Does the recently confirmed existence of UfO's pose a threat to Christianity?

JacksBratt

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The phrase used "it's out of this world" can be spoken loosely in an attempt to describe what is astonishing to the person. It need not imply that it really is from some other planet in our universe.. that is assumed, without any evidence, to be inhabited.. somehow.. oh, wait.. it was by another unassisted occurrence of evolution.. which is not something to subscribe to.. at least for a Christian who believes the Bible.

For one thing, there is no clear evidence that it is made by an ET who, what?, is in hiding somewhere on this earth for some unknown reason? And if so, why doesn't some alien seeking special task force .. by now.. go out to track them down? Why on earth would the authorities be doing nothing?.. or, maybe it's all a black ops that no one knows about. Except the media is telling everyone about the encounters with that UFO.

Does any of the reports about this sound strange.. open ended.. in that it leaves everyone with having to stretch the meaning of words to fit a narrative.

In my book, what it isn't saying .. is not a way to try to base a sound case upon.
K, this guy say's the maneuvers would rip apart an aircraft and kill the pilot.

He does say it could be Russians or Chinese but those explanations are low probability.



This site states that they did not say "out of this world" as you suggested but, rather, "not from this world". Small change... big difference in meaning.

 
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JacksBratt

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When I say "threatened" I mean it doesn't make me doubt the bible or doubt God. That is what the OP means as well. There are some people who simply think it's impossible for there to be life anywhere in the universe but on this planet. If they find even fossilized bacteria on Mars, they can only claim that it's a lie, or that Satan put it there to trick people (last I knew Satan couldn't create things), but if we were contacted by extraterrestrial life, in the flesh, there's only so long that they can hide their head in the sand and deny what's plain to see in front of them before their entire worldview and faith breaks, because they put limits on God's ability to create, declaring an absence of scripture about such things to be meaning they're impossible and God couldn't have created them, so how are they there? Maybe they stop believing in God entirely. That's along the line of atheist thinking, atheists don't take the bible as evidence of God's existence, and so they take the absence of "proof" of God's existence as "proof" that He does not exist.
For me, it's not going to break me if the unlikely event happens, because if it does happen, I just attribute it to there not being limits to God's power to create, and that creating more life in this universe than on Earth would glorify Him, so I'd accept that. Anything like that, I just think "wow, God created even more than we ever knew about, that's awesome!"
Thanks for clarifying.. I understand your view and agree... Hold on to the cross.
 
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JacksBratt

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Maybe it is more where you live as the only time I find this topic is on this board or odd places on Youtube. There are many alien cults in the US, last time this topic came up I posted the 'top 10' You do know that the US is the hot spot for alien cults?
If this is a common belief where you are, by all means, incorporate it into witnessing but I have never in my whole 53 years heard preaching incorporate anything about aliens into the gospel message. Only perhaps as a passing joke or in reference to "beam me up Scotty" or some such light-hearted banter.

Things are different in different parts of the world that's for sure. I am actually in Canada which is similar but different than the US... but, fads, trends and concepts are quite parallel.

My experience is that it is evolution that posses a much greater threat, and of course, aliens slide right into evolution because people who believe everything evolved by chance random processes are far more likely to also believe it evolved on other planets as well.
The Bible clearly teaches that demons are real and will try to deceive. The Bible also talks about the Nephilim in Genesis 6 which many like to ignore along with the rest of Genesis, but I see Genesis as being the foundation. It is foundational to many doctrines and Biblical principles including Satan and demons.

I totally agree.

People are still driven by the same basic things they always have been; greed and pride. Satan has always used a distorted mirror of what God wants or is or asks for. God said "but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die." So Satan came along and said “You will not surely die,” the serpent told her. 5“For God knows that in the day you eat of it, your eyes will be opened and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.” he distorted what God said.
We then see God bring about animal sacrifice in the Old Testament for sin as a type of shadow of Christ. Meanwhile, Satan had tribes sacrificing people.
Modern man is tempted by the idea of meeting people from other planets and visiting them, why would Satan not take advantage of that? One thing these alien cults share is the belief that one day the aliens will beam them up and take them away. Notice how the idea of being beamed away by aliens parallels the second coming of Christ and the taking away of the church? If God said something one way be sure Satan has his own distorted version of it. Nothing has changed.

Again, I agree totally.
 
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JacksBratt

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God said that his kingdom would abide forever. He created the universe. What threat to his kingdom could ever originate from inside that which he created?
With all do respect, the threats to His kingdom are insignificant... However, the threat to the souls of those who He wants in His kingdom is the one and only thing that Satan is concentrating on. Satan walks to and fro in this world..like a lion... looking for souls to devour...This is a huge deception with one soul purpose.... the same purpose for "you will not surely die"... have people question God.
 
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Norbert L

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Many people who have been discussing this idea for a long time ... claim that publicly admitting to it would be a problem for Christianity.

o the world and those playing christian, it will most certainly be an issue. We've been primed for this particular deception for decades.
After I briefly looked into the idea of aliens appearing now would then suddenly become a problem for Christianity, I found out that this topic started way back in the 12th century by leading Christian intellectuals. However they didn't exactly phrase it life on other planets, they were questioning the ability of God to create other worlds. In its' simplest form it was a discussion about God's omnipotence. The topic has surfaced throughout our history.

Briefly closer to our time in the 1800s iirc another argument became popular because some Christians believed He could create other worlds. The rational against Christianity was about Jesus having to die over and over again, because of the number of planets is so great that Jesus wouldn't have time to do anything else. It lost interest in the public eye because of an answer that made sense and had to do with omnipotence again.

The rational was along this line. Who could say that God is restricted to creating only one type of world which needs saving? To be omnipotent would also mean being able to create worlds/planets that don't need saving.

Is life on other planets a problem for Christianity? NO but we're being given a story that tells us it should be and it seems to be gathering steam. The way I see it, A Lie Can Travel Halfway Around the World While the Truth Is Putting On Its Shoes
 
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BobRyan

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After I briefly looked into the idea of aliens appearing now would then suddenly become a problem for Christianity, I found out that this topic started way back in the 12th century by leading Christian intellectuals. However they didn't exactly phrase it life on other planets, they were questioning the ability of God to create other worlds. In its' simplest form it was a discussion about God's omnipotence. The topic has surfaced throughout our history.

I don't have a problem with Hebrews 1 and Hebrews 11 being accepted as an indication that God created not only this world - but also "other worlds".

Heb 1. KJV
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

Heb 11 KJV
Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.
3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

God creating sinless beings - such as angels or such as beings on some other world(s) is probably not a problem for Christianity, or Bible believing Christians.

But the UFO "narrative" tends to get into other beings evolving (apart from created in a sinless state context that the Bible might allow) so in that context we must determine if they are hostile or trustworthy or if they are ... who-knows-what.

A universe where intelligent life evolves from bacteria and the more evolved the more advanced etc. A universe where beings that can cross the distance to contact our planet must be far in advance of us, and could have literally "any" hidden agenda.
 
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Norbert L

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if they are ... who-knows-what
Given the available information right now, that would be my guess. Other than being of unknown origin the only other thing we know for sure is the behavior is very possible intelligent.

Other than that it's still remains a creation vs. evolution issue with flashy bulbs, bells and whistles that want to turn it into something that it is not. Proof there is no God.
 
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nolidad

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I have had this topic brought up during discussion on Christianity with non believers.. It is actually a common one.

In an apologetic s class I taught, this came up and we had great discussion.
 
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BobRyan

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God said that his kingdom would abide forever. He created the universe. What threat to his kingdom could ever originate from inside that which he created?


So then you are asking about Lucifer? turned Satan? Causing the fall of 1/3 of the sinless angels... then the fall of all humanity (Adam and Eve) ---... then so God could save the lost... the death of the second person of the Godhead to save mankind? And billions of souls failing to arrive at eternal life but rather they end up in hell/lake-of-fire.

Given that such a thing is not measuring up to what some might term "a threat" then .. fine.. .no threats.

:)
 
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Al Touthentop

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So then you are asking about Lucifer? turned Satan? Causing the fall of 1/3 of the sinless angels... then the fall of all humanity (Adam and Eve) ---... then so God could save the lost... the death of the second person of the Godhead to save mankind? And billions of souls failing to arrive at eternal life but rather they end up in hell/lake-of-fire.

Given that such a thing is not measuring up to what some might term "a threat" then .. fine.. .no threats.

:)
There is no such person in the scriptures as 'Lucifer'. Lucifer is the Latin word for star it isn't a proper name, well it wasn't a proper name until Milton popularized it as such.

Satan is no threat to God's kingdom and creation. He might be a threat to us as individuals but God's kingdom? Nah.
 
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BobRyan

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There is no such person in the scriptures as 'Lucifer'. Lucifer is the Latin word for star .

the original Hebrew word means "shining one, light-bearer",
-- not uncommon to find names that indicate some trait

Satan is real -- but he used to be known as "Lucifer" before he fell. The point is - we have already seen this "fall into sin" not only on Earth with Adam and Eve - but even in heaven.
 
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BobRyan

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God said that his kingdom would abide forever. He created the universe. What threat to his kingdom could ever originate from inside that which he created?


So then you are asking about Lucifer? turned Satan? Causing the fall of 1/3 of the sinless angels... then the fall of all humanity (Adam and Eve) ---... then so God could save the lost... the death of the second person of the Godhead to save mankind? And billions of souls failing to arrive at eternal life but rather they end up in hell/lake-of-fire.

Given that such a thing is not measuring up to what some might term "a threat" then .. fine.. .no threats.

:)

reat to God's kingdom and creation. He might be a threat to us as individuals but God's kingdom? Nah.

It is not "us" who died on the cross for the sins of mankind .. it is God.
 
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Al Touthentop

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the original Hebrew word means "shining one, light-bearer",
-- not uncommon to find names that indicate some trait

Satan is real -- but he used to be known as "Lucifer" before he fell. The point is - we have already seen this "fall into sin" not only on Earth with Adam and Eve - but even in heaven.

At no place in the Bible is Satan referenced as Lucifer. The use of that word is in reference to the king of Babylon, not Satan.
 
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BobRyan

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At no place in the Bible is Satan referenced as Lucifer. The use of that word is in reference to the king of Babylon, not Satan.


Names are given and local persons identified - as a type of the much bigger truth as in Isiah 7,8,9 "Immanuel" -- God with us.

Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and bear a son, and they shall call his name Immanuel," which is translated, "God with us"(Matthew 1:23).

Is 7:
14 Therefore the Lord Himself will give you a sign: Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a Son, and shall call His name Immanuel. 15 Curds and honey He shall eat, that He may know to refuse the evil and choose the good. 16 For before the Child shall know to refuse the evil and choose the good, the land that you dread will be forsaken by both her kings.

Is 8
Then the Lord said to me, “Take for yourself a large tablet and write on it in ordinary letters: Swift is the booty, speedy is the prey. 2 And I will take to Myself faithful witnesses for testimony, Uriah the priest and Zechariah the son of Jeberechiah.” 3 So I approached the prophetess, and she conceived and gave birth to a son. Then the Lord said to me, “Name him Maher-shalal-hash-baz; 4 for before the boy knows how to cry out ‘My father’ or ‘My mother,’ the wealth of Damascus and the spoil of Samaria will be carried away before the king of Assyria.”
..
8 “Then it will sweep on into Judah, it will overflow and pass through,
It will reach even to the neck;
And the spread of its wings will fill the breadth of your land, O Immanuel.

Is 9
6 For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us;
And the government will rest on His shoulders;
And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Eternal Father, Prince of Peace
.
7 There will be no end to the increase of His government or of peace,
On the throne of David and over his kingdom,
To establish it and to uphold it with justice and righteousness
From then on and forevermore.
The zeal of the Lord of hosts will accomplish this.

==============

Lucifer


Isaiah 14
The Fall of Lucifer

12 “How you are fallen from heaven,
O Lucifer, son of the morning!
How you are cut down to the ground,
You who weakened the nations!
13 For you have said in your heart:
I will ascend into heaven,
I will exalt my throne above the stars of God;
I will also sit on the mount of the congregation
On the farthest sides of the north;
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds,
I will be like the Most High.’
15 Yet you shall be brought down to Sheol,
To the lowest depths of the Pit.
...
(you)
17 Who made the world as a wilderness
And destroyed its cities,


Applied to a local individual but also applied to Satan.

So also in Ezek 28.
 
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Al Touthentop

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Isaiah 14
The Fall of Lucifer

12 “How you are fallen from heaven,
O Lucifer, son of the morning!
How you are cut down to the ground,
You who weakened the nations!
13 For you have said in your heart:
I will ascend into heaven,
I will exalt my throne above the stars of God;
I will also sit on the mount of the congregation
On the farthest sides of the north;
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds,
I will be like the Most High.’
15 Yet you shall be brought down to Sheol,
To the lowest depths of the Pit.
...
(you)
17 Who made the world as a wilderness
And destroyed its cities,


Applied to a local individual but also applied to Satan.

So also in Ezek 28.

God tells Isaiah that the words he is about to tell him are for the king of Babylon. Show where these words are 'also applied to Satan'
 
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BobRyan

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God tells Isaiah that the words he is about to tell him are for the king of Babylon. Show where these words are 'also applied to Satan'

The king of babylon "did on fall from heaven" nor did he claim he would set his throne above the stars - nothing like that is Bible recorded history for babylon.

Very much like Ezek 28 and Satan.

2 “Son of man, say to the leader of Tyre, ‘Thus says the Lord God,


“Because your heart is lifted up
And you have said, ‘I am a god,
I sit in the seat of gods
In the heart of the seas’
;
Yet you are a man and not God,
Although you make your heart like the heart of God—
3 Behold, you are wiser than Daniel;
There is no secret that is a match for you.
4 “By your wisdom and understanding
You have acquired riches for yourself
And have acquired gold and silver for your treasuries.
5 “By your great wisdom, by your trade
You have increased your riches
And your heart is lifted up because of your riches—

..

11 Again the word of the Lord came to me saying, 12 “Son of man, take up a lamentation over the king of Tyre and say to him, ‘Thus says the Lord God,

“You had the seal of perfection,
Full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13 “You were in Eden, the garden of God;
Every precious stone was your covering:
The ruby, the topaz and the diamond;
The beryl, the onyx and the jasper;
The lapis lazuli, the turquoise and the emerald;
And the gold, the workmanship of your settings and sockets,
Was in you.
On the day that you were created
They were prepared.
14 “You were the anointed cherub who covers,
And I placed you there.
You were on the holy mountain of God;
You walked in the midst of the stones of fire.
15 “You were blameless in your ways
From the day you were created

Until unrighteousness was found in you.
16 “By the abundance of your trade
You were internally filled with violence,
And you sinned;
Therefore I have cast you as profane
From the mountain of God.

And I have destroyed you, O covering cherub,
From the midst of the stones of fire.
17 “Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty;
You corrupted your wisdom by reason of your splendor.
 
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Al Touthentop

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The king of babylon "did on fall from heaven" nor did he claim he would set his throne above the stars - nothing like that is Bible recorded history for babylon.

Very much like Ezek 28 and Satan.

You are reading the passages literally. The passages are prophetic and written in symbolic language. They are addressed to specific people. Ezek 28 is also not addressed to Satan, but the King of Tyre.

Is. 40:3-5
A voice of one calling:
“In the wilderness prepare
the way for the Lord;
make straight in the desert
a highway for our God.
4 Every valley shall be raised up,
every mountain and hill made low;
the rough ground shall become level,
the rugged places a plain.
5 And the glory of the Lord will be revealed,
and all people will see it together.
For the mouth of the Lord has spoken.”

When did John the baptist do landscaping or roadwork? He didn't and the prophecies about him were figurative not literal.

The King of Tyre and the King of Babylon were exalted over other men as kings. The old testament often uses this sort of language to denote authority and privilege. Assigning Satan to these passages isn't appropriate. It's injection into the text. Nothing in the text tells us we should be thinking of Satan in either passage.
 
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Three thoughts on this very interesting subject:

1. Regarding the OP, it is quite possible these "Unidentified Aerial Phenomena" are next generation weapons systems, and this disclosure is disinformation, just like the disinformation used to conceal the development of the U2 spyplane, the hypersonic A12 Oxcart and SR-71 Blackbird spyplanes, the HaveBlue prototype for what became Senior Trend, the F-117 "Stealth Fighter", which operated in complete secrecy out of Area 51 for the first few years of its service life, and other experimental aircraft such as TacitBlue, the rumoured Aurora spyplane, a very appealing prototype fighter concept from the mid 1990s the name of which I forget, the YF-22 and YF-23 Advanced Tactical Fighters and their "X Plane" prototypes", and of course the F-22 and F-35 themselves, and most recently and famously, the stealth Blackhawk helicopters developed at Groom Lake (Area 51) used in the raid that killed Osama bin Laden (one of which was unfortunately lost during the mission). There are no doubt further experimental aircraft in development. And Russia has been working on an unmanned, hypersonic drone/missile hybrid.

2. If these are not advanced weapons, I think they are demons, because we are so far away from the nearest habitable planet, and projects like SETI have as of yet not detected any radio signals indicative of alien intelligence, which seems very unlikely (we would expect at least some accidental transmissions as a result of leaky electronics). Now, why do I think these UFOs would be demons? If we look at the writings of the early church fathers and of the apostles, it becomes very clear: Paul refers to the devil as "The Prince of the Power of the Air" or equivalent phrases. And in the Patristic writings, if we look at the Lausiac Histories, and within them the Sayings of the Desert Fathers, and related literature such as the Ladder of Divine Ascent by John Climacus, we find many instances of demons manifesting apparent flight. Often they would tell a solitary monk (or anchorite) his sins had been forgiven and that God had granted him the power of flight, in order to lure him off a cliff, resulting in the poor monk tragically splattering in the canyon below. Following these grim incidents, many cenobitic monasteries (formally organized abbeys or monasteries where the brethren are under the rule of an abbot and the supervision of novice masters, priors, and other leaders within the monastery) adopted a monastic rule that discouraged or prohibited the brethren from looking into the sky.

There are also reports of experienced solitaries and other monks and nuns, who became true spiritual warriors, with great abilities of discernment, tending to avoid looking into the sky, because they had gained the ability to perceive the bodiless powers, and knew the dangers of looking at demons.

As recently as the 19th century, we find this instruction repeated in a famous instruction manual for monks, written by Vladyka Ignatius Brianchaninov, a Russian bishop (who like all Russian bishops, started out his career as a simple monk, and then became a monastic priest, and then the abbot of a monastery, before being entrusted with a diocese - note that Russian parish priests are mostly married men with children, this applies only to bishops in the various branches of the Russian Orthodox Church). Vladyka Ignatius stresses that monks should look to the ground for reasons of humility, as a symbol of their penitent lifestyle, but he also does mention the dangers of looking towards the sky.

Finally, we have yet another Russian Orthodox monk, only this monk was an American, who converted, following a life of homosexual debauchery in the North Beach neighborhood of San Francisco in the 1950s. In the 1960s, Eugene Rose was called by Jesus, and felt the need to repent; he was specifically saved by a Russian Orthodox church in San Francisco, and by the famous bishop Vladyka John Maximovitch, and he was tonsured a monk, taking on the name Seraphim. He later founded a monastery north of Redding, California, which is still thriving today, and in the 1970s, before his death, he wrote a famous book entitled Orthodoxy and the Religion of the Future, in which he analyzed from an Eastern Orthodox perspective the various cults which were thriving in the late 1970s, such as the Hare Krishnas, Transcendental Meditation, Scientology, and the UFO movement. He was completely convinced of the demonic nature of UFOs.

Based on these ancient testimonies, I believe firmly that any UFO which is not a military test aircraft or a peculiar weather phenomenon is certainly demonic.

I should also add that the rules against looking into the sky were intended for monks engaged in a life of continual prayer and extreme ascetic discipline; they were not intended for laity. I myself love looking into the sky and seeing a beautiful sunset, and mercifully our Lord has kept the veil closed for me, so I have not seen any angels or demons in the air. This is particularly fortunate as one of my great loves in life is aviation, and I think piloting an aircraft would be extremely distracting if one was witness to what many monks and nuns have reported seeing in the heavens over the centuries. At a minimum, one would have to fly on instruments. :p

So, since I strongly doubt anyone in a monastery is allowed to use Internet forums, if you are reading this, I think we can assert that it is safe for you to look into the skies and view the beautiful sunsets and other aspects of God's creation without fear. This might change if you decide to enter a monastery, but even then, such a rule would be something that would be given to you by your abbot, and I would expect the majority of monks do not see celestial phenomena of the sort warned about, and there are certainly many monks who do look into the skies safely.

The specific cases I mention are extreme examples recorded in the annals of Christianity; they are relevant in this thread only because we are dealing with a subject that is particularly extreme.
 
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