Dr Robert Malone and cardiologist Dr Peter McCullough are the latest to be reinstated to Twitter

[Diamond7]

Nevertheless, it is not true that people are not allowed to sue for injuries.

You have not heard of the PREP act? Or are you just trying to twist words around?

Try typing this into your google search: "can not sue a drug company for vaccines"

This is the results you will get: "
Dorit Reiss, Professor, University of California, Hastings College of the Law:
Practically speaking, vaccine manufacturers are almost completely immune from lawsuits for COVID-19 pandemic countermeasures’ harms, and this includes COVID-19 vaccines, both vaccines under an EUA and vaccines licensed for COVID-19. This is because of the PREP Act declaration that covers pandemic countermeasures. So they cannot be sued for COVID-19 vaccine injuries."

What is the PREP Act?

The Public Readiness and Emergency Preparedness Act (PREPA), passed by the United States Congress and signed into law by President of the United States George W. Bush in December 2005 (as part of Pub.L. 109–148 (text) (PDF)), is a controversial tort liability shield intended to protect vaccine manufacturers from financial risk in the event of a declared public health emergency. The part of PREPA that actually affords such protection is now codified at 42 U.S.C. § 247d-6d. The act specifically affords to drug makers immunity from actions related to the manufacture, testing, development, distribution, administration and use of medical countermeasures against chemical, biological, radiological and nuclear agents of terrorism, epidemics, and pandemics. PREPA strengthens and consolidates the oversight of litigation against pharmaceutical companies under the purview of the secretary of Health and Human Services (HHS). PREPA provides $3.8 billion for pandemic influenza preparedness to protect public health in the case of a pandemic disease outbreak.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Look who else is back.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Look who else is back.

View attachment 325501

I'd really like to see him enter a thread you have posted a lot to...

 

[RestoreTheJoy]

Do you have any examples of such a situation?

Um, the situation in America, where people were forced at penalty of job loss (or academic removal in some areas) to take a drug with zero long term data and dangerous side effects like pericarditis and myocarditis and blood clotting? Tell me you haven't forgotten the last two years.

 

[RestoreTheJoy]

Just to go on record I wasn't a fan of the vaccine mandates. As soon as we got to the waves of Delta and beyond (where the benefits with it were largely individual ones, and the externalities arguments about spreading it to others no longer really applied), my stance was pretty much "you have the information, do what you want, I'm as protected as I can get, so if it's not going to stop me giving it to you or you giving it to me, I can see no practical reason to make you get it"

With regards to dangerous side effect, yes, there were a tiny fraction of people who experience some adverse reactions, but for the overwhelming majority of the public, the pros of the covid shots vastly outweighed the cons.

But...I do think that's where the ball was dropped in terms of the messaging. By one side being dismissive of risks (regardless of how tiny the risks were), it had a backlash effect. That was exacerbated by the censorship of anyone mentioning the mere notion that "there may be some things about it that aren't so great".

Those "negative mentions" ranged from practical questions that are perfectly reasonable to ask, all the way to full blown conspiratorial theories about Bill Gates and Soros trying to microchip people.

As soon as it became polarized, the people asking the reasonable questions were the real victims. Many people split into the two large factions.

The "Nothing but the vaccine" crowd vs. the "Anything but the vaccine/Conspiracy" crowd

The people (and medical professionals) who had reasonable questions about it, and those of us who thought the vaccine was a really good thing, and even highly recommended it (but stopped short of advocating mandates), ended up getting the mainstream media treatment of being lumped in with the latter.

I agree with your first paragraph completely. It became obvious very soon that nothing was as represented. Do what you want. However, it is imperative that people give informed consent, which is impossible to do when doctors are forbidden to speak of side effects (see law in CA), other treatments are forbidden for some unknown reason, when many drugs are used off-label for many purposes, and there are dangerous side effects appearing. We've seen neurological problems, myocarditis in healthy young men (primarily), pericarditis in health young men (primarly), period issues, blood clotting issues, embalmers talking about huge blood clots preventing the infusion of embalming fluid, and a huge statistical anomaly in excess deaths among people under 60 (per insurance companies).

There IS something to talk about (and no, nothing I'm discussing here has anything to do with Soros or Bill Gates, which I agree is off focus, but only with actual data). I agree that people were victimized, to their own peril, with ZERO accountability for a drug with no long term data.

 

[RestoreTheJoy]

Yeah, I touched on that bit earlier, Malone's folklore of being "the" inventor is a bit grandiose.

Dr. Paul Offit covers it pretty well here. (I set the timestamp marker on the link to around the 44 minute mark, where the topic is "what Robert Malone did, and didn't, do with mRNA technology.

Paul Offit is a paid vaccine shill: This is from CBS NEWS, not some lesser known source:

"Offit was not willing to be interviewed on this subject but like others in this CBS News investigation, he has strong industry ties. In fact, he's a vaccine industry insider.

Offit holds in a $1.5 million dollar research chair at Children's Hospital, funded by Merck. He holds the patent on an anti-diarrhea vaccine he developed with Merck, Rotateq, which has prevented thousands of hospitalizations.

And future royalties for the vaccine were just sold for $182 million cash. Dr. Offit's share of vaccine profits? Unknown."

 

[NxNW]

Um, the situation in America, where people were forced at penalty of job loss (or academic removal in some areas) to take a drug with zero long term data and dangerous side effects like pericarditis and myocarditis and blood clotting? Tell me you haven't forgotten the last two years.

What you described is not accurate.

 

[ranunculus]

Paul Offit is a paid vaccine shill: This is from CBS NEWS, not some lesser known source:

"Offit was not willing to be interviewed on this subject but like others in this CBS News investigation, he has strong industry ties. In fact, he's a vaccine industry insider.

Offit holds in a $1.5 million dollar research chair at Children's Hospital, funded by Merck. He holds the patent on an anti-diarrhea vaccine he developed with Merck, Rotateq, which has prevented thousands of hospitalizations.

And future royalties for the vaccine were just sold for $182 million cash. Dr. Offit's share of vaccine profits? Unknown."

Attacking Dr. Offit as a paid vaccine shill does nothing to discredit his arguments that Dr. Malone lies about the importance of his contributions to the invention of mRNA vaccines.

It's like if I were to say that the CBS news article you quote from was written by anti vax shill Sharyl Attkisson who has been trying to link vaccines to autism for the last 2 decades.

All we've done is poison the well.

 

[CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN]

Um, the situation in America, where people were forced at penalty of job loss (or academic removal in some areas) to take a drug with zero long term data and dangerous side effects like pericarditis and myocarditis and blood clotting? Tell me you haven't forgotten the last two years.

Who was? I live in CA. This didn't happen.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Paul Offit is a paid vaccine shill: This is from CBS NEWS, not some lesser known source:

"Offit was not willing to be interviewed on this subject but like others in this CBS News investigation, he has strong industry ties. In fact, he's a vaccine industry insider.

Offit holds in a $1.5 million dollar research chair at Children's Hospital, funded by Merck. He holds the patent on an anti-diarrhea vaccine he developed with Merck, Rotateq, which has prevented thousands of hospitalizations.

And future royalties for the vaccine were just sold for $182 million cash. Dr. Offit's share of vaccine profits? Unknown."

What does that have to do with what he outlines with regards to Malone?

Offit (as well as the doctor he's doing the interview with) in another part of the interview both actually have a more "moderate" and measured view on the mRNA vaccines for covid. In that they both said there's not much of a reason to be rolling out boosters to kids.

And furthermore, if Offit a "vaccine shill", then he's not a very good one. As in this interview, he states that boosters are a "low reward" type of thing for the majority of people and only recommends them for people over 75, and people with chronic conditions....and openly says the boosters don't offer much benefit in healthy young people.

Who should get an updated COVID-19 booster? Doctor explains

Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia's Director Dr. Paul Offit joins Yahoo Finance Live to discuss COVID-19 boosters and who should be getting one this winter, the benefits of a booster shot, the biggest concerns surrounding the latest COVID-19 variants, and the outlook for COVID-19.

finance.yahoo.com

I think people need to start getting away from the mentality that "everyone who doesn't reject the entirety of the vaccine efforts must be a shill".

How many other 'vaccine shills' (as you called him) would be going on nationally televised interviews saying "if you're a healthy person under 75, there's not much of a point in getting a booster"?

 

[FireDragon76]

This whole "combat bad information with good information" is a nice sentiment, but I've yet to see it work. People seem to decide what is good information by looking for information they already agree with.

If Twitter wants to platform lies, they should face the consequences.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

If Twitter wants to platform lies, they should face the consequences.

Technically any platform, that's actually a public platform, has platformed lies.

That's the basis for the protections that true platforms receive vs. publishers who have editorial control over their content.

It's the reason why someone spewing hate speech in the YouTube comments section doesn't get YouTube in trouble...and why AT&T doesn't get in trouble if someone sends me a harassing text or voicemail over their cellular network.


The murky waters occur when an entity tries to have it both ways (which is what Twitter was doing). Where they still want to boast being a platform, but still exercising editorial discretion to try to steer the public conversation in one direction or the other.

 

[RestoreTheJoy]

What does that have to do with what he outlines with regards to Malone?

Offit (as well as the doctor he's doing the interview with) in another part of the interview both actually have a more "moderate" and measured view on the mRNA vaccines for covid. In that they both said there's not much of a reason to be rolling out boosters to kids.

And furthermore, if Offit a "vaccine shill", then he's not a very good one. As in this interview, he states that boosters are a "low reward" type of thing for the majority of people and only recommends them for people over 75, and people with chronic conditions....and openly says the boosters don't offer much benefit in healthy young people.

Who should get an updated COVID-19 booster? Doctor explains

Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia's Director Dr. Paul Offit joins Yahoo Finance Live to discuss COVID-19 boosters and who should be getting one this winter, the benefits of a booster shot, the biggest concerns surrounding the latest COVID-19 variants, and the outlook for COVID-19.

finance.yahoo.com

I think people need to start getting away from the mentality that "everyone who doesn't reject the entirety of the vaccine efforts must be a shill".

How many other 'vaccine shills' (as you called him) would be going on nationally televised interviews saying "if you're a healthy person under 75, there's not much of a point in getting a booster"?

Offit literally never met a vaccine he didn't love and push, and he recommended this jab for children. Remember, this is the guy who said 10,000 vaccines at one time would be safe?

About this one: Dr. Paul Offit addresses whether children younger than 5 years of age need a coronavirus vaccine, if the COVID-19 mRNA vaccines work in kids under 5, and why delaying COVID vaccination presents a risk for your child.

Here is is praising the fact that millions of children got it anyway earlier this year , but hey, they didn't die (as did/are older kids on an ongoing basis) so that's supposed to be good:
"The good news is with a five to 11-year-old, about a third of those children, about 30% or so, have been vaccinated in a population of 28 million. You already have about 9 million children or so who have been vaccinated in the five to 11-year-old age group. That's instructive and reassuring because at least the as the most recent date I've seen is that you hadn't seen myocarditis because that was the fear, right? You knew that it was highest in that sort of 16 to 17-year-old age group, especially boys four days after dose two.


Maybe he changed his tune afterward as the obvious began to dawn even on those with vested interests. Kids never needed this. Healthy people never needed this.

 

[RestoreTheJoy]

Who was? I live in CA. This didn't happen.

Oh yes it did; CA was one of the worst of the hypocritical lockdown states. In the midst of the pandemic, Newsom is out partying with his friends unmasked at the French Laundry, while the ordinary people were ordered to show "vaccine proof" just to get in anywhere (exemptions existed, but you had to know the law and many companies refused to follow it):

"Under the ordinance passed by the L.A. City Council, patrons will have to show proof of full vaccination at indoor areas including restaurants, bars, gyms, movie theaters, concert venues, convention centers, card rooms, play areas, museums, malls, play areas, spas, salons and indoor city facilities."

 

[RestoreTheJoy]

Attacking Dr. Offit as a paid vaccine shill does nothing to discredit his arguments that Dr. Malone lies about the importance of his contributions to the invention of mRNA vaccines.

It's like if I were to say that the CBS news article you quote from was written by anti vax shill Sharyl Attkisson who has been trying to link vaccines to autism for the last 2 decades.

All we've done is poison the well.

Oh, as to Malone (got sidetracked answering another part of what you said), Malone DID participate in MRNA invention many years ago, but has been discredited because of his political views. He has not been wrong though.

"Dr. Felgner invented the first lipid nanoparticle. Malone mixed the fatty bubbles with messenger RNA, and together, they showed the mixture could spur human cells in a dish to make proteins.

Malone later joined Felgner at Vical, where they were the first people to introduce these fatty bubbles carrying mRNA into mice. Malone and Felgner are listed on several papers and patent filings together.

Still, it would take decades of innovations from other labs to develop the mRNA COVID vaccines used today. “We have to put all the pieces together. And we didn’t have all the pieces back then. But we had one really interesting piece,” said Dr. Felgner.

Felgner, now the director of the Vaccine Research and Development Center at UC Irvine, has been recognized internationally for his contributions to the mRNA vaccines. Some former colleagues feel Malone deserves recognition for conceptualizing the experiments.

“There were a half-dozen people at Vical who really contributed to this,” said one Vical employee. “But who was the brainchild? Who came up with the idea? It was Robert [Malone].”

Others think Malone, who bills himself in public appearances as the “inventor” of mRNA vaccine technology, has exaggerated his role. Dr. Malone did not respond to an email from ABC 10News seeking comment."

In-Depth: Did Robert Malone invent mRNA vaccines in San Diego?

An enigmatic scientist’s work in San Diego in the late 1980s proved to be an important step in the road to the COVID-19 vaccines. Today, he’s one of the most prominent critics of the technology he claims to have helped invent.

www.10news.com

 

[RestoreTheJoy]

Attacking Dr. Offit as a paid vaccine shill does nothing to discredit his arguments that Dr. Malone lies about the importance of his contributions to the invention of mRNA vaccines.

It's like if I were to say that the CBS news article you quote from was written by anti vax shill Sharyl Attkisson who has been trying to link vaccines to autism for the last 2 decades.

All we've done is poison the well.

False. Malone did contribute, as outlined in a previous post, and CBS news DID publish the Atkinson contribution. Who cares who wrote it? The question to ask is is the information correct? Yes, the information is correct. And certainly you are intelligent enough to understand that those who step outside the current orthodoxy in charge risk being discredited, whether correct or not.

Good example: Dr. Semmelweis, run out of medicine because he dared to suggest that he was seeing a connection between unwashed hands and spreading infection around, back in 1847. As usual, his absolutely correct statements were rejected and he lost his job. Hmm. Sounds familiar the past couple of years. Now, of course, hand washing and gloves are standard. Dr. Semmelweis was absolutely correct. This account downplays how he was attacked.

"Realizing that chloride solution rid objects of their odors, Semmelweis mandated hand-washing across his department. Starting in May 1847, anyone entering the First Division had to wash their hands in a bowl of chloride solution. The incidence of puerperal fever and death subsequently dropped precipitously by the end of the year.


Unfortunately, as in the case of his contemporary John Snow, who discovered that cholera was transmitted by water and not miasma, Semmelweis’ work was not readily accepted by all. The obstetrical chief, perhaps feeling upstaged by the discovery, refused to reappoint Semmelweis to the obstetrics clinic.


Semmelweis’ refusal to publish his work may have also contributed to his downfall. With little recognition during his lifetime, he eventually died from injuries sustained in a Viennese insane asylum.

 

[RestoreTheJoy]

What you described is not accurate.

Yes, it is accurate.
"But as COVID-19 cases spike and federal, state and local politicians push hard to increase vaccination rates – often through mandates – many companies are still jettisoning workers because they're not vaccinated.

Some layoffs are mandatory due to government policies. In October, more than 33,000 health care workers in New York state were fired, retired or placed on unpaid leave because they refused to get vaccinated in accordance with the state's policy."

Others were fully at the company's discretion, like when United Airlines fired more than 230 employees in October, before the details of the Biden administration's vaccine policies were announced.

Citigroup, for example, is a large company subject to the Biden administration's vaccine mandate that's currently in limbo at the Supreme Court. The company is largely based in New York City where former Mayor Bill de Blasio implemented an even stronger mandate that does not include an option for weekly testing and face- mask wearing for the unvaccinated, as the federal mandate does.

But rather than wait for a ruling on the federal mandate or have unvaccinated employees work from home, which is an option in New York, the company is set to fire all of its unvaccinated employees this month"

All entirely unnecessary.

How do we know? So many ways, but just yesterday,a tweet that was not permitted to be shared from Dr. Giroir to Dr. Gottlieb became public, as it is included in discovery in State of Missouri ex. rel. Schmitt, et. al. v. Biden currently in litigation.

In August 2021 Gottlieb emailed Twitter's senior public policy manager Todd O’Boyle to flag/prevent from being seen a tweet message by Dr. Brett Giroir, who had written "It's now clear #COVID19 natural immunity is superior to #vaccine immunity, by ALOT. There's no scientific justification for #vax proof if a person had prior infection." Besides being former FDA commissioner, a CNBC contributor, and a prominent voice on Covid public policy, Gottlieb was a senior board member at Pfizer, which depended on mRNA jabs for almost half its $81 billion in sales in 2021. Pfizer paid Gottlieb $365,000 for his work that year.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Maybe he changed his tune afterward as the obvious began to dawn even on those with vested interests. Kids never needed this. Healthy people never needed this.

He adjusted his guidance as the strains mutated to be milder, and as we got to Delta and Omicron, and the protection against transmission was diminished and it largely became an individual benefit instead of a communal one. There was a strong case for getting vaccinated amid original strain and alpha as the transmission protection was pretty robust against those strains (even if a person, themselves, wasn't at a huge individual risk)

That's not "changing ones tune" (as to imply that someone flip flopped), that's "altering one's dance after the tempo of the song changes."


People have been trying to use Omicron-centric statistics to attempt to retroactively justify/vindicate their positions (regarding the original strain) they had in 2020.


It'd be like a person who was anti-Jacket & Gloves in January waiting until May, and then saying "see, I was right all along, you don't need a jacket to go outside, and everyone else stopped wearing them too, proving that they secretly know I was right!"

 

[ThatRobGuy]

False. Malone did contribute, as outlined in a previous post

The "contribution" isn't the aspect people take objection to, it's the way he's touted by other people (and in some instances touted himself) to be "the inventor of this technology", as to imply that he's THE premier inventor or subject matter expert on the topic, purely because he aligns with them on this issue and feel it gives their arguments additional credibility. If Malone had been pro-mRNA vaccine, then people would be accusing him of being a "shill" (just like they do to offit) under the premise "he made all of his money in the vaccine industry"


Being one contributor on the research team, decades ago, for a technology that's matured a lot in the last decade, doesn't necessarily give him the final say on the subject.

Same way a software developer working on a team that contributed to Windows 2000 can't lay claim to "I invented Windows 10"

 

[CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN]

Oh yes it did; CA was one of the worst of the hypocritical lockdown states. In the midst of the pandemic, Newsom is out partying with his friends unmasked at the French Laundry, while the ordinary people were ordered to show "vaccine proof" just to get in anywhere (exemptions existed, but you had to know the law and many companies refused to follow it):

"Under the ordinance passed by the L.A. City Council, patrons will have to show proof of full vaccination at indoor areas including restaurants, bars, gyms, movie theaters, concert venues, convention centers, card rooms, play areas, museums, malls, play areas, spas, salons and indoor city facilities."

When Newson was at a party. He gave CA the okay to have 3 families at gatherings. . If anything they weren't. strict enough. Also we had to show proof of Vaccination or a negative COVID-19 test. We weren't forced to get vaccinated. Also a lot of people were ignoring guidelines. The states was encouraging vaccinations. But they weren't forcing them at all. Even nurses didn't have to get vaccinated. They had to show proof of a negative COVID-19 test. If they didn't get vaccinated.