Extinction Level Event in Revelation 1:7

[timewerx]

Jesus comes with the clouds in Revelation 1:7

Everyone will see Him but everyone will 'mourn'. If you look at other translations, it says, 'wail', 'lament'. It's very very sad event like someone you loved most in the world just died.

If over half of the world's population are Christians, it doesn't make sense. The world should be celebrating, not wailing like someone very close to you just died, it doesn't make any sense!!

What if the vision in Revelation 1:7 was something a lot more ominous like literally, the end of humanity itself?

I just watched the move "Don't Look Up" and Jennifer Lawrence's reaction when they figured what's about to happen is the kind of reaction I pictured in my mind when I read Revelation 1:7

It may have something to do with the 'clouds'. They may not be typical clouds you see in the sky but something far more lethal like the cloud produced by a very large and powerful explosion. Would the 'clouds' be due to a very large impact event such as caused by an asteroid or comet or possibly due to nuclear Armageddon?

Whatever it is, the Lord's coming will seem to bring fatal blow to humanity if everyone would be wailing out of incredible sorrow.

 

[keras]

Whatever it is, the Lord's coming will seem to bring fatal blow to humanity if everyone would be wailing out of incredible sorrow.

I won't be.
The Day of the Lord's glorious Return will be one of rejoicing for all who love Him.

Maybe you are mixing it up with the terrible Day the Lord sends His fiery wrath? Even then; we Christians are Promised protection, we must call upon the name of the Lord and we will be saved. Joel 2:32, Romans 10:13, Acts 2:21

 

[Tolworth John]

f over half of the world's population are Christians, it doesn't make sense. The world should be celebrating, not wailing like someone very close to you just died, it doesn't make any sense!!

Two replies.
1/ not every one who calls themselves Christian is Christian, so your count of Christians is likely to be wrong.
2/ even if your count is correct 50% of the worlds population has suddenly realised they are wrong and are frighten about that, but also totally terrified by the sight of the returning glorified Jesus and the host of angels and christians following him.

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

If over half of the world's population are Christians, it doesn't make sense. The world should be celebrating, not wailing like someone very close to you just died, it doesn't make any sense!!

Born again Christians will be with Lord Jesus when He comes.

 

[grafted branch]

Jesus comes with the clouds in Revelation 1:7

Everyone will see Him but everyone will 'mourn'. If you look at other translations, it says, 'wail', 'lament'. It's very very sad event like someone you loved most in the world just died.

If over half of the world's population are Christians, it doesn't make sense. The world should be celebrating, not wailing like someone very close to you just died, it doesn't make any sense!!

What if the vision in Revelation 1:7 was something a lot more ominous like literally, the end of humanity itself?

I just watched the move "Don't Look Up" and Jennifer Lawrence's reaction when they figured what's about to happen is the kind of reaction I pictured in my mind when I read Revelation 1:7

It may have something to do with the 'clouds'. They may not be typical clouds you see in the sky but something far more lethal like the cloud produced by a very large and powerful explosion. Would the 'clouds' be due to a very large impact event such as caused by an asteroid or comet or possibly due to nuclear Armageddon?

Whatever it is, the Lord's coming will seem to bring fatal blow to humanity if everyone would be wailing out of incredible sorrow.

It’s the tribes of the earth that mourn.

It’s my understanding that Gentiles are never referred to as tribes, so it’s only Israel that mourns.

 

[Lost Witness]

It’s the tribes of the earth that mourn.

It’s my understanding that Gentiles are never referred to as tribes, so it’s only Israel that mourns.

the body of Christ has become part of Israel.
We're all grafted onto the tree after being born again of the spirit.

 

[3 Resurrections]

the body of Christ has become part of Israel.
We're all grafted onto the tree after being born again of the spirit.

The tribes that were to be doing that mourning in Revelation 1:7 are specifically said to be "they who pierced Him". This was the one generation of ethnic tribes of Israel whose leaders had called down a blood curse on themselves and their own children. THEY were the "betrayers and murderers" of the Messiah they crucified who were to be mourning when they saw Christ's return.

 

[grafted branch]

the body of Christ has become part of Israel.
We're all grafted onto the tree after being born again of the spirit.

The 144,000 are distinguished by their tribes. Would you say the 144,000 could all be Gentiles with no specific linage?

 

[timewerx]

It’s my understanding that Gentiles are never referred to as tribes, so it’s only Israel that mourns.

I don't think this is the case.

In Revelation 1:7, the root Greek word used for tribe "phulé" is not exclusive to Israel and even Greek root word for Earth 'gé' is not exclusive to Israel either.

The only word for 'tribe' that is possibly exclusive to Israel is the Hebrew "šiḇ·ṭê " which has a quite different meaning to the Greek "phulé".

Revelation 1:7 is clearly referring to everyone, including Gentiles and also including Israel and even the 'chosen' ones and the saved.

If even the saved will mourn / wail in sorrow, it can only be one thing - yes, the loss or potential of our loved ones and what could make that happen on a global scale? An extinction level event.

 

[timewerx]

I won't be.
The Day of the Lord's glorious Return will be one of rejoicing for all who love Him.

Maybe you are mixing it up with the terrible Day the Lord sends His fiery wrath? Even then; we Christians are Promised protection, we must call upon the name of the Lord and we will be saved. Joel 2:32, Romans 10:13, Acts 2:21

If the Lord is simply returning, I'd be rejoicing too.

However, at the prospect of watching your unsaved loved ones perish and all the marks of humanity wiped out in that fateful day, I'd be mourning too.

Jesus wept for the people because He saw what's coming to them. In that Day, we might just see what Jesus saw and it will be a time of great sorrow indeed.

 

[grafted branch]

I don't think this is the case.

In Revelation 1:7, the root Greek word used for tribe "phulé" is not exclusive to Israel and even Greek root word for Earth 'gé' is not exclusive to Israel either.

The only word for 'tribe' that is possibly exclusive to Israel is the Hebrew "šiḇ·ṭê " which has a quite different meaning to the Greek "phulé".

Revelation 1:7 is clearly referring to everyone, including Gentiles and also including Israel and even the 'chosen' ones and the saved.

If even the saved will mourn / wail in sorrow, it can only be one thing - yes, the loss or potential of our loved ones and what could make that happen on a global scale? An extinction level event.

Do you know of any verses that use the word phule <5443> to clearly describe Gentiles or non-Jews?

 

[DavidPT]

Do you know of any verses that use the word phule <5443> to clearly describe Gentiles or non-Jews?

Unfortunately, the following raises more questions rather than actually answering any questions.

What I find confusing about the way some interpreters go about interpreting things, is the following.

Zechariah 12:10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.
11 In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon.
12 And the land shall mourn, every family apart; the family of the house of David apart, and their wives apart; the family of the house of Nathan apart, and their wives apart;
13 The family of the house of Levi apart, and their wives apart; the family of Shimei apart, and their wives apart;
14 All the families that remain, every family apart, and their wives apart.


Matthew 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Revelation 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.


One thing these passages have in common, they all involve tribes mourning someone, that someone meaning Jesus. The former and latter even go as far as to indicate it involves the ones that pierced Him. Yet, these interpreters I have in mind here, insist that the former is involving the first century pertaining to His death, and that the remaining two passages are involving His 2nd coming in the future. When I, and maybe you as well, would think all 3 passages are involving the same events.

IOW, whatever one is applying the 2nd and 3rd passage to, in order to be consistent, they should be applying that to the first passage as well.

 

[keras]

If the Lord is simply returning, I'd be rejoicing too.

However, at the prospect of watching your unsaved loved ones perish and all the marks of humanity wiped out in that fateful day, I'd be mourning too.

Jesus wept for the people because He saw what's coming to them. In that Day, we might just see what Jesus saw and it will be a time of great sorrow indeed.

Matthew 24:29-30 and Revelation 15:1 make it clear that all the wrath of God is over before the glorious Return.
Jesus will go to Armageddon, [65 miles from Jerusalem] and destroy the armies there by the Sword of His Word, a little time before He Appears. First - Revelation 16:16-18, then - Revelation 19:11

 

[grafted branch]

Unfortunately, the following raises more questions rather than actually answering any questions.

What I find confusing about the way some interpreters go about interpreting things, is the following.

Zechariah 12:10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.
11 In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon.
12 And the land shall mourn, every family apart; the family of the house of David apart, and their wives apart; the family of the house of Nathan apart, and their wives apart;
13 The family of the house of Levi apart, and their wives apart; the family of Shimei apart, and their wives apart;
14 All the families that remain, every family apart, and their wives apart.


Matthew 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Revelation 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.


One thing these passages have in common, they all involve tribes mourning someone, that someone meaning Jesus. The former and latter even go as far as to indicate it involves the ones that pierced Him. Yet, these interpreters I have in mind here, insist that the former is involving the first century pertaining to His death, and that the remaining two passages are involving His 2nd coming in the future. When I, and maybe you as well, would think all 3 passages are involving the same events.

IOW, whatever one is applying the 2nd and 3rd passage to, in order to be consistent, they should be applying that to the first passage as well.

Yea, I agree it all has to fit and make sense regardless of whether one thinks it is still future or it has already happened.

 

[parousia70]

If Revelation 1:7 is an "Extinction Level Event", then so was 2 Samuel 22:8-16

 

[DavidPT]

Yea, I agree it all has to fit and make sense regardless of whether one thinks it is still future or it has already happened.

To be fair to these interpreters I had in mind, one thing that needs to be pointed out though, something that just came to mind, is this.

Zechariah 12:9 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.
10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.
11 In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon.
12 And the land shall mourn, every family apart; the family of the house of David apart, and their wives apart; the family of the house of Nathan apart, and their wives apart;
13 The family of the house of Levi apart, and their wives apart; the family of Shimei apart, and their wives apart;
14 All the families that remain, every family apart, and their wives apart.

Matthew 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Revelation 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.


Something else the 2nd and 3rd passage have in common is that both involve a coming. As pertaining to the first passage, no coming is even mentioned. So maybe these interpreters I have in mind are within reason after all, to interpret the first passage to not be involving the same events the last 2 passages are. Unless one can prove, though no coming is mentioned in the first passage, that it still implies a coming, regardless.

When Christ went to the cross, that did not involve a coming. when Christ returns in the end of this age, that obviously involves a coming. This at least tells us that the last 2 passages are not involving events pertaining to the first century and His death, which is already obvious to most of us to begin with, though it might not be obvious to Preterists.

Speaking of Preterists. If they take the first passage to be involving Christ's death, and then also take the other 2 passages to be involving the same events, how does that make sense if they are applying Matthew 24:30 to that of 70 AD?

 

[grafted branch]

Speaking of Preterists. If they take the first passage to be involving Christ's death, and then also take the other 2 passages to be involving the same events, how does that make sense if they are applying Matthew 24:30 to that of 70 AD?

I think most preterits would say there was a coming in 70AD. I think that coming also involved the revealing of the Son of man in Luke 17:30.

Israel is blind in part until the fullness of the Gentiles. When the blindness is removed Israel recognizes Jesus as the Messiah or the Son of man is revealed.

Speculating here, I think Zechariah 12:6 is referring to New Jerusalem when it says Jerusalem shall be inhabited again in her own place, even in Jerusalem. So those who have come to the heavenly Jerusalem are the ones who have grace and supplication in Zechariah 12:10; those in earthly Jerusalem mourn, they didn’t flee when they saw the AOD (or Jerusalem surrounded by armies) and once the Son of man is revealed they then recognize their plight because the blindness has been lifted.

 

[Matt5]

I think the problem is this:

Massive Demonic Presence on Earth Before Jesus Returns | Christian Forums

I'm talking full planetary takeover by demons. The Antichrist and fake Jesus (false prophet) will be demons in human form. Apparently, demons called Jinn (pl), Jinni (sing), aka genies will help to spread the religion of demons around the world. The mark of the beast will wipe out all Christians.

There Are No Christians When Jesus Returns | Christian Forums

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

I think the problem is this:

Massive Demonic Presence on Earth Before Jesus Returns | Christian Forums

I'm talking full planetary takeover by demons. The Antichrist and fake Jesus (false prophet) will be demons in human form. Apparently, demons called Jinn (pl), Jinni (sing), aka genies will help to spread the religion of demons around the world. The mark of the beast will wipe out all Christians.

There Are No Christians When Jesus Returns | Christian Forums

 

[timewerx]

I think the problem is this:

Massive Demonic Presence on Earth Before Jesus Returns | Christian Forums

I'm talking full planetary takeover by demons. The Antichrist and fake Jesus (false prophet) will be demons in human form. Apparently, demons called Jinn (pl), Jinni (sing), aka genies will help to spread the religion of demons around the world. The mark of the beast will wipe out all Christians.

There Are No Christians When Jesus Returns | Christian Forums

They're already here. They come with gold chains around their necks and travel around in Lamborghinis.