end of trib signs....moon blood...before day of the LORD

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[iamlamad]

Deuteronomy 28:48
/warns of the curse of - the yoke of iron
/nation of fierce countenance

Jeremiah 28:14
/on goes to the necks of the world - the yoke of iron

Jeremiah 30:6-9
/a yoke - his yoke-breaks
time of Jacob's trouble/none is like it
such as never was-great tribulation/end of the times of the Gentiles over the city of Jerusalem/end of the king of Babylon/end of the mouthy little horn that speaks great things and has 42 months/wars against the saints -prospering

A very wise old Christian College professor once made this statement - and it behooves all end time students to pay attention: He said,

"Form your end time doctrine from the most complete treatise on a given subject; then fill in with other scriptures on that subject.

Next, form your doctrine on the latest revelations on a given subject, not the earliest. God is a self revealing God and over time tells us more and more on a given subject."

On almost any end time subject, the book of Revelation is the most complete treatise and is also the latest revelation (in time.)

Therefore, we should FORM our doctrine from Revelation and use other scriptures to fill in missing pieces.

You like to quote a lot of Old Testament scriptures - where it is difficult to establish any kind of timing. On the other hand, it is much easier to establish timing in Revelation.

 

[iamlamad]

Do you realize that the 4th seal has the names given in Habakkuk 2 as to a Chaldean?
This prophecy is noted as work a work. Paul referred to it in the NT as - lest it come.
He knew that the past acts of Babylon did not fulfill the time of this evil man.

He will gather the nations unto himself. He can't be satisfied.
He is coming at the appointed time.

So, 4th seal - that coming Chaldean
5th seal - all martyrs must come in -noted by white robes
6th seal - Jesus Christ told that immediately after the tribulation of those days/the time such as never was=the great tribulation=the end of the Gentiles...=the time of Rev. 11:2 and the two witnesses....-the sun shall be darkened...the stars...fall.

Joel told that the moon becomes blood -before the day of the Lord.
The day of the Lord is when the church is leaving. She has up to that after the moon becomes blood point -been still enduring the events on this earth. She went through the time of the great tribulation. The last ever martyr for Jesus Christ has come in killed that those who spoke in the 5th seal had to wait for before God will avenge their blood.

5th seal ----want God to avenge their blood
last martyr is slain during the time of the end of the Gentiles over the holy land
6th seal - day of the Lord begins within it

God can now soon avenge the blood of the martyrs.
You need to understand -no Christians are left here when the vials are ongoing.
The time of the wicked shedding their blood is already over before the sun went black.

3rd vial - they have shed the blood of saints/not they are still shedding the blood of saints
The great tribulation is already over. None of the vials get poured till after the great tribulation is done.

1st vial - a sore on men that took the mark of the beast
/How many more do you think will get it after this happens?
The time of the little horn is already over. The great tribulation is done before even this first vial is dumped.

The 4th vial is when men are scorched with great heat.
Israel asked when their land was conquered last time by Babylon, for God to punish their conquerors sevenfold. Isaiah wrote as to how light of the sun will be at the light of seven days.

For the readers, this is mostly MYTH. This writer seldom gets any kind of timing correct.

The truth is - and John makes this very clear - the first 5 seals were opened when Jesus ascended into heaven - circa 32 AD. According to this poster then, "that coming Chaldean" coming in 32 AD. It is preposterous.

The truth is, the 4th seal, DEATH, in league with the 2nd and 3rd seals, are to represent the devil's attempts to stop the advance of the church. But God limited them in their theater of operation to only 1/4 of the earth. This particular seal represents death by plagues, fevers, and epidemics.

The 5th seal is martyrs of the church age. It too was opened around 32 AD for Stephen - one of the first martyrs.

Next, the 6th seal is NOT "after the trib." that theory is totally bogus - could not be any farther from the truth. Study, readers, and learn: John does not get to the midpoint of the week until chapter 11, and does not get to the days of GT until after chapter 14 - where God warns not to take the mark. The days of GT are most certainly to be found INSIDE the "trib" so "the trib" in Revelation is covered from chapter 8 to chapter 16. Yet, this writer imagines it will come before the 6th seal.

The truth is, the "trib" is what is written INSIDE the book, and the book is not going to be opened and those events inside the book take place, UNTIL all seven seals are opened.

Therefore, this writer's theory is BOGUS.

Readers, always remember, ANY theory that must rearrange Revelation to "fit" will always be proved wrong.

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[iamlamad]

after the time of such as never/the gtrib/sun shall be darkened
....the stars...fall....before day of the Lord///moon turns to blood...God will begin to avenge when He sees the times, time, and a half time over, because that is how long till the power of Israel is gone.

Go back and read the book of Joel. In chapter 2 Joel shows us the sign for the coming Day of the Lord - with the sun appearing black (like a black goat) and a blood moon. But in Chapter 3 Joel shows us a DIFFERENT SIGN for a DIFFERENT time - When Christ has returned - When people gather in the valley of Jehoshaphat and the sign for this is a darkened sun and moon. Joel shows us two different Hebrew words:
Joel 2: H2822 and Joel 3: H6937. Why use two different words if these two were describing the same event? Why differentiate between sun and moon in one description and put them together in another? Remember, the New Testament does exactly the same thing.

The truth is, exactly as Joel shows us, before the DAY there will be signs for the coming Day of the Lord, and in this sign the moon will be visible and will be red in color.

But over 7 years later, as a sign for Jesus coming to the battle, both the sun and moon will be darkened ; speaking of total darkness. Both the sun and moon will not be seen.

Always remember, TWO signs for TWO different events.

Therefore, STOP LINKING THESE TOGETHER as if they were ONE event: they are TWO events separated by 7 years.

Just leave Revelation as written: there is NO NEED to rearrange. John shows us the days of great tribulation will be after the midpoint which is chapter 11, and after God warns about taking the mark, chapter 14. It is not until chapter 15 that the beheaded begin showing up in heaven.

Last half of the week? It goes from the 7th trumpet to the 7th vial.......yet you insist it must be before the 6th seal.

Your theory is BOGUS.

 

[iamlamad]

Revelation 7 starts a new vision.
It takes us back to the time of four corners, which Ezekiel 7 shows is time to send the worst of the heathen against Israel.
First, some need protected to survive the coming trouble-destroying -wrath of the little horn.
Revelation 7 will show those that came out of great tribulation - gained white robes - just as those in the time of the 5th were already shown to wait on those who would be killed as they had been.

Who says Rev. 7 starts a new vision? Only you. John does not say it. You just imagine it. What if it is the 6th seal vision CONTINUED? And what on earth difference would it make anyway?

Have you ever seen a play, where the close the curtain? What happens behind the closed curtain? They are rearranging the set to fit the next act.

In this case, John covers the 6th seal, then as it were, closes the curtain so the set can be rearranged: TWO events MUST be accomplished in the mind of God before the 7th seal can be opened - because the 7th seal opens the BOOK (that was sealed with 7 seals) and the book tells us of the 70th week of Daniel. So the Trumpet judgments come after the final seal is opened so that the book can be opened.

What is the first then we see written in the book? The seven angels preparing to receive the 7 trumpets.

So the imaginary curtain is opened as soon as the two events of chapter 7 are accomplished.

What two events? God insists that the church is safely in heaven before His wrath begins. So John saw this huge crowd, too large to number. It is the raptured church, JUST raptured before the 6th seal begins His WRATH.

Then the 144,000 must be sealed for their protection during the trumpets.

Once these two events are accomplished, THEN the earth can be "HURT." God begins the hurt with trumpet judgments.

Just because you read about "4 corners" does NOT mean the two verses are talking about the same event at the same time. Ezekiel 7 is about the coming destruction when Nebuchadnezzar comes against Judah and carries many away captive. It is not about the future 70th week.

Therefore, when you write: It takes us back to the time of four corners, which Ezekiel 7 shows is time to send the worst of the heathen against Israel.

It is BOGUS. It is your imagination. Ezekiel 7 is about Babylon (Nebuchadnezzar) coming. In Revelation it will be the 10 nations that throw in with the Beast for "one hour" to wipe Israel off the maps forever and ever. Yes, the battle of Armageddon.

First, some need protected to survive the coming trouble-destroying -wrath of the little horn.

This too is BOGUS. They need protection from GOD sending the angels with the trumpets. It is the trumpet judgments they are protected against. Did you not read that those stinging locusts cannot sting those who are sealed? Where do you come up with this nonsense? Just follow the text!

Revelation 7 will show those that came out of great tribulation - gained white robes - just as those in the time of the 5th were already shown to wait on those who would be killed as they had been.

Are you hinting that these are the same group? If so, that thought is BOGUS. Those under the altar are martyrs. The great crowd too large to number are the raptured church. All John is telling us is that at the time of the rapture, it is going to be GT in the world - people being killed for their testimony. Wake up! It is that way in half the world TODAY.

 

[iamlamad]

Revelation 8 is where the 7th seal is opened, and John soon again saw the seven angels.

Just as in Rev. 17 and Rev. 21 - it was not time to pour out a vial full, but John was clearly showing what angel had shown up, he does this same way in Rev. 8. He will then in Rev. 8 tell us what happened with that set of seven angels in the past.

Why is it you mix up past and future? Do you not understand, tomorrow - the day that is NOT today, is FUTURE? Future has not come yet! Why on earth would you bring up chapter 17 and chapter 21 when discussing chapter 8? You are mixing times and showing everyone you have no concept of timing.

Get this straight, once and for all: chapter 8 is the START of the 70th week: the trumpet judgments beginning. Chapter 17 is AFTER THE WEEK HAS FINISHED. You amaze me. Your idea that John or the Holy Spirit or both - MIXED UP the chronology is BOGUS.

The truth is, any theory that must rearrange John's God Given chronology will be proven wrong.

Do you just WANT to be wrong? I can't believe that.

" I saw the seven angels which stood before God;"

This is the FIRST MENTION of 7 angels that was seen standing before God." therefore, don't mix them up with 7 angels seen later on in the book.

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[iamlamad]

The day of the Lord starts after the great tribulation is over.

great trib/time such as never was
after it - sun darkened - the stars fall
moon blood
only now can the day of the Lord begin

It is not - moon blood - then the great tribulation begins.
The day of the Lord begins as God destroying, and He won't start to destroy until after the announcement in Revelation 11:18.
It will also mention time as to reward the saints.

judge the dead
reward the saints
destroy -them -that destroy the earth
God is not among the destroyers yet - or at this trumpet time, He would destroy Himself

Let's follow John, shall we?

THIS IS GOD'S ORDER:
At the 6th seal, or just before, the sun turns dark and the moon appears blood red: it is the SIGN for the start of the Day of the Lord.
The 144,000 must be seals before the trumpets begin to HURT the earth.
A few days later:
The 7th seal is opened, and the 70th week of Daniel begins.
6 trumpets sound: judgments from God.
7th trumpet marks the midpoint, where people flee after seeing the abomination.
the man of sin is revealed as the BEAST.
The false prophet shows up.
God sends a warning: it is either refuse the mark or forever in the lake of fire.
They create and image, and make a law: bow down or lose your head.
The create a mark, and demand that all receive this mark.
Then days of great tribulation come, such as was not on the planet.
After an unknown period of time, God has mercy on the saints and pours out the first six vials of His wrath - to SHORTEN those days of great tribulation.
The days of great tribulation are over - but the rest of the Beast's 42 months will continue
When the 1260th day comes (since the abomination) the 7th vial is poured out to END the week.
Then after perhaps a few days, ANOTHER SIGN in the sun and moon: this time both are darkened. The sun will appear like a black goat or a black sackcloth made from black goat hair. The starlight will disappear. It will be total darkness on earth.
The marriage and supper take place in heaven.
After an unknown period of time, SUDDENLY:
Jesus returns, like lightning flashing across a dark sky.

If you have a different theory - and you do - it is WRONG. John's timing and order is correct. You insist in rearranging and so your theory is in error.

great trib/time such as never was
after it - sun darkened - the stars fall
moon blood
only now can the day of the Lord begin

You cannot prove this by scripture, because it is ERROR. The days of great tribulation are AFTER chapter 14. You are trying to have days of Great tribulation before God begins the 70th week. Your cart is about a mile down the road ahead of the horse. Your error is HUGE. Why not just follow JOHN'S order? Do you think you can do better on the order than the Holy Spirit?

Can you PROVE that the four horses represent days of great tribulation - when no one else can?

Go back to chapter 5:
6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

WHAT TIME did Jesus ascend and send the Holy Spirit down? You should know it was around 32 or 33 AD. Now search HARD for 2000 years in any verse after that. It is NOT THERE. That means seal #1 was opened in 32 or 33 AD. It is what is written. You are pulling the first seals OUT OF CONTEXT!

The truth is, the first 5 seals are CHURCH AGE: and the church age ends just before the DAY of the LORD begins.

ONE THING you have right: the sun will turn dark and the moon will appear red just before the DAY starts: 6th seal.

It is not - moon blood - then the great tribulation begins.

Why not? That is the way John WROTE IT. I hope I am there when you correct John on his timing of Revelation. That should be fun!

Here is JOHN's timing:
moon into blood -> the DAY begins -> sealing of the 144,000 and church seen in heaven -> the 7th seal is opened -> the Trumpet judgments begin to HURT THE EARTH (Chapters 8 and 9)

The day of the Lord begins as God destroying, and He won't start to destroy until after the announcement in Revelation 11:18. This is TOTAL AND COMPLETE MYTH. Why do you insist on correcting John - as if He did not write it correctly?
Follow JOHN'S order:

moon into blood -> the DAY begins -> sealing of the 144,000 and church seen in heaven -> the 7th seal is opened -> the Trumpet judgments begin to HURT THE EARTH (Chapters 8 and 9)

What is it about John's order that you can't agree with? Did you read how one angel told the other angels who will HURT the earth to WAIT until the 144,000 are sealed?
By the end of chapter 7, the sealing is FINISHED. Then in chapter 8 the 7th seal is opened to begin the 70th week of Daniel or "the trib" as some call it. Then the HURT begins as each trumpet judgment is sounded.

God is not among the destroyers yet - or at this trumpet time, He would destroy Himself

This is classic! You must be the first human ever to write such nonsense! Throw your theories into the trash and start over! Next time follow John's order of things.

 

[iamlamad]

Isaiah 34 tells how the heaven will be rolled as a scroll in the day
of the Lord -His anger.

6th seal - heaven departs - as a scroll rolled

Finally I agree: Isaiah 34 seems to line up with the 6th seal.

 

[iamlamad]

Deuteronomy 32 is about a sealed nation of judges.
It tells how God would raise a people to make Israel jealous...and Romans - 10 and 11 link back to this.
So, the church came into being....then later would come a foolish nation that would make Israel angry.
Romans 10 and 11 also show this part had yet to happen.

Deuteronomy 32 shows that after this time of the foolish nation is when God sees the power of the holy people/His people scattered -their power is gone, and now He will start to avenge.
This fits right with Daniel 12 as to the times, time, and an half of scattering the holy people ends before God sees their power is gone.

from the time of the daily....back in Daniel 11
and the abomination of desolation shall be 1290 days
and soon the vile person speaks great things
He is the same speaks great things mouth from Rev. 13 that was
added to the beast out of the sea.
He is the same little horn with a mouth that speaks great things in Daniel 7.
He only has 42 months...the entire time of the great trib to scatter Israel...before God begins to avenge. He can't begin to avenge until after the moon has turned to blood.

You are mistaken: the "vile" person is referring to Antiochus Epiphanes.

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm