Ephesians 2:8-9

Job8

Senior Member
Dec 1, 2014
4,634
1,801
✟21,583.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
The modern use of the word "gift" has nothing to do with the Scriptural use of the word. When the Scriptures were written the word had a specific meaning and it is as I have pointed out. A gift and an offer are not the same thing. We cannot impose our modern use to words in the Scriptures as though they now mean and are used differently than when the Scriptures were written. We must, if we are going to be honest in our interpretations, understand the words as they were used.
Do you really believe that God expects ordinary people to make their way through fine distinctions? Gift means gift, whether in the NT Greek, or as we understand the ordinary meaning of *gift*. So if you wish to be *honest* then believe honestly that gift means gift.

Strong's Concordance (1435)
dóron: a gift, present, spec. a sacrifice
Original Word:δῶρον, ου, τό
Part of Speech:Noun, Neuter
Transliteration:dóron
Phonetic Spelling: do'-ron)
Short Definition:a gift, present
Definition:a gift, present.

So the issue is "Which is the gift -- is it salvation or is it faith?" Well Scripture itself tells us that it is salvation (eternal life), not faith. So where does faith come from? That too is revealed in Scripture. It comes from the Word of God itself.

For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. (Rom 6:23).

So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. (Rom 10:17).
 
Upvote 0

twin1954

Baptist by the Bible
Jun 12, 2011
4,527
1,472
✟86,534.00
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Do you really believe that God expects ordinary people to make their way through fine distinctions? Gift means gift, whether in the NT Greek, or as we understand the ordinary meaning of *gift*. So if you wish to be *honest* then believe honestly that gift means gift.

Strong's Concordance (1435)
dóron: a gift, present, spec. a sacrifice
Original Word:δῶρον, ου, τό
Part of Speech:Noun, Neuter
Transliteration:dóron
Phonetic Spelling: do'-ron)
Short Definition:a gift, present
Definition:a gift, present.

So the issue is "Which is the gift -- is it salvation or is it faith?" Well Scripture itself tells us that it is salvation (eternal life), not faith. So where does faith come from? That too is revealed in Scripture. It comes from the Word of God itself.

For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. (Rom 6:23).

So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. (Rom 10:17).
If God meant for us to believe that salvation was an offer He would have used that word instead of gift. Just because people do no wish to think in this modern age makes no difference. A gift and an offer are not the same thing. If they were then why use different words for each?
 
Upvote 0

Job8

Senior Member
Dec 1, 2014
4,634
1,801
✟21,583.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
You are avoiding the truth that the Spirit chose words and means what He said.
Please note that the gift and the offer are identical (Rev 22:17).

And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.
 
Upvote 0

twin1954

Baptist by the Bible
Jun 12, 2011
4,527
1,472
✟86,534.00
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Please note that the gift and the offer are identical (Rev 22:17).

And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.
I am afraid you are wrong. An invitation to all who desire to come is not the same thing as an offer. Moreover you don't recognize that it isn't even an invitation but a command from the King. Any who refuse the command of the King does so at their own peril.

Neither we nor God offers salvation in the Gospel we proclaim salvation accomplished in the Gospel. We preach Christ as He who has accomplished all of His purpose to save and tell all who desire Him to come. It isn't an invitation as much as it is a proclamation to all who can hear.

We wholeheartedly believe in whosoever will. What we do not believe, and the Scripture do not teach , is whosoever will not.
Man in his natural state will not come to Christ Jesus the Lord that they might have life. John 5:40

(Joh 5:40) And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.
 
Upvote 0

Job8

Senior Member
Dec 1, 2014
4,634
1,801
✟21,583.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Man in his natural state will not come to Christ Jesus the Lord that they might have life.
Do you even know what God has provided so that man in his natural state can respond to the Gospel?

THE POWER OF THE GOSPEL ITSELF TO BRING SALVATION TO SINNERS.

THE POWER OF THE HOLY SPIRIT WORKING ON MAN IN THE NATURAL STATE.

These two powerful provisions of God bring sinners to the Savior.
 
Upvote 0

twin1954

Baptist by the Bible
Jun 12, 2011
4,527
1,472
✟86,534.00
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Do you even know what God has provided so that man in his natural state can respond to the Gospel?

THE POWER OF THE GOSPEL ITSELF TO BRING SALVATION TO SINNERS.

THE POWER OF THE HOLY SPIRIT WORKING ON MAN IN THE NATURAL STATE.

These two powerful provisions of God bring sinners to the Savior.
Absolutely! The preaching of the Gospel is the power of God unto salvation to them that believe.

The Holy Spirit bringing dead sinners to life and faith in Christ by the preaching of the Gospel.

So then you do believe in regeneration before faith? What you have said in this post is the purest form of Calvinism.
 
Upvote 0