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Featured Does our loving God send people to hell?

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by mkgal1, Mar 18, 2018.

  1. Tree of Life

    Tree of Life Hide The Pain

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    From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

    1861 - Mortal sin is a radical possibility of human freedom, as is love itself. It results in the loss of charity and the privation of sanctifying grace, that is, of the state of grace. If it is not redeemed by repentance and God's forgiveness, it causes exclusion from Christ's kingdom and the eternal death of hell, for our freedom has the power to make choices for ever, with no turning back.

    To deny hell would be to deny this teaching of the church. That would amount to heresy.
     
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  2. Tree of Life

    Tree of Life Hide The Pain

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    You're correct that the English language wasn't around in Jesus' day. But this isn't saying much. The concept of a place of eternal judgment where the cursed of God are cast was certainly around in Jesus' day and he very much taught it.
     
  3. royal priest

    royal priest debtor to grace

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    Jesus tells us that fear of God and Hell ought to be a VERY strong motivator for us to do what is right: Matthew 10:28
    Jesus said that He will cast people into Hell: Matthew 13:41-42
    Peter says God also casts angels into Hell: 2 Peter 2:4
     
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  4. Ματθαίος

    Ματθαίος Member

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    Of course He does.
     
  5. S.O.J.I.A.

    S.O.J.I.A. Dynamic UNO

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    ........yep..
     
  6. Christo.doulos

    Christo.doulos New Member

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    Matthew 25:41-46 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.’ Then they also will answer, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to you?’ Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’ And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

    Luke 13:1-5 "There were some present at that very time who told him about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices. And he answered them, “Do you think that these Galileans were worse sinners than all the other Galileans, because they suffered in this way? No, I tell you; but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish. Or those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell and killed them: do you think that they were worse offenders than all the others who lived in Jerusalem? No, I tell you; but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.”

    Matthew 10:28 "And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather fear him who can destroy both soul and body in hell"

    Jude 1:7 "just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire."

    Revelation 14:9-11 "And another angel, a third, followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and its image and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand, he also will drink the wine of God’s wrath, poured full strength into the cup of his anger, and he will be tormented with fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night, these worshipers of the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name.”

    Revelation 20:7-15 "And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. And they marched up over the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, but fire came down from heaven and consumed them, and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever. Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. From his presence earth and sky fled away, and no place was found for them. And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done. And the sea gave up the dead who were in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead who were in them, and they were judged, each one of them, according to what they had done. Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire."
     
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  7. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith Well-Known Member Supporter

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    People send their selves to Hell because they refuse to repent and turn to The Lord Yehushua Messiah.
     
  8. Chris V++

    Chris V++ Socially Distancing Supporter

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    I sometimes watch near death experience accounts on Youtube to remind myself of the reality of heaven and hell. Tyrone, for example, goes to hell after a serious car accident and returns to describe his hell experience. No cloven hooves or pitch forks btw.

    Jesus did describe hell in a parable.:

    Luke 16:19-31 New King James Version (NKJV)
    The Rich Man and Lazarus

    19 “There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and fared sumptuously every day. 20 But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, 21 desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man’s table. Moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. 22 So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

    24 “Then he cried and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.’ 25 But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented. 26 And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.’

    27 “Then he said, ‘I beg you therefore, father, that you would send him to my father’s house, 28 for I have five brothers, that he may testify to them, lest they also come to this place of torment.’ 29 Abraham said to him, ‘They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.’ 30 And he said, ‘No, father Abraham; but if one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.’ 31 But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’”
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2018
  9. PeaceByJesus

    PeaceByJesus Unworthy servant for the Worthy Lord + Savior

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    Whatever Rohr is trying to do here as regards how God can send souls to Hell, the fact is He can, does and will, which in no way conflicts with His mercy and compassion towards sinners. For "God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble." (James 4:6)

    Thus,
    • And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven. But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. (Matthew 8:11-12)
    • Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and will gather the wheat into his garner; but the chaff he will burn with fire unquenchable. (Luke 3:17)
    • There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out. (Luke 13:28)
    • The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. (Matthew 13:41-42)
    • So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just, And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. (Matthew 13:49-50)Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. (Matthew 22:13)
    • The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. (Matthew 24:50-51)
    • And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. (Matthew 25:30)
    • When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: (Matthew 25:31-32) Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: (Matthew 25:41) And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal. (Matthew 25:46)
    • And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched: Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched. And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched: Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched. And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire: Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched. (Mark 9:43-48)
    • And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame. (Luke 16:22-24)
    • Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house: For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. (Luke 16:27-28)
    • Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day. (2 Thessalonians 1:9-10)
    • The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name. (Revelation 14:10-11)
    • And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone. (Revelation 19:20)
    • And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. (Revelation 20:10)
    Note: attempting to disallow eternal torment on disputable grammatical grounds cannot prevail since it is hardly tenable that the Lord's dire warnings, including hacking off appendage or gouging out eyes to avoid be cast into unquenchable hell fire, would have much of a deterrent effect if this simply refers to being burned up. Being able to indulge in decades of fulfilling lusts in exchange for momentary punishment would be considered worth it by most who seek to fulfill such.

    Moreover, people will be cast into the same lake of fire the devil will, who shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever, and the beast and false prophet were still there after 1,000 years.

    In addition,the account of the rich man and Lazarus in Luke 16:19-31 not a parable, in which real names are never used, and which stories employ known physical realities which correspond to spiritual realities (i.e. "tares" = "the children of the wicked"), and never teach science fiction in this correspondence. However, if there is no such thing as being cognizant of torment after death, then for the first and only time the Lord would be engaging in science fiction. And it is also stretch to make the rich man in Hell correspond to some mere spiritual reality that is not that of the afterlife and Hell.​
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2018
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  10. Blade

    Blade Veteran Supporter

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    We can debate this all we want. Our PERSONAL feelings about this GOD and what He WILL DO.. a we get no say what so ever. Like it or not cry weep joy what ever it will never have ANY impact on Him. Angels were with God since they were created. So we see why no salvation for them. They KNOW what they left. Now we only know SIN. The Father knows this..thus Christ. But just as some angels fell some HUMANS will also. There are "MAN" that if GOD forced so sot speak them to live for ever with Him would be like hell to them. There really are people that KNOW He is real. They KNOW Christ came died.. yet reject it. They know.

    Hell was not made for man. YOU were given a free choice. What kind of GOD would He be if He forced His will on us? Is not that whats being talked about here? He loved the world.. believe in Him and you will not die but live forever. "For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved." Did you read that word "MIGHT". YOU MAN makes the choice NOT GOD.

    Might be saved. I don't believe like so many say in that MANY will be lost. No.. I really truly believe MOST will be saved. Most through out time are blind.. Jesus said.. if you were blind you would have no sin. And were talking EVER LASTING life right? Ok.. go for it WHAT GROUP is right? And you think GOD expects us to KNOW which one HE is REALLY in? HAHA. He knows all this.

    I believe if you HEAR Jesus is the only way.. came died rose to save you.. and you reject it. Well all I know is JESUS is the only way to the Father and some will try to GET IN with out Christ but never will. Of those books I have no say. I leave it with my Father. If you ask.. I will tell you JESUS is the only way in. MAN gets not say
     
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  11. salt-n-light

    salt-n-light Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Its that all men MIGHT be save, not will, but MIGHT. God's love is a convenant, a contract, it have conditions. That means there is a chance that they might not be saved. Where do you think the "not saved" go, for a time-out?

    Scripture said don't fear man that can only kill your body, but fear the one that can cast both your body and soul to hell. (Matthew 10:28). Im pretty sure that means that yes people are gonna end up there, because they did not fear God.
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2018
  12. Apologetic_Warrior

    Apologetic_Warrior Pilgrim

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    Here is a list of attributes of God from wikipedia:


    When thinking on the attributes of God, our theology proper should maintain a balance that is biblical, one attribute should not be maintained at the expense of another, or emphasized at the expense of another.

    Everyone just loves to quote John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. (NKJV)

    But John does not stop there, he goes on...

    John 3:17 “For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved. 18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. 19 “And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. 20 “For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed. 21 “But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be clearly seen, that they have been done in God.” (NKJV)

    Do you see the balance here? Of love and wrath?
     
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  13. St_Worm2

    St_Worm2 Simul Justus et Peccator Supporter

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    The East clearly understands certain aspects of Heaven and Hell in the age to come in a different way from the West. Here, in part, is an article concerning how they are viewed by the EOC (from the Orthodox Church in America):

    The final coming of Christ will be the judgment of all men. His very presence will be the judgment. Now men can live without the love of Christ in their lives. They can exist as if there were no God, no Christ, no Spirit, no Church, no spiritual life. At the end of the ages this will no longer be possible. All men will have to behold the Face of Him who “for us men and our salvation came down from heaven and was incarnate . . . who was crucified under Pontius Pilate, and suffered and was buried . . .” (Nicene Creed). All will have to look at Him whom they have crucified by their sins: Him “who was dead and is alive again” (Rev 1.17–18).

    For those who love the Lord, His Presence will be infinite joy, paradise and eternal life. For those who hate the Lord, the same Presence will be infinite torture, hell and eternal death. The reality for both the saved and the damned will be exactly the same when Christ “comes in glory, and all angels with Him,” so that “God may be all in all” (1 Cor 15–28). Those who have God as their “all” within this life will finally have divine fulfillment and life. For those whose “all” is themselves and this world, the “all” of God will be their torture, their punishment and their death. And theirs will be “weeping and gnashing of teeth” (Mt 8.21, et al.).

    The Son of Man will send His angels and they will gather out of His kingdom all causes of sin and all evil doers, and throw them into the furnace of fire; there men will weep and gnash their teeth. Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the Kingdom of their Father (Mt 13.41–43).


    I have searched for but have been unable to find the EOC giving any kind of credence to the doctrine of apokatastasis, other than OrthodoxWiki and pro-universalist articles mentioning it as a minority view of some members of the orthodox church. Perhaps our EOC friends could help us with this .. as well if there is any 'official' position taken by the EOC about Hell? :)

    --David
    p.s. - just FYI, Tree of Life has already shown us the position taught by the RCC above in post #21 - Does our loving God send people to hell?
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2018
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  14. Apologetic_Warrior

    Apologetic_Warrior Pilgrim

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    amen

    Applied would be a more accurate term than revealed. Applied in regeneration, where transformation takes place.

    Here is where I have to disagree as I know of no Scripture to support this idea, and if this were the case, it makes a mockery of the wrath of God, of the warnings in Scripture, of all consequences in this life, and completely ignores the notion of an "unpardonable" sin.
     
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  15. section9+1

    section9+1 Well-Known Member

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    If everyone winds up redeemed, then the bible only needs to be a pamphlet. Or not even written at all. In fact it makes all of this life very pointless and it makes everything in the bible pointless. Don't mistake God's love for stupidity. God may love, but he is not a fool.
     
  16. ClementofA

    ClementofA Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Scripture reveals God's judgements, wrath, anger & such are corrective:

    Job 5:17-18 “Behold, happy is the man whom God corrects; Therefore do not despise the chastening of the Almighty. For He bruises, but he binds up; He wounds, but His hands make whole.”

    Hab.1:12 O LORD my God, my Holy One, you who are eternal--surely you do not plan to wipe us out? O LORD, our Rock, you have sent these Babylonians to correct us, to punish us for our many sins.

    Because I have sinned against him, I will bear the LORD’s wrath, until he pleads my case and upholds my cause. He will bring me out into the light;I will see his righteousness. (Micah 7:9)

    Isaiah 12:1
    Then you will say on that day, "I will give thanks to You, O LORD; For although You were angry with me, Your anger is turned away, And You comfort me.

    Hosea 6:1
    "Come, let us return to the LORD. For He has torn us, but He will heal us; He has wounded us, but He will bandage us.

    Isa.57:17 “Because of the iniquity of his unjust gain I was angry and struck him;
    I hid My face and was angry, And he went on turning away, in the way of his heart.

    18“I have seen his ways, but I will heal him;
    I will lead him and restore comfort to him and to his mourners,

    Mat 18:34 And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him.

    https://www.tentmaker.org/books/hope_beyond_hell.pdf
     
  17. ClementofA

    ClementofA Well-Known Member Supporter

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    According to a female Roman Catholic scholar:

    "Augustine himself, after rejecting apokatastasis, and Basil attest that still late in the fourth and fifth centuries this doctrine was upheld by the vast majority of Christians
    (immo quam plurimi)."

    "Of course there were antiuniversalists also in the ancient church, but scholars must be careful not to list among them — as is the case with the list of “the 68” antiuniversalists repeatedly cited by McC on the basis of Brian Daley’s The Hope of the Early Church — an author just because he uses πῦρ αἰώνιον, κόλασις αἰώνιος, θάνατος αἰώνιος, or the like, since these biblical expressions do not necessarily refer to eternal damnation. Indeed all universalists, from Origen to Gregory Nyssen to Evagrius, used these phrases without problems, for universalists understood these expressions as “otherworldly,” or “long-lasting,” fire, educative punishment, and death. Thus, the mere presence of such phrases is not enough to conclude that a patristic thinker “affirmed the idea of everlasting punishment” (p. 822). Didache mentions the ways of life and death, but not eternal death or torment; Ignatius, as others among “the 68,” never mentions eternal punishment. Ephrem does not speak of eternal damnation, but has many hints of healing and restoration. For Theodore of Mopsuestia, another of “the 68,” if one takes into account also the Syriac and Latin evidence, given that the Greek is mostly lost, it becomes impossible to list him among the antiuniversalists. He explicitly ruled out unending retributive punishment, sine fine et sine correctione.

    I have shown, indeed, that a few of “the 68” were not antiuniversalist, and that the uncertain were in fact universalists, for example, Clement of Alexandria, Apocalypse of Peter, Sibylline Oracles (in one passage), Eusebius, Nazianzen, perhaps even Basil and Athanasius, Ambrose, Jerome before his change of mind, and Augustine in his anti-Manichaean years. Maximus too, another of “the 68,” speaks only of punishment aionios, not aidios and talks about restoration with circumspection after Justinian, also using a persona to express it. Torstein Tollefsen, Panayiotis Tzamalikos, and Maria Luisa Gatti, for instance, agree that he affirmed apokatastasis.

    It is not the case that “the support for universalism is paltry compared with opposition to it” (p. 823). Not only were “the 68” in fact fewer than 68, and not only did many “uncertain” in fact support apokatastasis, but the theologians who remain in the list of antiuniversalists tend to be much less important. Look at the theological weight of Origen, the Cappadocians, Athanasius, or Maximus, for instance, on all of whom much of Christian doctrine and dogmas depends. Or think of the cultural significance of Eusebius, the spiritual impact of Evagrius or Isaac of Nineveh, or the philosophico-theological importance of Eriugena, the only author of a comprehensive treatise of systematic theology and theoretical philosophy between Origen’s Peri Archon and Aquinas’s Summa theologiae. Then compare, for instance, Barsanuphius, Victorinus of Pettau, Gaudentius of Brescia, Maximus of Turin, Tyconius, Evodius of Uzala, or Orientius, listed among “the 68” (and mostly ignorant of Greek). McC’s statement, “there are no unambiguous cases of universalist teaching prior to Origen” (p. 823), should also be at least nuanced, in light of Bardaisan, Clement, the Apocalypse of Peter’s Rainer Fragment, parts of the Sibylline Oracles, and arguably of the NT, especially Paul’s letters.

    Certainly, “there was a diversity of views in the early church on the scope of final salvation.” Tertullian, for instance, did not embrace apokatastasis. But my monograph is not on patristic eschatology or soteriology in general, but specifically on the doctrine of apokatastasis. Thus, I treated the theologians who supported it, and not others."

    The Christian Doctrine of Apokatastasis: The Reviews Start Coming In
    http://tsj.sagepub.com/content/76/4/827.extract

    Ilaria Ramelli, The Christian Doctrine of Apokatastasis: A Critical Assessment from the New Testament to Eriugena (Brill, 2013. 890 pp.)

    Scholars directory, with list of publications:

    Ilaria L.E. Ramelli - ISNS Scholars Directory
     
  18. ClementofA

    ClementofA Well-Known Member Supporter

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    This includes everyone in the universe, including the dead and demons:

    Rev.5:13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour,
    and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.

    John speaks of "every creature" & to emphasize this again he repeats "and all that are in them":

    Rev.5:13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.

    This worship (v.13) uses the same worshipful words as the redeemed of vs 9-10 use in v.12:

    12 Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honour, and glory, and blessing.

    All this being in the context of salvation - "the Lamb that was slain" (v.12 & 13).

    This sounds like just payback, not endless annihilation or tortures:

    Rev.18:6 Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double.

    Unique Proof For Christian, Biblical Universalism
     
  19. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member

    +567
    United Kingdom
    Baptist
    Married
    UK-Conservative
    • Revelation 20:11 ¶ And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
    • 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
    • 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
    • 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
    • 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
     
  20. gordonhooker

    gordonhooker Franciscan tssf Supporter

    +1,040
    Anglican
    Married
    I totally agree with my Franciscan brother Richard Rohr and have for many years. The thought of an all powerful loving God sitting somewhere out there with a Smite Button as Larson once portrayed on one of Far Side cartoons may suite some people but I would consider that to be infantile religion - but maybe a starting point for some.
     
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