Drawing lines

visionary

Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I.
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Often lines are drawn as to who is in and who is out based upon doctrines.

I can relate. If a person doesn't know and believe the correct doctrine, then they have no idea where they are in prophecy. For example... In the story of Lazarus and Abraham's bosom, many classify it as another parable... but it is interesting in that it is the only "parable" to name names and set a time frame for it to occur.


The Rich Man and Lazarus
(John 5:39–47)

19Now there was a rich man dressed in purple and fine linen, who lived each day in joyous splendor. 20And a beggar named Lazarus lay at his gate, covered with sores 21and longing to be fed with the crumbs that fell from the rich man’s table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.22One day the beggar died and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s side.d And the rich man also died and was buried. 23In Hades, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham from afar, with Lazarus by his side.24So he cried out, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue. For I am in agony in this fire.’25But Abraham answered, ‘Child, remember that during your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things. But now he is comforted here, while you are in agony. 26And besides all this, a great chasm has been fixed between us and you, so that even those who wish cannot cross from here to you, nor can anyone cross from there to us.’27‘Then I beg you, father,’ he said, ‘send Lazarus to my father’s house, 28for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also end up in this place of torment.’29But Abraham replied, ‘They have Moses and the prophets; let your brothers listen to them.’30‘No, father Abraham,’ he said, ‘but if someone is sent to them from the dead, they will repent.’

31Then Abraham said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the prophets, they will not be persuaded even if someone rises from the dead.’ ”

In this "parable", you have wrong doctrine belief which puts the person on the wrong side of eternity. You have the name of the main charaacter and you have the setting. There is only one time where the wrong side could have a conversation with the right side and the wrong are already suffering punishement of fire.

Satan Cast into the Lake of Fire

7When the thousand years are complete, Satan will be released from his prison, 8and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to assemble them for battle. Their number is like the sand of the seashore.9And they marched across the broad expanse of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. But fire came down from heavena and consumed them. 10And the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur, into which the beast and the false prophet had already been thrown. There they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.11Then I saw a great white throne and the One seated on it. Earth and heaven fled from His presence, and no place was found for them. 12And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne.

And there were open books, and one of them was the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their deeds, as recorded in the books. 13The sea gave up its dead, and Death and Hades gave up their dead, and each one was judged according to his deeds.14Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death—the lake of fire. 15And if anyone was found whose name was not written in the Book of Life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

The point I am trying to make is that doctrine makes a eternal difference. I do not want to be dogmatic, because God in his mercy has winked...

Paul Before the Areopagus

22Then Paul stood in the midst of Mars' hill, and said, Ye men of Athens, I perceive that in all things ye are too superstitious. 23For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, TO THE UNKNOWN GOD. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship, him declare I unto you. 24God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands; 25Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things; 26And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation; 27That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us: 28For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring. 29Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device. 30And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent: 31Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

32And when they heard of the resurrection of the dead, some mocked: and others said, We will hear thee again of this matter. 33So Paul departed from among them. 34Howbeit certain men clave unto him, and believed: among the which was Dionysius the Areopagite, and a woman named Damaris, and others with them.
 
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eleos1954

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God looks at the heart and He is the only one that knows it.

Doctrine is important ... but it's not like God is looking for a bunch of "smart" people and those are the only ones going to heaven.
 
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visionary

Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I.
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God looks at the heart and He is the only one that knows it.

Doctrine is important ... but it's not like God is looking for a bunch of "smart" people and those are the only ones going to heaven.
Exactly... yet the clueless as to prophectic time line, where they were, why it was happening, made no sense to the wicked, even when Abraham told them, where the problem lay in their thinking. Their doctrine made them think that they were the dead ones and the ones they left behind are still in the time zone of the moment they died, not realizing thousand of years have passed and warning their brothers was a little too late.
 
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eleos1954

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Exactly... yet the clueless as to prophectic time line, where they were, why it was happening, made no sense to the wicked, even when Abraham told them, where the problem lay in their thinking. Their doctrine made them think that they were the dead ones and the ones they left behind are still in the time zone of the moment they died, not realizing thousand of years have passed and warning their brothers was a little too late.

I would agree with this to a certain extent "in the time zone" ... ie in the grave and will be resurrected someday (dormant sleep).

However, I believe there is a vestige of God that remains in every human being (all were made in His image). That is God's law (image of His character) is in everyone heart/mind (conscience) and always has been .... has to be .... else how can God judge rightly?

Nothing is immortal about us .... we (1st resurrection) become immortal at that time.

and yeah .... when resurrected no one will know ... have a sense of .... how long they have been there (the dead know nothing).

Was a difficult time back then .... because history was in the making (so to speak) .... but as time goes on then we have more history and can better understand prophecies.
 
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visionary

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Today faith has fractured has fragmented in so many ways, it is like the worn out rope frayed beyond its power to hold a connected for some. Just because some of the same words, identifications, and phrases used are similar, doesn't mean there is a real living connection with God. Maybe this is why God said there will be a remnant of His seed.
 
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GedaliahMaegil

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Today faith has fractured has fragmented in so many ways, it is like the worn out rope frayed beyond its power to hold a connected for some. Just because some of the same words, identifications, and phrases used are similar, doesn't mean there is a real living connection with God. Maybe this is why God said there will be a remnant of His seed.

And then there are frays from other ropes that keep blowing over to our rope, pretending they came from our rope ...
 
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