Does God Love Everyone?

[kj7gs]

Had a question asked of me the other day, "does God love everyone?" I didn't answer right away because I wanted to look up some of the Scriptures that referred to wrath and God (righteously) hating Esau, vessels made for destruction, etc. What I found was that God has love for his own, but not for all mankind.

Arminianism requires God to love everyone in order to maintain that Christ died for all. And then the tap dancing begins with God "loving Esau less" and wrath retranslated into sadness at placing the unbeliever in hell, or just saying that the unregenerate choose hell for themselves in order to let God (and their theology) off the hook. God created us, therefore God must love us. We are supposed to love everyone, therefore God is supposed to love everyone.

But I just don't see a common love of God for everyone in the Bible. I see a King who is a loving Father for those in His kingdom, but not everyone is in his kingdom. Your thoughts?

 

[cygnusx1]

Had a question asked of me the other day, "does God love everyone?" I didn't answer right away because I wanted to look up some of the Scriptures that referred to wrath and God (righteously) hating Esau, vessels made for destruction, etc. What I found was that God has love for his own, but not for all mankind.

Arminianism requires God to love everyone in order to maintain that Christ died for all. And then the tap dancing begins with God "loving Esau less" and wrath retranslated into sadness at placing the unbeliever in hell, or just saying that the unregenerate choose hell for themselves in order to let God (and their theology) off the hook. God created us, therefore God must love us. We are supposed to love everyone, therefore God is supposed to love everyone.

But I just don't see a common love of God for everyone in the Bible. I see a King who is a loving Father for those in His kingdom, but not everyone is in his kingdom. Your thoughts?

good question , I would answer yes , but not in exactly the same way .

Love involves patience , kindness , longsuffering these attributes of love are not restricted to the elect .


However , COVENANT love is restricted to Christ and His people whom he died for.

 

[edie19]

Had a question asked of me the other day, "does God love everyone?" I didn't answer right away because I wanted to look up some of the Scriptures that referred to wrath and God (righteously) hating Esau, vessels made for destruction, etc. What I found was that God has love for his own, but not for all mankind.

Arminianism requires God to love everyone in order to maintain that Christ died for all. And then the tap dancing begins with God "loving Esau less" and wrath retranslated into sadness at placing the unbeliever in hell, or just saying that the unregenerate choose hell for themselves in order to let God (and their theology) off the hook. God created us, therefore God must love us. We are supposed to love everyone, therefore God is supposed to love everyone.

But I just don't see a common love of God for everyone in the Bible. I see a King who is a loving Father for those in His kingdom, but not everyone is in his kingdom. Your thoughts?

I think you have it just right.

John 17:9
I pray for them; I pray not for the world, but for them whom Thou hast given Me, for they are Thine.

Christ didn't die for all - He died for those God gave Him.

I know folks frequently use John 3:16 to verify their view that God loves the entire world - but compare John's words to John's words.

Revelation 5:9 . . . . . and with your blood you purchased men for God from every tribe and language and people and nation.

The world is all races, tribes and nations - not all people in the world.

edie

 

[cygnusx1]

JOHN CALVIN.

"Hence he says, I loved you. God might indeed have made an appeal to the Jews on another ground; for had he not manifested his love to them, they were yet bound to submit to his authority. He does not indeed speak here of God’s love generally, such as he shows to the whole human race; but he condemns the Jews, inasmuch as having been freely adopted by God as his holy and peculiar people, they yet forgot this honor, and despised the Giver, and regarded what he taught them as nothing. When therefore God says that he loved the Jews, we see that his object was to convict them of ingratitude for having despised the singular favor bestowed on them alone, rather than to press that authority which he possesses over all mankind in common." Calvin Commentary on Mal 1:2.


"The Father loveth the Son. But what is the meaning of this reason? Does he regard all others with hatred? The answer is easy, that he does not speak of the common love with which God regards men whom he has created, or his other works, but of that peculiar love which, beginning with the Son, flows from him to all the creatures. For that love with which, embracing the Son, he embraces us also in him, leads him to communicate all his benefits to us by his hand." Calvin Commentary on John 3:35.

"The meaning of Moses is then easy enough, namely that albeit God loves all people, yet that his Saints are in his charge or protection, yea even those whom he has chosen. Unless a man will refer these words, "the People", to the twelve tribes: but that were hard and constrained. Moses then does here compare all men and all the Nations of the earth with the lineage of Abraham which God had chosen: as if he should say, that God's grace is spread out everywhere, as we ourselves see, and as the Scripture also witnesses in other places. And not only men are partakers of this goodness of God, and are fed and maintained by his liberality: but he does also show himself bountiful even to to brute beasts. Even thither does his mercy extend according to this saying of the Psalm, Who makes the fields and mountains to bring forth grass for the feeding of cattle, but God who has a care of them? Seeing that GOD vouchsafes to have so merciful regard of the beasts which he has created, as to given them food; it is more to be thought that he will be a foster father to men, whom he has made and shaped after his own image, which approaches nearer unto him, and which have a thing far excelling above all other creatures: God then does love all people. Yea, but yet not in comparison to his Church. And why? For all the children of Adam are enemies unto God by reason of the corruption that is in them. True it is that God loves them as his creatures: but yet he must needs hate them, because they be perverted and given to all evil. And that is the cause why the Scripture tells us that God repented him that ever he made man, considering that he is so marred. And in th same respect also is it said, that we be banished out of God's kingdom, that we be his enemies, that he shakes us off and disclaims us, that he abhors us, that we be the children of wrath, and that we be so corrupted, as there remains nothing but utter confusion upon our heads. When the Scripture speaks so, it is to show us that although God for his part be favorable and merciful to us, for so much as we be his creatures: yet notwithstanding we deserve well to be disclaimed and hated at his hand, and that he should not vouchsafe to have a care of us. Now then, whereas God loves us, let us understand that he overcomes our naughtiness with his goodness, which is infinite. Albeit, as I have touched already, his loving other men is nothing in comparison to those whom he has chosen and whom he acknowledges for his children. Now then, does he love all people? Yet we are his hand: that is to say, he will show that we be far nearer to him, and that he has much more familiar acquaintance with us beyond all comparison, than he has with all the rest of the world. For he has called us unto his house, he dwells among us, he will be known to be our Father, he will have us to call upon him with full trust and liberty, so as we need not to doubt but that his power is spread out to defend us. Lo how Moses meant to magnify God's goodness in this place, after the manner that he has made himself to be felt in his Church and to his Flock…
We see how brute beasts are sustained by his hand: and therein we ought to consider what his goodness is. Again, as touching the wicked which despise him, and do nothing else but provoke his wrath; when yet for all that, we see the sun shine upon them to give them light, they eat and drink , and they be maintained at God's cost, and by his liberality: let us consider that although men deserve to be utterly forsaken; yet notwithstanding God spares them and bears with them, and overcomes their wickedness with his goodness, in that he roots them not out at the first, but vouchsafes to foster them still, and to show a fatherly care towards them. Calvin Sermons on Deuteronomy, Sermon 91, 33:1-3, p., 1188-9.

 

[heymikey80]

I too would say God loves every aspect of His creation, only He does not love all the same way or to the same extent.

"You have heard that it was said, 'You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.' But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust. For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? And if you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect. Mt 5:43-48
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Jehovah is good to all; and His tender mercies are over all His works. Ps 145:9

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[mlqurgw]

If God loves everyone then His love is meaningless and a point of frustration for Him. He is longsuffering and patient with the reprobate for the sake of His elect. They serve His purpose to do good for the elect and He uses them for their sake alone. Isa. 43:3-4, Psa.76:10,Prov. 16:4, 2Cor. 4:15

 

[Iosias]

But I just don't see a common love of God for everyone in the Bible.

Quite true, God loves the elect alone.

 

[PaleoPaul]

God loves everyone. I mean, the fact that the world hasn't turned into a big fireball right about now proves that.

Or do you mean does God love everyone in a special way?

 

[Iosias]

God loves everyone. I mean, the fact that the world hasn't turned into a big fireball right about now proves that.

Not at all as this explains. You may also try this and this.

 

[PaleoPaul]

So the fact that every pagan (I just don't mean Wiccan type pagan; I mean pagan as in non-believers in general) is still alive doesn't prove that God loves everyone in a certain way?!

I say that God has to love every person at least a little bit.

But I do agree that God loves His blood-bought children in a special way that makes his feelings for the pagans look like hate.

 

[Iosias]

JOHN CALVIN.

Have you read this?

 

[cygnusx1]

start by defining love , the rest is obvious , God loves all mankind . "love is longsuffering" even over vessels fitted to destruction !!! read Romans 9

love is ;


1 Corinthians 13:1-13

If I speak in the tongues of men and angels,
but have not love,
I have become sounding brass or a tinkling symbol.
And if I have prophecy and know all mysteries and all knowledge,
and if I have all faith so as to remove mountains,
but have not love, I am nothing.
And if I dole out all my goods, and
if I deliver my body that I may boast
but have not love, nothing I am profited.
Love is long suffering,
love is kind,
it is not jealous,
love does not boast,
it is not inflated.
It is not discourteous,
it is not selfish,
it is not irritable,
it does not enumerate the evil.
It does not rejoice over the wrong, but rejoices in the truth

It covers all things,
it has faith for all things,
it hopes in all things,
it endures in all things.
Love never falls in ruins;
but whether prophecies, they will be abolished; or
tongues, they will cease; or
knowledge, it will be superseded.
For we know in part and we prophecy in part.
But when the perfect comes, the imperfect will be superseded.
When I was an infant,
I spoke as an infant,
I reckoned as an infant;
when I became [an adult],
I abolished the things of the infant.
For now we see through a mirror in an enigma, but then face to face. Now I know in part, but then I shall know as also I was fully known.
But now remains
faith, hope, love,
these three; but the greatest of these is love.

 

[Beoga]

How does keeping the unelect alive longer demonstrate His love for them? Wouldn't keeping the unelect alive longer allow for further judgment to be brought upon them and isn't that a sign of hatred rather than love?

 

[Iosias]

How does keeping the unelect alive longer demonstrate His love for them? Wouldn't keeping the unelect alive longer allow for further judgment to be brought upon them and isn't that a sign of hatred rather than love?

Exactly brother!

Psalm 92:7 "When the wicked spring as the grass, and when all the workers of iniquity do flourish; it is that they shall be destroyed for ever:"

 

[cygnusx1]

Rom 9:22[What] if God, willing to shew [his] wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

1 Corinthians 13:
Love is long suffering,




Lest you be wise in your own conceits, I want you to understand this mystery, brethren: a hardening has come upon part of Israel, until the full number of the Gentiles come in, and so all Israel will be saved; as it is written,
"The Deliverer will come from Zion,
he will banish ungodliness from Jacob";
"and this will be my covenant with them
when I take away their sins."
As regards the gospel they are enemies of God, for your sake; but as regards election they are beloved for the sake of the forefathers. For the gifts and the call of God are irrevocable. Just as you were once disobedient to God but now have received mercy because of their disobedience, so they have now been disobedient in order that by the mercy shown to you they also may receive mercy. For God has consigned all men to disobedience, that he may have mercy upon all. {Rom 11:25-32 RSV}

 

[Beoga]

Rom 9:22[What] if God, willing to shew [his] wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

1 Corinthians 13:
Love is long suffering,

If this be so, then:
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much love [towards] the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

 

[cygnusx1]

If this be so, then:
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much love [towards] the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

yes , absolutely , there has to be a logical reason for wrath .......

is this logical ;


22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much hatred the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

 

[UMP]

How does keeping the unelect alive longer demonstrate His love for them? Wouldn't keeping the unelect alive longer allow for further judgment to be brought upon them and isn't that a sign of hatred rather than love?

I must agree with you. I do not believe God loves the reprobate. Supremely patient with, indeed!
Merciful, in time, indeed! Longsuffering with, yes, obviously.
I am certain God is also "longsuffering" toward satan, for His own blessed purposes. Does this mean God loves satan? I think not.

 

[cygnusx1]

I must agree with you. I do not believe God loves the reprobate. Supremely patient with, indeed!
Merciful, in time, indeed! Longsuffering with, yes, obviously.

howabout "kind" , any advance ?


remember , "love is kind" .......... 1Cor 13-


Luke 6:35-- But love (agaPAte) your enemies, do good (agathopoiEIte) to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back (me-DEN apelPIzontes). Then your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High, because he is kind (chre-STOS) to the ungrateful (achaRIStous) and the wicked. 36 Be merciful (GInesthe oikTIRmones), just as your Father is merciful (oikTIRmo-n esTI). (NIV)
Alt.:--... You will rightly be called sons of the Most High, since he himself is good (NAB)
Alt.:--... to the ungrateful and the selfish. (RSV)
Alt.:--Love your enemies! Do good to them! Lend to them! And don't be concerned about the fact that they won't repay. Then your reward from heaven will be very great, and you will truly be acting as sons of God: for he is kind to the unthankful and the very wicked. (LB)


Romans 2:[3-]4-- ... when you, a mere man, pass judgment on [someone else] and yet do the same things, do you think you will escape God's judgment? 4 Or do you show contempt for (kataphroNEIS) the riches of his kindness (chre-sTOte-tos), tolerance (anoCHE-S), and patience (makrothyMIas), not realizing that God's kindness (chre-sTON) leads you towards repentance (meTAnoian)? (NIV)
Alt.:--... Or do you despise the riches of His goodness, forbearance, and long-suffering, not knowing that the goodness of God leads you to repentance? (KJV)
Alt.:-- 4 Or do you presume on his kindness and forbearance? Do you not know that God's kindness is an invitation to you to repent? (NAB)
Alt.:-- 4 ... Surely you know that God is kind, because he is trying to lead you to repent. (TEV)
Alt.:-- 4 ... Do you not know that God's kindness is meant to lead you to repentance? (RSV)
Alt.:--Do you think that God will judge and condemn others for doing them and overlook you when you do them, too? 4 Don't you realize how patient he is being with you? Or don't you care? Can't you see that he has been waiting all this time without punishing you, to give you time to turn from your sin? (LB)
Alt.:--What makes you think that you, who so readily judge the sins of others, can consider yourself beyond the judgment of God? Are you, perhaps, misinterpreting God's generosity and patient mercy toward you as weakness on his part? (Phillips)


have a blessed read

 

[UMP]

howabout "kind" , any advance ?

Kind? Without question!
That's why I said God is patient, merciful and longsuffering toward the rebrobate:

"I do not believe God loves the reprobate. Supremely patient with, indeed!
Merciful, in time, indeed! Longsuffering with, yes, obviously.
I am certain God is also "longsuffering" (WHICH IS ALSO A KIND ACT) toward satan, for His own blessed purposes. Does this mean God loves satan? I think not."