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Evangelism

Discussion in 'Ask a Calvinist' started by Andrewn, Nov 24, 2021.

  1. Andrewn

    Andrewn Well-Known Member CF Ambassadors Supporter

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    The Reformed are some of the most active missionaries around the world. Why do they evangelize? Do they believe that some of those predestined to salvation may be lost if they're not evangelized?
     
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  2. The Righterzpen

    The Righterzpen Jesus is my Shield in any Desert or Storm

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    Personally, I don't have a fear that the elect will be lost. Evangelism is simply a matter of obedience. God told us to do it.
     
  3. Hammster

    Hammster Citizen of Covidstan. Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Because the reformed believe the words of Paul in Romans 10.


    How then will they call on Him in whom they have not believed? How will they believe in Him whom they have not heard? And how will they hear without a preacher? How will they preach unless they are sent? Just as it is written, “How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news of good things!”
    Romans 10:14-15
     
  4. Andrewn

    Andrewn Well-Known Member CF Ambassadors Supporter

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    This means that if the elect do not hear the Gospel preached they can lose their election and salvation, no?
     
  5. Hammster

    Hammster Citizen of Covidstan. Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    No. God ordains the means as well as the ends.
     
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  6. Andrewn

    Andrewn Well-Known Member CF Ambassadors Supporter

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    So, if a people does not hear the Gospel, it is because God ordained all of them to eternal hell.
     
  7. Aussie Pete

    Aussie Pete Well-Known Member Supporter

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    It's a conundrum. Spurgeon prayed that God would save his elect, and then elect some more. Of course this is nonsensical, but it shows Spurgeon cared about the lost. Fundamentally, we need to preach the gospel because Lord Jesus commanded us to do just that. Will the elect be saved if they do not hear the gospel? How could they not? Will God find another way to reach them? I don't know how it all works. I do know that we should preach Christ whenever we get the opportunity.
     
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  8. The Righterzpen

    The Righterzpen Jesus is my Shield in any Desert or Storm

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    There's also more than one witness to the reality of the Redemption plan in this world. Romans 1:19-20 talk about "the witness of creation" (so they are without excuse) is also a form of "preacher".

    A lot of people interpret "without excuse" as being a negative thing on the side of judgement. But it also means that they have not been left without a witness. The gospel is preached via the creation. "even His eternal Godhead and power..."

    Now obviously the "witness of creation" is in a type of parable and is not as detailed as written Scripture; but lack of exposure to written Scripture does not preclude someone from having their sin atoned for, because Christ is still faithful. As the "lamb slain from the foundation of the world"; yes, it is absolutely possible (and likely) that there are people who's sin He paid for, who lived in times and places that they'd never heard of Him.

    Romans 2:14-16 also talks about human conscience also being a witness because we're all still created in God's image. "Out of the mouth of two or three witnesses...." (the creation, the conscience, the Scripture)

    Think of natives who may have lived in North and South America during the days of King David. Those who appear with Christ in heaven in Revelation 7, are from "every kindred, tribe, tongue and nation". The proclamation of the gospel from the standpoint of written Scripture goes into all the world; but so does the proclamation of the gospel from the standpoint of the witness of creation and human conscience on account of being created in God's image.

    From the standpoint of linear time; I believe the people in Revelation 7 are those delivered from Sheol at the point Jesus died and the atonement was complete. He said to the thief "Today you will be with me in paradise." Well, apparently so were a bunch of other people "from every kindred, tribe, tongue and nation".
     
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  9. Andrewn

    Andrewn Well-Known Member CF Ambassadors Supporter

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    Right, and I agree with everything you wrote. But the unavoidable conclusion is that the Reformed cannot explain the commandment to preach the Gospel, which is repeated several times in the NT. You certainly do it out of obedience but it will not save anyone who would not be saved anyway.
     
  10. Hammster

    Hammster Citizen of Covidstan. Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    They were ordained to hell because of their sin.
     
  11. Hammster

    Hammster Citizen of Covidstan. Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Isn’t obedience enough? But besides that, I’m going to assume that you believe God to be omniscient. This means God knows who will be saved and who won’t. Yet you still proclaim the gospel to all, even though you know some won’t believe.
     
  12. Neostarwcc

    Neostarwcc We are saved purely by the work and grace of God. Supporter

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    The reason the Reformed and Christians for that matter evangelize is because Jesus commanded us to Evangelize. God cannot reach his lost sheep if Christians are not evangelizing. R.C. Sproul once said that Evangelism is a necessary part of the Christian life because evangelism reaches the Elect (nobody knows who the elect are so evangelize to all you meet)
     
  13. The Righterzpen

    The Righterzpen Jesus is my Shield in any Desert or Storm

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    The purpose of preaching the gospel is that being enlightened by the Scripture brings hope. Someone who has not the oral / written explanation of Scripture, will have a real hard time having assurance, because they have no measure against knowing whether or not they are interpreting the "witnesses" (creation and their conscience) rightly.

    "Rightly" in both a correct understanding, as well as the truth of surety of the atonement. Someone who's never heard the word isn't going to know for sure that the Redeemer has / (or would of times past) come and accomplish redemption.

    Preaching the gospel doesn't actually "save" anyone. It gives hope and assurance to those who question their understanding of the creation and whether or not their conscience can ever find any rest.

    This is correct. The gospel will not save anyone who's sin has not been atoned for. (Which atonement only applies to the elect.)

    This is a different matter altogether though than election unto salvation.

    I would not say the non-elect are "ordained to hell"; at least not in an opposing sense that the elect are ordained to redemption.

    "The wages of sin is death." Condemnation is a "wage earned" based on violation of law. I know a lot of people want to say that there are no "levels" of hell. And in a certain sense; I would agree with them. Yet in another sense, the "wages" any individual earns for committed sins is individually and righteously meted out, based on their transgression.

    It's also meted out based on the amount of knowledge they have; for "he who did not know the Master's will and didn't do it, will be beaten with few stripes; but he who knew the Master's will and did not obey will be beaten with many stripes." Luke 12:47-48

    The "Master's will" in this context has to do with exposure to written revelation of Scripture. There's also a caveat in this passage of committing transgressions worthy of stripes. Which is interesting. I haven't done a deep dive on that; so I'm not exactly sure what that means. I suspect it has something to do with deliberate violation of one's own God given conscience though.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2021
  14. BBAS 64

    BBAS 64 Contributor Supporter

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    The best book on the subject hands down:

    upload_2021-11-29_8-50-46.png
     
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  15. BBAS 64

    BBAS 64 Contributor Supporter

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    Good Day,

    “What Is the Motive for Evangelizing? There are, in fact, two motives that should spur us constantly to evangelize. The first is love of God and concern for his glory; the second is love of man and concern for his welfare.”
    ― J.I. Packer, Evangelism & the Sovereignty of God
     
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