Eating swine & other unclean animals is a work of the flesh

[FredVB]

Interesting....
Are you talking about the same God that said this?
Genesis 9 3-5

I certainly am discussing the same God shown in the Bible, Yahweh, in all my posts that mention God. I do wonder about some certain ones of other posters though.

I have gone on at length about Genesis 9:2-5, which I could scrape up from such things I posted previously.

You know, or really should, that animal products were still not given from Yahweh's permission until there was definitely not enough vegetation growing after the flood, and after Noah gave a sacrifice to Yahweh, many centuries after Adam and Eve fell and were removed from the Garden. There are things of the provision from the beginning for us which are shown, that it is so right for us to pursue having.

And importantly yet really overlooked or neglected though it really shouldn't be, permission for meat from animals that was given then was linked with discussion on murder, with showing responsibility to animals, on whom dread of humans came.This permission was with what there is of the curse on the world discussed.

Yes, Yahweh cares, see Proverbs 12:10.

Since you have the position needing what Yahweh said to Noah passed down to everyone including you, you should know you are being disobedient when you have meat that was prepared without first having the blood removed, that was an important part of that permission that was given. It was given in connection to sacrifices that were done, and the permission was not ever said to be for perpetuity, that it would always last. It wouldn't for there would be a return to the perfect design in the provision already given to start with, this is shown in the prophecies given in scriptures from Yahweh. When Jesus returns and reigns, there will be no suffering and harm or killing anymore under his rule, all creation groans for that relief which is coming. In fact, since he came and suffered for us, we don't have to have animals die for us. Many early Christians understood and didn't keep having meat.

Eating only without animal products and processed foods is really what is best for us, as is shown in the points I made previously, which shouldn't be just disregarded, and with what Yahweh wants for us, as the Creator who provides for that even in the perfection, having just food from vegetation is what is meant for us.

And if you do care about mass starvation, you would willingly give up animal products over that issue. Being a part of the demand for animal products takes more land and resources that would otherwise provide for many times over enough food for all.

The design for us from Yahweh our Creator is most desirable for us, and what is from animals is to be avoided in what we eat, from that. This indeed is repeatedly suggested in the scriptures, though Yahweh made allowances, as human people are stubborn, and won't come to relationship with Yahweh, through salvation that is provided, with all that great change called for, that would be otherwise, including in the earlier times giving up slavery, that we are not told directly to give up, and polygamy, among other things. And depending on what animals are being killed for, which isn't even better for us, or this world, or anything, is such to give up. It can happen, but those yet to do so resist if they won't learn of tasty options that there are which are all plant-based.

www.forksoverknives.com

With the response after this, I wonder who is really being served, is it the same God, God of the Bible? Is that who would call for that response? I would have to be convinced to see that.

 

[FredVB]

I refer to things like Forks Over Knives which really should be looked at. I don't just speak out of a vacuum on this. I care enough that information on this is seen, it can be found in this book I refer to, and is seen communicated in the film Forks Over Knives.

"... Thanks to these doctors and researchers, along with an emerging body of scientific evidence from all corners, we now know that a whole-food, plant-based diet is more powerful at preventing and treating chronic diseases than any medication or procedure. We are so convinced by the evidence that we believe if this diet came in a pill, it would be heralded on the front pages of newspapers and magazines around the world for its effectiveness.

"There is a movement underway as hundreds of thousands of people, if not more, are trying the whole-food plant-based lifestyle for themselves and finding great success. We have personally seen remarkable results in our own medical practice, not to mention experienced it in our own lives. Here are just a few of the significant life-changing results you may expect:

"Prevent and reverse the leading chronic ailments. A whole-food plant-based diet can prevent, halt, and reverse heart disease and diabetes. Other diseases that are also positively impacted by this type of diet include: high cholesterol, high blood pressure, obesity, and overall mortality. Cancer is also significantly affected by this diet. In fact, the foods that make up this diet are the exact same foods that were recommended in the first "surviving cancer" dietary recommendations. There is also evidence that a plant-based diet may reduce the risk of diverticular disease, gallstones, rheumatoid arthritis, gout, and kidney disease. Furthermore, after switching to a plant-based diet, people routinely report experiencing or seeing in others improvements in a range of ailments, including osteoporosis, arthritis, headaches, acne, asthma, sexual dysfunction, reflux, lupus, inflammatory bowel disease, dementia, Alzheimer's, multiple sclerosis, infertility, insomnia, and sleep apnea. They even find themselves experiencing fewer or less intense colds, viruses, and allergies."

There are many more benefits that are still spoken of after that part. How are these things not enough for seeing the need for change that way? And for God's perfect way for us, would it be something else without such benefits, instead? I find scripture passages suggesting that perfect way for us is with this.

Yahweh our God has perfection in the design that was meant for us, with what is shown in the beginning. And God is with such unlimited compassion that with this Christ came, giving his life for us. And God cares for his creatures. It is not better that animals are killed for us, and we don't need to animals to die for us. We should be growing in godliness. If this happens, we should have God's will here, with it already to show in our lives, as it is in God's Heaven.

With these things being the case (and it could be looked into more, rather than dismissed, as there are Bible verses I show very compatible with this), why would God not want this for us?

 

[1stcenturylady]

Well it shows you have no response you can really make to any of all the great points I make, and rather than honestly consider any of it, you desperately respond with a meme for your position! I was thinking at first you asked a sincere question. But that's the best you can do, then.





Animals were certainly herbivorous in the beginning before the curse that came with humanity's fall. And they would have had more than grass. There were leaves and stalks, for some there were possibly roots, and there were certain fruits and seeds. Meat for us actually takes longer to digest, and rots a bit in us before adequate digestion, the healthier vegan meals will move through us more quickly, eliminating many problems to health or well-being, I will just say that much. It's great that with this whole food plant-based way of eating, we can eat to our contentment, and approach the ideal weight for us individually. This is such a good choice in life to make, with wonderful choices for it, it is win win, and nothing to lose.

I don't think it is such a problem. It was of course whatever it was, and we can just propose our guesses, as it is not told in the scriptures, meaning we don't need to know for what is essential to us. But I think there isn't such freak of nature, and the panda suggests how animals that we think of as carnivores were originally. They changed from that herbivorous living, certainly. But change in such can happen in either direction. I know of a lioness that became vegan, on her own initiative. And a carnivorous shark did too. And there is now a species of spider that is herbivorous, a very big exception to spiders. And there are now pet cats and dogs thriving on vegan pet food for them, with supplements included for things they need.

My guess, as we can do that here, is that the animals becoming carnivorous did it gradually, as it was likely not a response to Yahweh telling them, "As I gave you the green vegetation for food, I now give other animals that you can catch for your food." It was more likely opportunistic, when it happened early on. Or, when there was not enough vegetation growing after the global flood, the same as it was for the humans, for which Yahweh spoke to them about permitting meat, when the animals departed from the ark, there were those which had capacity to catch and eat other animals that were doing that very soon after, then, which then persisted for many of those doing so, in their lineages, when it hadn't been so needed before when there was abundant food growing.

Of course, there was also an abundance of fish.

 

[gordonhooker]

The OP would be a classic example of taking scripture out of context and miss using it in my humble opinion.

 

[Zoii]

The whole notion of unclean is odd..... by definition a hippopotamus is clean but wow have you seen how they live.... very muddy. But its also odd because once you strip the skin away its clean. But if you want to be totally clean maybe vegan is the way to go.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Of course, there was also an abundance of fish.

I like fish.........

Eze 47:9
“And it shall be that every living thing that moves, wherever the rivers go, will live.
There will be a very great multitude of fish, because these waters go there; for they will be healed, and everything will live wherever the river goes.

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[Dkh587]

The OP would be a classic example of taking scripture out of context and miss using it in my humble opinion.

Isn't that the common viewpoint when someone teaches something contrary to a person's beliefs?

It goes without saying, that I think anybody who teaches that it's okay for Christians to eat unclean animals has taken the scriptures out of context and are misusing them.

So what happens when 2 people both think that the other person is teaching scripture out of context?

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Isn't that the common viewpoint when someone teaches something contrary to a person's beliefs?

It goes without saying, that I think anybody who teaches that it's okay for Christians to eat unclean animals has taken the scriptures out of context and are misusing them.

So what happens when 2 people both think that the other person is teaching scripture out of context?

Bring in a third and forth scripture and as many as are needed to say whether a principle or precept not something that is salvational. I really think that God gave us the pie and said "now either play nice with this among your brothers and sisters or no dessert for you when I call you in"

 

[1stcenturylady]

The whole notion of unclean is odd..... by definition a hippopotamus is clean but wow have you seen how they live.... very muddy. But its also odd because once you strip the skin away its clean. But if you want to be totally clean maybe vegan is the way to go.

By what definition is a hippopotamus clean?

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

The whole notion of unclean is odd..... by definition a hippopotamus is clean but wow have you seen how they live.... very muddy.
But its also odd because once you strip the skin away its clean. But if you want to be totally clean maybe vegan is the way to go.

By what definition is a hippopotamus clean?

I would eat hippo meat if I was starving to death, but I have no earthly idea how to field dress it and prepare it.

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[LittleLambofJesus]

The OP would be a classic example of taking scripture out of context and miss using it in my humble opinion.

The first hint of something "fishy", is when he starts off and ends with "shalom"........

Shalom!

ETA: This thread does not teach that salvation is through the law of Moses/law of God.
This thread teaches that salvation is through the Messiah/Christ, Jesus/Yeshua/Yahushua

Again, there are many more things that make us unclean, but this thread is only about how eating unclean animals makes us unclean, per the word of God.
Shalom!

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[Hammster]

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