and looking the part isn't as important as the content.
As for your words salvation not being based on works..I can assume the context and implication, but say the Bible does tell us what role works played. Jesus's ministry has details people can't overlook
Now of course we're not talking Jesus...because in the world that name isn't so workplace-friendly..
In fact I'm hoping to be able to say His names everywhere, but not in the arrogant religious way, nor lowering it as nothing. I really want people to soon learn and believe all over the world, but in quiet peace in Him.
Else it's just wage earning and excuses to keep social status. I was in a religious family and had a non-religious friend. People aren't so different. They're different, but boast different ways. Everyone needs God's faith in HIS WORD and works, not just endless arrogant debates.

After all it is His Story...History...so even if I have a certification I might only speak my own limited perspective and thoughts as a wicked man. Find someone to teach you the Bible and for faith. I didn't say not to ask some smart worldly man, but you'll need better than that garbage
 
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Ken Rank

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Usually for the South and the situation with the slaves I look for autobiographies written by a slave or former slave. This may not make their story any more accurate but it does give an interesting first person eyewitness perspective.
That was just an example... and easy one because it is more modern. My point is the winners will swing the pendulum one was and the loser might swing it back to the other whereas the truth will be either in the middle or closer to the middle but favoring one over the other. Rarely will we find a pendulum swung to an extreme side and that turn out to be 100% correct.

The bible speaks about making sure we understand both sides of an argument. The reason why is we are not able to make sure what accept is truth unless we have weighed it against other beliefs or claims. This is why I know the truth usually comes down to just over the center to one side or the other.
 
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tz620q

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That was just an example... and easy one because it is more modern. My point is the winners will swing the pendulum one was and the loser might swing it back to the other whereas the truth will be either in the middle or closer to the middle but favoring one over the other. Rarely will we find a pendulum swung to an extreme side and that turn out to be 100% correct.

The bible speaks about making sure we understand both sides of an argument. The reason why is we are not able to make sure what accept is truth unless we have weighed it against other beliefs or claims. This is why I know the truth usually comes down to just over the center to one side or the other.
This reminds me of when I was studying the Reformation. I went through one course that was taught by a Protestant and recognized the bias. Then went through another course that was taught by a Catholic and recognized the opposite bias. Finally, I found a course taught by an academic historian and saw that he did not try to spin events, only to present what happened in a historically accurate way.

It seems that history as a science has gone through many ebbs and flows. One low point that I have seen happened in the nineteenth century, when "histories" were being written with blatant agendas and being accepted by the masses as fact. My own early schooling suffered from some of these long-cherished myths, like in Columbus' time everyone thought the world was flat.
 
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joshua 1 9

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That was just an example... and easy one because it is more modern. My point is the winners will swing the pendulum one was and the loser might swing it back to the other whereas the truth will be either in the middle or closer to the middle but favoring one over the other. Rarely will we find a pendulum swung to an extreme side and that turn out to be 100% correct.

The bible speaks about making sure we understand both sides of an argument. The reason why is we are not able to make sure what accept is truth unless we have weighed it against other beliefs or claims. This is why I know the truth usually comes down to just over the center to one side or the other.
Actually we know the truth because we have the Holy Spirit of God to guide us and lead us into the truth. I do not know apart from God how we could know truth. The system they have set up on our courts is by some people considered to be the worst way to arrive at the truth.
 
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joshua 1 9

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This reminds me of when I was studying the Reformation. I went through one course that was taught by a Protestant and recognized the bias. Then went through another course that was taught by a Catholic and recognized the opposite bias. Finally, I found a course taught by an academic historian and saw that he did not try to spin events, only to present what happened in a historically accurate way.

It seems that history as a science has gone through many ebbs and flows. One low point that I have seen happened in the nineteenth century, when "histories" were being written with blatant agendas and being accepted by the masses as fact. My own early schooling suffered from some of these long-cherished myths, like in Columbus' time everyone thought the world was flat.
My first history class was taught by a man who survived the German Holocaust. His perspective was that we had to know what is going on around us because your life may depend on it. He lived to be 100.
 
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Philip_B

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There is a great deal more to history than dates and places, and one of the most important issues in history is to understand why things happened. It is when we understand the why that we may begin to learn the lesson of history. The challenge for us is that generally there will be more than one version of the why.
 
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ViaCrucis

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I know there is a lot of fake news out right now. I had a history teacher tell me once that most of the history they teach in the public school system is fake. Can anyone explain why we would have fake history and how to tell the difference between real history as we read it in the Bible and fake history that people use to promote for their own agenda.

A lot of bogus information can filter its way into how we narrate history to one another. A somewhat famous example can be seen in Washington Irving's A History of the Life and Voyages of Christopher Columbus, a work of fiction and an historical train wreck that has managed to color our "knowledge" of Columbus since. The myth that Columbus set out to prove that the earth was round instead of flat? Irving made that up. Nobody with a basic education at the time doubted that the earth was round, it had been mathematically proven that the earth is round since the days of Eratosthenes around three hundred years before Christ--depictions of the earth throughout the middle ages show it as a globe. Columbus, in fact, believed that the earth was much smaller than it actually was, and so was confident that he could reach India by sailing West (nobody doubted that one could theoretically reach India by sailing West, it's just that the trip was suicidal); after asking several European monarchs he finally was given three ships and a crew by Ferdinand and Isabella of Spain--his trip would have ended up in disaster if he didn't just happen to bump into the Americas on accident. Also, the popular narrative of Columbus presents him as a valiant hero--but valiant hero he wasn't, he was cruel tyrant who brutally raped and murdered the indigenous peoples, the things he did, recorded and testified to by even people who loved him, are acts so heinous that they could be put into one of the Saw movies. Columbus, his brothers, and his men would test the sharpness of their knives by slicing the flesh off of the natives, in one incident two young native boys had parrots, the Spaniards took the parrots, and then beheaded the children--for fun.

Why was Columbus chosen? Probably because early Americans didn't want to honor English explorers, such as Cabot.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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Albion

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It may be that the teacher meant that there is a lot of history being taught that is treated in a superficial way (especially in junior and senior high schools) and is, therefore, inaccurate. That wouldn't be what I'd call "fake" history but more like popular history.

I can imagine that many teachers, given the difficulties they are facing in the classrooms these days, feel that the students come in knowing so little of even the basics of their history that the nuts and bolts have to be gotten across to them before there's any chance of dealing with the gray areas.
 
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joshua 1 9

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There is a great deal more to history than dates and places, and one of the most important issues in history is to understand why things happened. It is when we understand the why that we may begin to learn the lesson of history. The challenge for us is that generally there will be more than one version of the why.
I am reading the paradigm and he does attempt to discuss the why of how God works in the past, present and future. He spends to little time on the point of the story and to much time trying to draw comparisons that I am not sure are even there.
 
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