Does sinful man deserve God’s justice?

[Hammster]

Well that statement has no truth in it. We are saved by GRACE through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God *EPHESIANS 2:8. OBEDIENCE to God's LAW is not how we are saved it is the FRUIT of God's work in us as we BELIEVE and FOLLOW his WORD. If our faith has no fruit it is dead *JAMES 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *MATTHEW 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50. Why are you pretending I am saying things I am not? How can you separate the God's LAW from the Gospel when it is the LAW that leads us to Christ that we might be forgiven through faith *GALATIANS 3:22-25?

I’m not separating it. I’m saying that our sin (violating the law) has been dealt with on the cross so that if we believe, there’s nothing more we have to do to be saved or stay saved.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

3 PM. But I have to leave soon....
Ditto...

Yea I am done here I think. Not getting much of a discussion from the OP here and getting late my time as well sis. Nice to see you. Hope to catch up more latter.

God bless.

 

[GodsGrace101]

Let me explain it this way. I have five kids. Everyone of them is given chores, and instruction. Sometimes, they don’t do their chores. Sometimes, they ignore instruction. In these cases there is discipline because like God, we discipline our children (Hebrews 12). But in no case do they ever stop being our children.

So there’s nothing they have to do to be our children. But that doesn’t mean they have nothing that they have to do.

You know H,
This comparing GOD WHO IS SOVEREIGN
to US, who are finite...is beginning to tire me out.

You're getting into OSAS...is this what this thread is about?

My point is that Jesus spent over 3 years TEACHING....

He could have said to just believe in Him and we'd be fine in just 5 minutes flat.

God is God. He wants to be obeyed.
God is not like our daddy's.
If He was, then how could He send people to hell?

Are YOUR punishments to your children so severe?
NO. So please let's stop doing the comparison stuff which is to allow children to help them understand God but will not work on adults.

BTW, some parents do DISINHERIT their children when it becomes impossible to get along with them and the parent is mistreated by them. They might still be CHILDREN...but they're not getting any of the INHERITANCE.

Later...

 

[Hammster]

God is obligated to forgive us our sins since WE are not the ones that CREATED sin and so a JUST God cannot hold us responsible for something we did not do.

Wow. That’s completely unbiblical. If God is obligated to do anything, then grace and mercy are meaningless.

 

[Hammster]

You know H,
This comparing GOD WHO IS SOVEREIGN
to US, who are finite...is beginning to tire me out.

You're getting into OSAS...is this what this thread is about?

My point is that Jesus spent over 3 years TEACHING....

He could have said to just believe in Him and we'd be fine in just 5 minutes flat.

God is God. He wants to be obeyed.
God is not like our daddy's.
If He was, then how could He send people to hell?

Are YOUR punishments to your children so severe?
NO. So please let's stop doing the comparison stuff which is to allow children to help them understand God but will not work on adults.

BTW, some parents do DISINHERIT their children when it becomes impossible to get along with them and the parent is mistreated by them. They might still be CHILDREN...but they're not getting any of the INHERITANCE.

Later...

I think you are on to something. We aren’t all God’s children.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I’m not separating it. I’m saying that our sin (violating the law) has been dealt with on the cross so that if we believe, there’s nothing more we have to do to be saved or stay saved.

Of course your trying to seprate God's LAW from the Gospel. Didn't you post...

Hammster said: ↑ You will preach the law. I will preach the gospel.

You cannot preach the Gospel without preaching the law brother as the law brings us to Christ that we might be forgiven by faith *GALATIANS 3:22-25

I see your not interested in answering my questions so I am about done here. Thanks for the discussion.

Wish you all the best

 

[Hammster]

Of course your trying to seprate God's LAW from the Gospel. Didn't you post...

You cannot preach the Gospel without preaching the law brother as the law brings us to Christ that we might be forgiven by faith *GALATIANS 3:22-25

I see your not interested in answering my questions so I am about done here. Thanks for the discussion.

Wish you all the best

Bye.

 

[Bobber]

Could you actually answer the question in the OP? There’s no need to take this off topic with the first post.

Actually that poster didn't take it off subject which is shown by your later post which responds with a question when she told you no.

 

[Hammster]

Actually that poster didn't take it off subject which is shown by your later post which responds with a question when she told you no.

Okay.

 

[Bobber]

Simple straightforward question. Does sinful man (all of us) deserve the justice of God?

Actually that's not a straightforward question for the reason answers can rightly vary depending from what standpoint one deserves the justice of God. From the standpoint that they weren't offered a way of escape or from the standpoint that they were but didn't take it. So a straightforward question to you is this....what is your real intent of asking the question? Is it to prop up a Calvinistic position that all men deserve the justice of God period which would exclude him having to offer salvation? So maybe you could tell us what is at the heart of your question.

 

[Tone]

So what we deserve is justice. What we receive, as believers, is mercy.

How about this for a question:

Does the new creature in Messiah deserve the Creator's justice?

Yes.

As a sinner, all (the only thing) we get and deserve is His justice, because no matter what, we remain His creation.

As His sons and daughters, we get His justice and so much more!

So, you believe that there will be no law and no justice in the new heavens and the new earth?

 

[Hammster]

Actually that's not a straightforward question for the reason answers can rightly vary depending from what standpoint one deserves the justice of God. From the standpoint that they weren't offered a way of escape or from the standpoint that they were but didn't take it. So a straightforward question to you is this....what is your real intent of asking the question? Is it to prop up a Calvinistic position that all men deserve the justice of God period which would exclude him having to offer salvation? So maybe you could tell us what is at the heart of your question.

I was curious as to whether people thought sinful folks deserved the justice of God.

 

[Hammster]

So, you believe that there will be no law and no justice in the new heavens and the new earth?

I suppose that depends on what’s considered law. If there is, there will be no need for justice because we will obey perfectly.

 

[Tone]

I suppose that depends on what’s considered law. If there is, there will be no need for justice because we will obey perfectly.

Oh, so you view justice as a punishment...I don't. It is a Holy quality of Yah.

 

[Tone]

His justice is not His wrath...is it?

 

[Hammster]

Oh, so you view justice as a punishment...I don't. It is a Holy quality of Yah.

Okay.

 

[Tone]

His justice is not His wrath...is it?

I have in mind this as the definition:

": conformity to truth, fact, or reason : CORRECTNESS"
Definition of JUSTICE

So, yes I believe that law and justice are very close together.

 

[Hammster]

Oh, so you view justice as a punishment...I don't. It is a Holy quality of Yah.

I do make a distinction between justice and God being just.

 

[Tone]

I do make a distinction between justice and God being just.

Oh, you mean like when He levels the playing field?


*Yes He makes it conform according to law.

 

[Hammster]

Oh, you mean like when He levels the playing field?


*Yes He makes it conform according to law.

Justice is that the wages of sin is death. Just is that He follows through.