Does sola scriptura make the bible a new member of the trinity?

[Bible Highlighter]

Alas, It’s like going through legality with you. You also need the spirit. Never forget that. Take care sir, @Bible Highlighter. No judgement or hate here, just have nothing more really to say.

Nowhere do I deny that we need God to help us understand God's Word and to be guided in this life. The Bible even talks about these things. I am not denying that there is knowledge that can be gained outside His Word like the creation showing forth that God exists, and real world examples (parables) showing forth the truth of His Word (or spiritual truths), but these things are at a very small percentage and they are not how we build doctrine, and or how we gain the primary bulk of instruction in righteousness. Without the Bible, we would not be able to have doctrine, or faith, or instruction in righteousness as God desires. The Bible is how we learn about being saved. It is the thing that God uses for His Spirit to save people and for His Spirit to change their hearts. The moment you think you do not need the Bible or you need less of it, the more problems will arise for you spiritually. So don't speak against the source of which God has chosen to save people. For faith comes by hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17).

Side Note:

We would also not know about how men are without excuse there is God by the creation and or the proper real world examples (Parables) without His Word. Again, the Bible plays the key focal point for us even knowing about these things, as well. For you could not without certainly claim such truths without the Bible. For what external biblical thing can you use without the Bible. It all comes back to the Bible. Why? Because God wants us to have faith and the onlly way we can have that is by God's Word (the Bible).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I have read your posts and know from previous experience, that we will disagree on a number of issues, some of which are fundamental in nature.

The thread is about whether sola scriptura results in bibdolatry, in general - for most people the answer is no. However, in some cases the answer is yes.

Since this side conversation is off topic for the thread, I'll just leave it at that.

And in my discovery, those who are not for Bible Alone will run and venture off into all manner of false spiritual ways like man made traditions, another holy book, false visions, tarot cards, etc.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

And in my discovery, those who are not for Bible Alone will run and venture off into all manner of false spiritual ways like man made traditions, another holy book, false visions, tarot cards, etc.

In terms of false spirituality. I've noticed something similar amongst Christian Churches, they say they're about the bible ... but prayers can be used like witchcraft, and the spiritual unity that is common amongst them resembles modalism instead of trinity.

So, there are problems regardless if the beliefs look good "on paper" or not.

 

[Clare73]

Perhaps a review of Jesus' view of the Scriptures would be helpful.
Jesus believed the OT was the "word of God" in every detail (Matthew 15:6; Luke 5:1, Luke 11:28; John 10:35)
He believed that every jot and tittle of the Law (the OT word for the Scriptures) was the very truth of God, vested with the authority of God and backed by by power of God (Matthew 5:17-19).

To emphasize that the OT was the infallible (wholly trustworthy and reliable), inerrant (wholly true) word of God, Jesus used his regular formula for solemn assertion ("Truly, truly I say to you") when he stated "until heaven and earth disappear, not one tittle (smallest stroke of the writing pen) will by any means disappear from the Law" (Scriptures). (Matthew 5:18; Luke 16:17)

He treated arguments from Scripture as having clinching force. When he said, "It is written," that was final. There was no appeal against Scripture, for "the Scripture cannot be broken." (Matthew 4:4-10; John 10:35). God's Word holds good forever.
He constantly scolded the Jews for their ignorance and neglect of Scripture: "Are you not in error because you do not know the Scriptures?" "Have you not read. . .?" "Go and learn what this means..."
(Mark 12:24; Matthew 12:3-5, Matthew 19:4, Matthew 21:16, Matthew 21:42, Matthew 9:13).

Likewise, Jesus himself submitted to the OT as the Word of God. He lived a life of obedience to Scripture (Luke 4:17-21; Matthew 8:16-17, Matthew 11:2-5),
and then he died in obedience to Scripture (Luke 18:31; Mark 8:31, Mark 9:31, Mark 10:33-34; Matthew 26:24; Luke 22:37; Matthew 26:53-56).
When he arose, he explained who he was by the Scriptures (Luke 24:44-47, Luke 24:25).
He presented himself to the Jews as the fulfiller of Scripture (John 5:39-40, John 5:46-47).

And in asserting to the Jews that the OT bore divine authoritative witness to him, Jesus thereby bore divine authoritative witness to it.
Belief in the authority and truth of the Scriptures was the foundation of Jesus' whole ministry.

And that included the historical accounts:
Sodom and Gomorrah (Matthew 10:15),
Jonah and the whale (Matthew 12:39-40),
creation account (as God's words, though they are the writer's words, Matthew 19:4-6),
murder of Abel (Matthew 23:35),
Noah and the flood (Matthew 24:37-39),
burning bush and call of Moses (Mark 12:26),
Elijah and the provision for the widow (Luke 4:25-26),
Elisha and Naaman, the Syrian leper (Luke 4:27),
Lot's wife turned into a pillar of salt (Luke 17:31-33).
plague of snakes and brazen serpent (John 3:14),
manna from heaven in the desert for 40 years (John 6:31, John 6:49),
Abraham still alive (John 8:39-40).

According to Jesus, the Word of God written enjoys absolute authority.

I'm not hoping to improve on Jesus' view and, therefore, have made it my view also.

You should do the same.

Yes sorry @Clare73 don’t have time for any of this. I do thank you for your time and dedication of replying to me but very sorry to inform you that talking to me the way you do as by using scripture and not talking as a human being doesn’t help anything. Okay?

I guess I was thinking there can be no better model than Jesus for the true view of Scripture,
which I note is not your view.

 

[GallagherM]

You know that I agree with you bible highlighter.

The bible is useful and important filled with many truths about many different subjects and it is good for those who desire to read the bible and learn more about God how useful it is for them spiritually.

You are right, and I agree. - I believe that I was speaking more in terms of those who use the bible wrongly towards others, even to the point of manipulating them.

 

[GallagherM]

You are right Clare73, I agree with you.

Though we have more to go on than just Jesus Christ alone as well; you know we are saved by grace through faith.

Believers are suppose to even by living in their faith die with Christ - dying to their own self (because you and I were born into a world were it was always first - about our self). Dying to ourself or dying to christ is where we have to die to our way of desiring to be greedy, desiring to be hateful towards others. We can be loving towards others by the gentleness of explaining what they may be doing is wrong which in turn may have a person hate us but doing it out of love for God; and for the other person there is nothing wrong with that. Though people will think you are for doing such.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

In terms of false spirituality. I've noticed something similar amongst Christian Churches, they say they're about the bible ... but prayers can be used like witchcraft, and the spiritual unity that is common amongst them resembles modalism instead of trinity.

So, there are problems regardless if the beliefs look good "on paper" or not.

It is true that a church can claim to be Bible Alone and hold to many various errors like Modalism or a denial of the Trinity.

But one is more open to error if they do not make the Bible Alone their final authority.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

While I may sometimes use the term Sola Scriptura,
in matters of faith, and practice of our faith,
for clarity I prefer the term:

"Bible Alone + the Anointing of the Spirit to Understand it.” ​

I addressed this in this post thread here a while back.

Reevaluating the term Sola Scriptura (Bible alone + God giving understanding on it is the truth).

 

[Gregory Thompson]

It is true that a church can claim to be Bible Alone and hold to many various errors like Modalism or a denial of the Trinity.

But one is more open to error if they do not make the Bible Alone their final authority.

Not necessarily, bible alone can lull people into a false sense of security. Since the present age of church resembles the pre-captivity Israel and Judah - a state of the church where people honor the original doctrines with their lips, but in the actual heart manifestation and spiritual reality - their heart is far from Him.

Everything changed subtly over generations, and will continue. Since it is up to God to remove the veil blinding, and each person's role to seek Him on seeing things as they actually are.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Not necessarily, bible alone can lull people into a false sense of security. Since the present age of church resembles the pre-captivity Israel and Judah - a state of the church where people honor the original doctrines with their lips, but in the actual heart manifestation and spiritual reality - their heart is far from Him.

Everything changed subtly over generations, and will continue. Since it is up to God to remove the veil blinding, and each person's role to seek Him on seeing things as they actually are.

First, you quote Scripture to make your point. If you are not Bible Alone, then you cannot borrow from the Bible to make your case unless you have a verse that says that we are not to use Scripture alone to build doctrine and instruction in righteousness. Second, you are not offering what exactly is worthy as doctrine, and instruction in righteousness that is outside the Bible that we need to add. So what do you believe we need to add? Messages from visions or dreams? Do we need to follow another holy book? Tarot cards? Silent meditation? Occult numerology?

 

[Gregory Thompson]

First, you quote Scripture to make your point. If you are not Bible Alone, then you cannot borrow from the Bible to make your case

Non-sense, this is a rule you made up that I am not obligated to follow.

Since BA was not invented as a theology until late in church history, and people have been using the bible without BA, I am free to do so anyway.

 

[RDKirk]

I think when a person quotes Scripture in prayer around others it is for the benefit of others and for themselves. I don't know of any person on the planet who thinks God does not know what His own Word says.

That sounds like there should have been a pre-prayer briefing to bring everyone in the room up to speed on what the prayer was going to be about and why it would be valid.

And I'm not saying that facetiously. There probably ought to be some level-setting discussion before launching a corporate prayer.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

That sounds like there should have been a pre-prayer briefing to bring everyone in the room up to speed on what the prayer was going to be about and why it would be valid.

And I'm not saying that facetiously. There probably ought to be some level-setting discussion before launching a corporate prayer.

Sorry, I don't agree. People are always going to say things like this and misunderstanding is bound to happen. Even in the Bible there are things written whereby one can easily misunderstand it. God wants us to grow and learn and study. Same with life. We need to mature and grow and learn the basics of life. If a person is that unknowledgable to actually think that a person is quoting a Bible verse during prayer for God to be reminded of what He wrote, they have a lot of growing to do. Most believers know that God knows all things (Especially His own Word). I know of no believer that would think this way. In fact, it is illogical to even think this way.

Also, extensive man made rules and programs in my opinion is the worst thing to do. People learn better by experience and study on their own and in walking with the Lord. The moment we dumb things down too much... people will not value the truth that they fought so hard to find in the first place. Fellowship is not about distancing ourselves from others with programs, but it is about making friends in the Lord and in loving them.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Non-sense, this is a rule you made up that I am not obligated to follow.

Because you know it will blow a hole in your rejection of Bible Alone.
Anyone who stands for the truth has no problem in defending the truth.
Your not defending your position which means there is no merit to it.

A person cannot deny the weakness of the argument of rejecting Bible Alone. One can be open to accepting other supposed holy books like the Mormons, and Muslims if they are not Bible Alone. One can be open to dabbling in Tarot cards, or occult numerology. One can be open to accepting visions and dreams that contradict the Bible. One can be open to accepting traditions at a church that goes against the teachings of the Bible. The list is endless of the problems that a person can open themselves up to if they don't accept the Bible Alone as their final Word of authority.

Since BA was not invented as a theology until late in church history, and people have been using the bible without BA, I am free to do so anyway.

These are just your own thoughts or the thoughts of others that you have latched on to. Again, I would encourage you to meditate on 2 Timothy 3:16-17. Ask yourself the question does “all” mean “all” in this passage? Do you want to seek to change the word “all” in this passage because it does not align with what you want to be true? Also, ask yourself, why is there no other verse or passage in the New Testament that talks about how we get doctrine and instruction in righteousness besides Scripture? Where does the New Testament tell us about how Jesus and the apostles teach us about how there is another form of teaching besides Scripture that we must rely upon?

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Because you know it will blow a hole in your rejection of Bible Alone.
Anyone who stands for the truth has no problem in defending the truth.
Your not defending your position which means there is no merit to it.

A person cannot deny the weakness of the argument of rejecting Bible Alone. One can be open to accepting other supposed holy books like the Mormons, and Muslims if they are not Bible Alone. One can be open to dabbling in Tarot cards, or occult numerology. One can be open to accepting visions and dreams that contradict the Bible. One can be open to accepting traditions at a church that goes against the teachings of the Bible. The list is endless of the problems that a person can open themselves up to if they don't accept the Bible Alone as their final Word of authority.



These are just your own thoughts or the thoughts of others that you have latched on to. Again, I would encourage you to meditate on 2 Timothy 3:16-17. Ask yourself the question does “all” mean “all” in this passage? Do you want to seek to change the word “all” in this passage because it does not align with what you want to be true? Also, ask yourself, why is there no other verse or passage in the New Testament that talks about how we get doctrine and instruction in righteousness besides Scripture? Where does the New Testament tell us about how Jesus and the apostles teach us about how there is another form of teaching besides Scripture that we must rely upon?

It doesn't seem like you need me here to have this conversation.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

It doesn't seem like you need me here to have this conversation.

Deflection of the points I made only shows you don't want to deal with the truth, dear sir. For it is important to know the truth because the truth sets us free.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

It doesn't seem like you need me here to have this conversation.

John 17:17 says, “Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.”

 

[Gregory Thompson]

John 17:17 says, “Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.”

Deflection of the points I made only shows you don't want to deal with the truth, dear sir. For it is important to know the truth because the truth sets us free.

So if it doesn't set anyone free, then it's not truth, right?

Lots of bible alone theologies like that.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

So if it doesn't set anyone free, then it's not truth, right?

Lots of bible alone theologies like that.

God's Word can set us free if we allow it. But we have to put it into practice. We have to speak God's Word out loud. For faith comes by hearing the Word of God.

Anyways, by your words here, it gives me the impression like you don't beleive the Bible is God's Word and it should not be followed. Is that what you are saying?

 

[Gregory Thompson]

God's Word can set us free if we allow it. But we have to put it into practice. We have to speak God's Word out loud. For faith comes by hearing the Word of God.

Anyways, by your words here, it gives me the impression like you don't beleive the Bible is God's Word and it should not be followed. Is that what you are saying?

I would appreciate it, if you would not try to put words in my mouth.

In general, the bible is an awesome book, I love it. I just simply disagree with the way you use it in particular, no one can be set free from teaching like that.