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Featured Everything I see convinces me Emmanuel Macron is the antichrist

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by IfThePuzzleFits, Sep 24, 2017.

  1. Revealing Times

    Revealing Times Well-Known Member

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    And you say Islam because its just a GUESS? Even though we are told in Scriptures exactly where the last BEAST arises from. Why not just read Dan. ch. 7 and ch. 8 and understand its a European Beast or Little Horn instead of going with a guessing game? You understand the basic premise then go off track on the very last and most important subject.

    You seem to hedge suggesting you are not sure who the Seventh Beast is. So that' is better than being totally wrong on the subject.

    Now you fall off the track BIGLY, the 8th King is a Demon Spirit named Apollyn, it has nothing to do with a FUTURE MAN, that is the Seventh Beast Head. Its the Little Horn. It has nothing to do with the Revival of 5 Fallen Kings/Empires, where do you get this stuff? Babylon will NEVER BE REBUILT, unless Scriptures LIE !!

    You take a METAPHOR for Governance under Satan, the STATUE, the WHOLE WORLD and you actually think a City called Babylon is going to be Rebuilt. Sub Babylon with WORLD GOVERNMENTS. The whole world gets hit with Gods plagues, not ONE CITY !!
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2017
  2. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Christ in the bible equates to messiah. "The" messiah, means a special anointed King of Israel to lead the Jews and the world into the messianic age of peace and safety. Jesus was the one, God sent to be their King of Israel , but he was rejected by the Jews.

    Mark 15:32 Let Christ the King of Israel descend now from the cross, that we may see and believe. And they that were crucified with him reviled him.

    John 12:13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

    The person to become the Antichrist must be anointed the King of Israel. The Antichrist is not the king of Babylon. There is no reason for the person to want to rebuild babylon.
     
  3. Revealing Times

    Revealing Times Well-Known Member

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    And they do not need to be called a WOE, (Even though they are, you just miss it) Common sense tells us if Woe number one is the 5th Trumpet, and Woe number two is the 6th Trumpet that Woe number three is the Seventh Trumpet. God is symmetrical. But of course you want Satan being cast down to be a WOE without a Trumpet sounding, which make no sense at all. Just because the passage says woe is the earth doesn't mean this is the third Woe. If you had your time line correct you would/could not get this wrong.

    Daniel 12:1-2 tells you when Michael stands up [and casts Satan out]. The Woman FLEES For 1260 Days. And the Dragon is chasing her..........LOGICAL QUESTION DOUG.........If the Dragon chases the Woman (Israel) for 1260 Days how is he cast Down PAST THE MIDWAY POINT? You are gong to have a hard time explaining this brother unless you yield to the truth the Holy Spirit is showing us via the Scriptures. This Means Satan is CAST DOWN at the Midway point just like I stated, its OBVIOUS why God is using 1260 Days/42 months/middle of the week over and over and over.....Hes trying to drill it into our heads !!

    So the Dragon chases the Woman who THEN (AFTERWARDS) is protected by God for 1260 Days, that means that the Dragon HAS TO BE CAST OUT AT THE MIDWAY POINT !! There is no other explanation. He is cast out during the very FIRST SEAL. Now rethink/recalculate your end time theory, because Satan is on earth for AT LEAST 1260 Days at the END TIME PERIOD.

    You just don't get it do you? God can use the word woe without it being one of the three woes !! This absolutely boggles my mind brother. 5th Trumpet = 1st Woe, 6th Trumpet = 2nd Woe and the 7th Trumpet will be...WILL BE...the 3rd Woe.

    The SEVENTH SEAL is all 7 Trumpets, LIKEWISE, the Seventh Trumpet is all 7 VIALS, thus the 3rd Woe is all SEVEN VIALS of Gods Wrath. Everyone knows this. Look up charts. Its common knowledge.

    You allow ONE WORD, a WOE in chapter 12 to throw your whole timeline off. Satan is on earth for ALL THREE WOES in my timeline.

    Same person, its a MAN....He only becomes the BEAST when he Conquers Jerusalem, hes the Anti-Christ FOR THE full seven years or do you deny he is ANTI CHRIST in nature ? You see the point? He is not indwelt by some entity, he is a MAN.

    And he is never the King of Israel, you repeating that isn't going to change it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2017
  4. Revealing Times

    Revealing Times Well-Known Member

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    WRONG....That's just how you see it Doug. He is never the King of Israel, scriptures tell you that.
     
  5. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    There is not a disagreement on that in blue.

    The fact is that the 7 vials are not called a woe. Satan being cast down is.
    A trumpet does sound associated with Satan being cast down - but you are not getting it. The seventh trumpet sounds, and the kingdoms of this world are taken from Satan, as he and his angels are cast out of the second heaven down to earth, their dominion taken away.

    Start using what the actual text says in Revelation 12:6. She doesn't flee for 1260 days. Nor does it say the Dragon is chasing her. The 1260 days is the amount of time they feed her.

    6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

    The Jews are in the wilderness, signifying that many of the Jews are in the nations, and that the Jews are that time will be in spiritual wilderness for most of the first half, believing that the Antichrist is the messiah, not believing in Jesus.

    For 1260 days the two witnesses will be warning the Jews about the Antichrist and not to trust in him. Of that time, the last 75 days, the Jews will be fleeing to the mountains, because said false messiah will have betrayed them, and become the beast.

    The two witnesses are killed on day 1260, day 1263.5 they come back to life, ascend - and the 7th trumpet sounds. Then in Revelation 12:7-12 is the war in in heaven, Satan and his angels cast down, the third woe.
    You are the one who is not getting it. No one is arguing against that the 7th trumpet announces the third woe.

    The seventh trumpet sounds, and the kingdoms of this world are taken from Satan, as he and his angels are cast out of the second heaven down to earth, their dominion taken away.

    No the 3rd woe is not the seven vials. The 3rd woe is a woe, Satan being cast down to earth, having great wrath. When he is cast down to earth, he has a time, times, half time left - basically the second half of the 7 years.

    When the 7th trumpet sounds a number of things take place. Of those things, that which is called a woe is Satan and his angels cast down to earth.

    Revelation 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

    It is not just one word "woe" and it throws your whole timeline off.

    "Woe to the inhabiters of the earth" in both Revelation 8:13 and Revelation 12:12

    Barack Obama was once a Senator. Then quit being a Senator and became President. Being Senator does equal being President. Being the Antichrist does not equal being the beast.

    Think of how stupid (perhaps there is a better choice of words) it would sound if a news reporter at a presidential press conference addressed the President of the United States as "Senator". That's what you are doing.

    Until you understand what the term "christ" means - as being the promised great King of Israel - you are not going to understand what the term (Anti)christ means.
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2017
  6. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Jesus is never the King of Israel? Jesus came in the name of the Lord. Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

    John 12:13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.


    John 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

    AntiChrist = illegitimate King of Israel.
     
  7. Revealing Times

    Revealing Times Well-Known Member

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    Satan is cast down at the VERY FIRST SEAL...PROOF !!! BELOW !!

    Rev. 12:13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman (Israel) which brought forth the man child.

    14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time (1260 DAYS !!), from the face of the serpent

    So the Dragon chases the Woman Israel, and she then is Protected BY GOD for 1260 Days. How many days are in SEVEN YEARS Doug? 2520 days. What is the MID WAY POINT of 2520 Days Doug? Is it not 1260 Days? Thus Satan is cast out at the MID WAY POINT of the Tribulation. I am not just telling you things I have not calculated !! I do not just guess brother.

    Everything in Revelation revolves around chapter 6 which is the MIDWAY POINT of the Tribulation.

    As per the SEVENTH TRUMPET bringing in the Third Woe which is the SEVEN VIALS. Lets see if the Seventh Seal is the SVEN TRUMPETS !!

    Rev. 8:1 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour. 2 And I saw the seven angels which stood before God; and to them were given seven trumpets. 3 And another angel came and stood at the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given unto him much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne. 4 And the smoke of the incense, which came with the prayers of the saints, ascended up before God out of the angel's hand. 5 And the angel took the censer, and filled it with fire of the altar, and cast it into the earth: and there were voices, and thunderings, and lightnings, and an earthquake. 6 And the seven angels which had the seven trumpets prepared themselves to sound.

    So the SEVENTH SEAL is the SEVEN TRUMPETS. Now lets look at the Seventh Trumpet in proper ORDER instead of out of order.

    Rev. 11:14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly. 15 And the seventh angel sounded; (FROM HERE) and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. 16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God, 17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned. 18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth. 19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail. (TO HERE is like a soliloquy in Heaven, being uttered by the Hosts of Heaven !!)

    Lets redo this without the soliloquy, and with the very next chapter in PROPER SEQUENCE.

    Rev. 11:14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly. 15 And the seventh angel sounded;..........REV. 15:1 And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God.

    OR...........REV. 16:1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth.

    The SEVENTH TRUMPET brings fort the SEVEN LAST VIALS, just like the Seven Seals bring forth the Seven Trumpets !! Do not go to Rev. 12, it is not the proper sequence.

    Notice it says the THIRD WOE COMETH QUICKLY, then it says the SEVENTH TRUMPET Sounded !! Do you not get that the Seventh Trumpet is the Third Woe? And just like the Seventh Seal it is ALL THE VIALS, thus the Seven Vials are the THIRD WOE.

    NOPE....He is cast out at the MIDWAY POINT....You have to stop seeing Rev. ch 12 as following Rev. ch. 11.

    Rev. 1, 2 and 3 go together. Rev. 4, 5, 7 and 19 go together. And Rev. 6, 8, 9, 11, 15 and 16 are in their own ORDER. 1/2/3 in their own order......4/5/7/19 in their own order......Rev. 6/8/9/11/15/16 in their own order.
     
  8. Bible2+

    Bible2+ Matthew 4:4

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    Are you thinking of Isaiah 13?

    If so, note that the city of Babylon referred to in Isaiah 13 (verses 1,19) isn't the ancient city of Babylon, just as it isn't the symbolic (and worldwide) "Babylon" of Revelation chapters 17-18. Instead, it's only the present-day, literal city of Babylon which already exists in Iraq, and which the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") will transform into his world capital during the future Tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24.

    In Isaiah 13:3 the "sanctified ones" who "rejoice in [YHWH's] highness" are the obedient people in the Church in Revelation 19:7-8, after the future Tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24. They will be, in Isaiah 13:4-5, the "host of the battle" from "heaven", when they physically descend from the sky (the 1st heaven) with Jesus Christ as He alone wages war against the world's armies at His physical return from heaven (Revelation 19:14-21). So in Isaiah 13:6,9 the "day of the Lord" is the same as the future, Second-Coming Day of the Lord (1 Corinthians 1:7-8; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8; 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10).

    Isaiah 13:10,13 refers to the same, future, Second-Coming time as Matthew 24:29-31 and Revelation 19:15.

    Isaiah 13:11 refers to Jesus' defeat of the world's armies at His Second Coming (Revelation 19:19-21, Zechariah 14:3-21).

    Isaiah 13:16 refers not to what Jesus or the Church will do, but to what some unsaved "Medes" (Isaiah 13:17-18) will do to the inhabitants of the city of Babylon at the time of Jesus' Second Coming. By "Medes" is meant the native inhabitants of that part of the Middle East which in ancient times was called "Media" and is now in northwestern Iran. The Kurds who now live there, and in surrounding areas, claim to be the descendants of the ancient Medes.

    In Isaiah 13:17 the "Medes" aren't the ancient Medes who conquered the ancient city of Babylon (Daniel 5:28,31). For the ancient Medes didn't make the ancient city of Babylon uninhabited (Isaiah 13:19-22) when they defeated it, but instead kept it as a thriving city which continued on for centuries.

    In Isaiah 13:19-22 the total and eternal destruction of the city of Babylon (in Iraq) has never been fulfilled. For Saddam Hussein rebuilt the city of Babylon (using bricks he inscribed with "built by Saddam Hussein, son of Nebuchadnezzar"). And after his defeat, U.S. forces built a military base in Babylon. And in the future, the Antichrist will transform the city of Babylon into his world capital. Isaiah 13:19-22 won't be fulfilled until this city is destroyed at Jesus Christ's future, Second Coming.
     
  9. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Does the 1260 days in Revelation 12:6 in the text come before or after the war in heaven which Satan and his angels are cast down in Revelation 12:7-12?

    1260 days + 3 1/2 days + the earth time for the war in heaven + the time, times, half times = the 7 years.
     
  10. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    The seven trumpets - all of them collectively were not called a woe.

    Neither are the vials called a woe. None of the vials individually are called a woe.

    What is called a woe - the third woe in Revelation is Satan being cast down to earth.

    Click on this link for the woes in Revelation:

    WOE IN THE BIBLE
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2017
  11. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Again, for the umpteenth time, I agree the Seventh trumpet announces the third woe.

    RT, the seven trumpets are a not called a woe. It is only the last three of the seven trumpets that announce the three woes.

    The Seven vials are not called a woe. And none of the seven vials individually are called a woe.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2017
  12. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Revelation 12:7-12 is in proper sequence. The war in heaven follows directly the 1260 days of Revelation 12:6, which is the testimony time of the two witnesses.

    Following the 1263.5 days in Revelation 11, the seven trumpet sounds - which immediately there is the war in heaven and Satan cast down, and his dominion over the nations taken away.

    The seventh seal leads into all the trumpets - yes. But all of the trumpets were not woes.

    The seventh trumpet leads into all the vials - yes, among other things. None of the vials, collectively or individually, are called a woe though.
     
  13. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    I have been saying all along that Satan is cast down to earth midway (not exactly the midpoint, but close) of the seven years.

    1260 days (Revelation 11:3, 12:6) is the first half. Satan then cast down. The time, times, half times is the second half.

    7 years
    1260 days (Revelation 11:3, 12:6) = first half, first half ends...
    then the 7th trumpet sounds and Satan cast down, Revelation 12:7-12
    the time, times, half times (Revelation 12:14) = second half
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2017
  14. Bible2+

    Bible2+ Matthew 4:4

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    After.

    For regarding the 1,260 days, and "a time, and times, and half a time", and 42 months, they're all the same time period in the prophecies of Revelation 12:6,14, Revelation 13:5, Revelation 11:2-3, Daniel 7:25 and Daniel 12:7. They will be 1,260 literal days, just as, for example, the 3 days in the fulfilled prophecies of Luke 9:22 and Luke 18:33 were literal days, and the 3 days in the fulfilled prophecies of Genesis 40:13 and Genesis 40:19 were literal days; and the 70 years in the fulfilled prophecy of Jeremiah 29:10 (Daniel 9:2) were literal years (Zechariah 7:5), and the 400 years in the fulfilled prophecy of Genesis 15:13 were literal years.

    The literal 1,260-day time period will be the time of the Antichrist's Luciferian/Satanic worldwide reign of terror (Revelation 13:4-18, Revelation 12:9), which time period is shown from 4 different angles in Revelation chapters 11 to 14 (Revelation 11:2b-3, Revelation 12:6,14, Revelation 13:5,7, Revelation 14:9-13). The myriad details of these chapters have never been fulfilled, not even during a past time period of 1,260 years, as historicism mistakenly claims. But these details must be fulfilled (Revelation 1:1). So they will be fulfilled in our future, after the also-never-fulfilled details of Revelation chapters 6 to 10 are fulfilled in our future.

    It's sometime claimed that Revelation 12:7-12 happened thousands of years ago. But the truth is it hasn't happened yet, but is part of the things which must be hereafter (Revelation 4:1b).

    Just as what the apostle John saw in Revelation 4:2-11 are literal things in heaven, so what he saw in Revelation 12:7-9 is a literal, future, mid-tribulation war in heaven, between the archangel Michael and his angels on the one hand, and Satan and his angels on the other, resulting in Satan and his angels being defeated and cast down to the earth permanently (Revelation 12:8-9,12-13).

    Revelation 12:7-9 shows Michael and his angels are more powerful than Satan and his angels. But this doesn't mean Satan won't be able to deceive the world (Revelation 12:9) into thinking he and his angels (with the help of a united mankind) will be able to defeat YHWH and His army (Revelation 16:14, Revelation 19:19).
     
  15. jgr

    jgr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Partial list of Reformation historicists:

    John Wycliffe, John Hus, Jerome of Prague, Savonarola, Peter Waldo, Wessel Harmenz Gansfort, Theodore Beza, Martin Bucer, Heinrich Bullinger, Johannes Hus, John Calvin, Andreas von Carlstadt, Wolfgang Fabricius Capito, Martin Chemnitz, Thomas Cranmer, William Farel, Matthias Flacius, Caspar Hedio, Justus Jonas, John Knox, Jan Łaski, Martin Luther, Philipp Melanchthon,
    Johannes Oecolampadius, Peter Martyr, Aonio Paleario, Laurentius Petri, Olaus Petri, John Wycliffe,
    Jiří Třanovský, William Tyndale, Joachim Vadian, Pierre Viret, Primož Trubar, Huldrych Zwingli,
    John of Leiden, Thomas Müntzer, Kaspar Schwenkfeld, Sebastian Franck, Menno Simons, Hans Denck, Conrad Grebel, Balthasar Hubmaier, Felix Manz

    Feel free to provide your list of Reformation futurists.

    The papacy formally existed for 1260 years from 538 to 1798 AD. Daniel 7, 2 Thessalonians 2, John's epistles, Revelation 13, et al describe it. With the benefit of 20/20 historical prophetic hindsight, the Reformers got it right, even as they burned at the stake for proclaiming it.

    Futurism fantasizes. History realizes.
     
  16. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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  17. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    It is 1260 days, not years. The two witnesses testify for 1260 days... then are killed by the beast, come back to life 3 1/2 days after laying dead in the streets of Jerusalem, then ascend to heaven.

    There is not 1260 days in Daniel 7 - it is a time, times, half times.
    There is not 1260 days in Revelation 13 - it is 42 months.

    The 1260 days, the 42 months, the time, times, half times are not exact equivalents of each other, although close. The reason there are three different time expressions is to take into account specific actions of the 3 1/2 days and the earth time that passes for the war in heaven.
     
  18. jgr

    jgr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Based on the prophetic day-year principle of Ezekiel 4:5-6 and Luke 13:31-33.
     
  19. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    It is not a principle - to be applied everywhere in bible prophecy.

    The 1260 days, the 42 months, the time, times, half times are elements of the 70th shmittah cycle of Daniel 9:27.

    1260 days + 3.5 days + 1256.5 days (called 42 months) = the seven years.

    1. The 1260 days is the testimony of the two witnesses.
    2. 3.5 days their bodies lay dead in the streets of Jerusalem.
    3. The 42 months the beast rules unhampered by the two witnesses.

    Earth time passing for the war in heaven + the times, times, half times = the 42 months.

    1260 days are exactly half of the 7 years.
    42 months is a little less than 1260 days.
    in turn, the time, times, half times is a little less than the 42 months.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2017
  20. jgr

    jgr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Yes, not necessarily a prophetically universal principle. But the exact match with the lifespan of the papacy is well beyond coincidence in that instance.
     
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