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Eucharist required for salvation?

Discussion in 'One Bread, One Body - Catholic' started by Hoonbaba, Nov 23, 2002.

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  1. Lynn

    Lynn Veteran

    +99
    Catholic
    Married
    US-Republican

    yah, right
     
  2. cleon

    cleon New Member

    59
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    Lynn, what seeds of discension are you talking about?? If I tell you the truth, am I become your enemy?? Do you not love the Truth?? Jesus said "I am the Truth", He is the Word of God and He has given us His word that we may live by it...
     
  3. Lynn

    Lynn Veteran

    +99
    Catholic
    Married
    US-Republican
    I do love the truth, and that truth is found in the faith that I have. That faith is in God and I worship God through the Catholic Church. I found my home in the Church after years of study and prayer. It is not your place to question my faith or the way I worship. It is between God and me.
     
  4. kern

    kern Miserere Nobis

    +7
    Catholic
    :D :D :D :D LOL! Thanks, I needed that.

    But seriously, the One Bread One Body forum is not, and I repeat not the place to debate whether or not Catholic teaching are valid.

    And Christian Forums is not a place to convert Catholics. Your behavior in this thread, if continued, will result in warning and an eventual ban.

    -Chris
     
  5. dignitized

    dignitized Well-Known Member

    +724
    cleon: your a jack chick fan that much is obvious
     
  6. dignitized

    dignitized Well-Known Member

    +724
    EVERY Christian prior to reformation , orthodox and heretic alike ALL agreed upon at least this one thing - the Eucharist. Only the Apostate gnostics openly denied the real presence of God in the Eucharist. What more, of the first reformers - only the Calvinists and especially the violent and noxious KNOX denied it. There is a great deal of Justice in the fact that Knox's grave has been paved over and a parking lot placed over top of him.
     
  7. cleon

    cleon New Member

    59
    +0
    Kern, I read the title, and it said "Discussion on Catholic Beliefs"... I do know them very well, I was a Catholic for 30 years. I have all the Catechisms, Vatican 11, The Council of Trent, etc, etc., I am not ignorant, I only wish to do what Jesus Comands me to do.

    John 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed

    I am very disturbed when I see those who name the name of Christ deny Him by their deeds and words. Listen to what Paul said about these last days:

    "Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables." (2Timothy 4:2-4)

    It is urgent at this last hour that we take heed to the "word".
     
  8. Lynn

    Lynn Veteran

    +99
    Catholic
    Married
    US-Republican

    [​IMG] oh my gosh, when I first glanced at this, Br. Max I thought you said something about jack s ** t. I almost fell off my chair!!!

    lynn
     
  9. kern

    kern Miserere Nobis

    +7
    Catholic
    cleon: You should have read the rules which are permanently posted at the top of the board. One Bread One Body is primarily for discussion among Catholics. You are probably looking for the Interfaith Discussion (or whatever it's called now, it's under the OBOB forum on the list).

    Even there, you won't be able to accuse the Catholic church of apostasy and say that we deny God's words.

    lynn: heh, considering a lot of what Jack Chick teaches is ****, it seems an appropriate confusion. :)
     
  10. cleon

    cleon New Member

    59
    +0
    Max, I cannot speak for Luther, Knox, Calvin, they are all dead and gone. All I know that when Jesus said "This IS my body" He was standing there in His body. Just like when He said "The seed IS the word of God", He was speaking symbolically. It does not matter what church councils have taught, or men may think to be true but "What Saith the Scriptures". If that governs not our life we are doomed to deception. This is the first thing that Jesus said when the disciples asked Him, What shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world" ..... "Watch and see that thou be not decieved"
     
  11. cleon

    cleon New Member

    59
    +0
    Kern: I did not post the question "Eucharist required for salvation?" THis is what the catholic church teaches, I have the popes latest catechism, I can point it out to you, but how do you explain this to the thief on the cross, who was neither baptised or confirmed, to whom Christ said, "today shall ye be with me in Paradise" Hallelujah for the promises of Christ. I am saved.

    Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost
     
  12. dignitized

    dignitized Well-Known Member

    +724
    cleon: when Jesus said this is my body he was standing there holding the bread in his hands. and was not referring to himself but to the bread. that is QUITE clear in the reading of the text. He was not speaking symbolically. he was speaking literally. what more, if you would get a Greek NT and read through the passages in John 6, specifically verse 53 you will see that the language used is VERY literal. AND, if that is not enough :), look at how he begins the passage. When He is about to reveal a great spiritual truth he always began the same way - TRULY TRULY and that just happens to be how he starts john 6:53.
     
  13. dignitized

    dignitized Well-Known Member

    +724
    cleon: name your church
     
  14. kern

    kern Miserere Nobis

    +7
    Catholic
    Such a question is fine -- that's not the same thing as calling Catholics apostates.

    1. The Pope does not write the Catechism
    2. The Catholic Church does not teach that Eucharist is required to be saved. You have misinterpreted the passage.

    Ah yes, the usual free-for-all where one misconception about the Catholic church after another is tossed out.

    The thief had what was called "baptism by desire" -- if he had lived he surely would have been baptised, but he did not have the opportunity. The only time "baptism is necessary for salvation" is ever an issue is if someone tries to join the Catholic church but for some reason refuses to be baptised. I don't imagine this happens very often.

    -Chris
     
  15. cleon

    cleon New Member

    59
    +0
    Max, read the whole context: 47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.
    48 I am that bread of life.

    The bread of life is the word of God that man shall live thereby. Jesus said "It is the spirit that quickeneth (gives life); the flesh profiteth nothing: the WORDS that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are LIFE." v. 63

    “Thy words were found, and I did eat them; and thy word was unto me the joy and rejoicing of mine heart” (Jeremiah 15:16). “How sweet are thy words unto my taste! Yea, sweeter than honey to my mouth!” (Psalm 119:103).
     
  16. cleon

    cleon New Member

    59
    +0
    Max, I do not have a church, but Christ is building a church that I am a member thereof.

    Ephesians chapter 2 states: 19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
    20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
    21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
    22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.
     
  17. dignitized

    dignitized Well-Known Member

    +724
    cleon: I know the whole context. Christ is the bread of LIFE and he shows us in the LAST SUPPER what exactly he ment by saying that he was the bread of life
     
  18. Preachers12

    Preachers12 Unworthy

    887
    +30
    Catholic
    Peace be with you,

    I am still learning to navigate the boards here and only now realized that there were many other posts after my own.  I appreciate the welcome and enjoyed the reading.

    I quoted the above only because I thought to respond to some of the issues addressed by Cleon.  I personally don't see them as attacking or seeking converts, rather they present a wonderful opportunity for an open dialog on what is a fundamental difference between Catholicism and Christianity.  As I understand Chris, though, perhaps this is the inappropriate forum for such a discussion.   I also believe that to properly address Cleon's issues would require delving into other areas outside of the captioned heading.

    Being new, I certainly don't want to start off by breaking rules. With that said, will this discussion be permitted here?

    God Bless and Stay Safe
     
  19. dignitized

    dignitized Well-Known Member

    +724
     

     

    The fact that you hold catholics to be OUTSIDE of Christianity precludes any kind of open and productive discussion.
     
  20. dignitized

    dignitized Well-Known Member

    +724
    I'm getting tired of having to defend the catholic church. It wouldn't be so bad if I was a memeber!! sheesh!!

    I will however defend the Catholic church as should any person defend another when wrongly attacked.
     
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