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Does God hate people??

Discussion in 'Paterology, Christology & Pneumatology' started by new2calvin, Nov 24, 2002.

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  1. your_quagga

    your_quagga retired

    162
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    God is actualized love. to hate would be impossible.

    God cannot do what is impossible.

    :)
     
  2. * kittie *

    * kittie * Contributor

    +366
    Christian
    Private
    no.
    God is love. He cannot hate and does not hate.
    He died for everyone. not just a few.
    He loves all the same. God doesn't play favorites.
     
  3. new2calvin

    new2calvin Solus Christus

    120
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    Lutheran
    ok ive had this going on my mind for some time now. I'll admit that the Hebrew word more aptly describes God's emotion it isn't to hate but to love less. The verse in Malachi 1:2-3 shows this hate. But in 1 Chronicles there is another verse to be shown. 1 Chronicles 17:13-I will be his father, and he will be my son. I will never take my love away from him, as I took it away from your predecessor. Now this doesn't show hate but it shows God can love someone less than someone else. And it's less enough for the love to be taken away.
     
  4. Zyon

    Zyon I am FEMALE!!!

    88
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    Of course he can. As someone once said, (can't remember who it was) With God, nothing is impossible. He can hate. He just chooses not too.
     
  5. Received

    Received True love waits in haunted attics

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    And the context of the verse stating that nothing is impossible with God is soteriological - He can save anyone, at anytime, rich or poor, etc. God cannot create round squares; He cannot finish an act after all possibility of such has passed from our perspective. The Bible even states clearly that things are impossible with God. In the epistle to the Hebrews, the author states that God cannot swear by anything greater than Himself (6:13), nor can He lie (v. 18).

    In regards to hate and loving less, I would agree. But God only 'loves less' because those who are subject to His love are not willing to accept such wonderous and humble compassion. If God is perfect love, and we are fallible, finite humans, and we are writing from such a perspective, we are going to see the love of God so far as we are able to. Notice that all those who God 'loved less' were indeed those who were centered on themselves; with Esau we have a man who is the ideal model of rebellion. We can only comprehend the love of God so far as we can see it; that is, we can only comprehend what we can comprehend. God is immutable, impassible love. He never changes (Malachi 3:16), and if we know that He is indeed pure love (1 John 4:8), we know that He cannot have hate embedded within His character. As said above, hate is an evil in itself. God hating people, or 'loving them less' for no reason at all contradicts His words (Romans 2:11), as well as ideal justice; and if God does not satisfy the ideal justice we all judge the world by, who indeed is taking such a position if indeed our redeemer and creator is maximally excellent?

    The world was created by love, and from this love you find righteousness and joy, and in our weakened condition we are able to comprehend mercy and patience; and to those who willfully rebel, beyond feeling, are open to the wrath of God through His judgment - that is, the reflexive wrath of man upon a perfect God dealt back justly.

    Love and hate are two opposite extremes that we as human beings progress towards daily. The first is perfect and complete; the latter is the emptying of this perfection - the perversion of the good; the disease that ruins righteousness, etc.

    God, creating something that has indeed done no action, cannot hate this creation without a cause; the only way He could 'hate' is if He has a level to judge on; that is, He foreknows the acts and predestines accordingly.

    blessings,

    John
     
  6. new2calvin

    new2calvin Solus Christus

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    Lutheran
    It never sas that they chose it God just loved them less...Why did God destroy Esau's bloodline...I don't know he just did...Why did God take his love away...He just did
     
  7. Received

    Received True love waits in haunted attics

    +732
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    I'm simply saying that this destruction of Esau's bloodline must be in accordance with the foreknowledge of his wicked acts.  If God destroys Him for 'no reason', this means He hates him for 'no reason', which would imply that hate is embedded in His character, and He is fundamentally evil.  But God cannot be evil, for He is love (1 John 4:8). 
     
  8. Defender of the Faith 777

    Defender of the Faith 777 Well-Known Member

    +4
    United Ch. of Christ
    Um lol.

    God didn't exactly, um, die for everyone, but He does desire all to be saved.

    The Bible says that God even does not delight in the death of the wicked. So God does not hate that which He creates. He hates the sin that may result from their actions.
     
  9. Gabriel

    Gabriel I Once Was Lost, But Now Am Found

    +100
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    Married
    US-Republican
    You are both a bit off on this.

    We are His to do with what He wills. He is under no obligation to us whatsoever. He does not have to love us, therefore He is not committing an evil act by not loving all of us. As far as Him hating Esau because of what Esau would do Romans tells us that it has nbothing to do with us, it is about His will alone:
    11(for the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works but of Him who calls), 12it was said to her, “The older shall serve the younger.” 13As it is written, “Jacob I have loved, but Esau I have hated.”
    14What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? Certainly not! 15For He says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion.” 16So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy.

    Pay close attention to verses 13-16.

    If God desired all to be saved, all would be saved. "Our Father who art in heaven, Hallowed be Thy name, Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done, on earth as it is in heaven. His will will be done. Yet all will not be saved.

    The above verse says otherwise. "It is not of him who wills or of him who runs" It is about God and His mercy and His will alone.
     
  10. Received

    Received True love waits in haunted attics

    +732
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    And the verse in Romans was referring to our understanding of reality - it is Paul, temporal human being, who is writing these words. Before the children were born, before they had done any work, God chose. But again, if He chose 'blindly' (which for God would be equivalent to picking names out of a divine hat, which sounds rather silly. It is one thing to claim He elected for no reason; quite another to say He elected for a sovereign reason, of which I hold if necessary. I do not judge His predestination for I am anything but "pre"; v. 15 and God telling Moses to basically stop asking questions that finite reasoning cannot comprehend seems to support this point.), then He would be contradicting His desire to save all. If He has the capability to save all, but does not, then what must we conclude?

    And the prayer you quoted was the well-known model prayer. It is a prayer; that is, the submission of a human being under the power of God. The 'Kingdom of God' is a phrase that means quite literally the sphere of salvation concerning the created. Notice in Isaiah 6:3 how it states that the whole earth is full of His glory, but in Habbakkuk 2:14 it states that the whole earth shall be filled with the knowledge of the glory of Him. By praying 'your kingdom come', the pray-er is simply giving his submission to the one who owns the kingdom.

    And I would most certainly agree with the well-stated Luther quote, in that absolutely no-one deserves salvation. But if God gives the gift to one innocent, it must equally be open to all, for there is no partiality with God (Romans 2:11).
     
  11. settergren

    settergren In Christ Alone

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    I never heard of a God who was limited by possibilities.

    Nothing is impossible for GOD!!!!
     
  12. seebs

    seebs God Made Me A Skeptic

    +1,463
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    Nothing that means anything, perhaps. Some things are not possibilities, or things, but simply constructions of words that look like verb phrases in English; this isn't a problem with God, it's a problem with language.

    God can't cease to exist; then He wouldn't be eternal. God can't be other than what He is. There *are* limits - they just don't turn out to matter.
     
  13. settergren

    settergren In Christ Alone

    49
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    Christian
     

    As unbelievers we are slaves to sin and can do nothing but sin. We as unbelievers can't even seek God. We as unbelievers are unrighteous, wretched sinners destined for hell. How then can we choose not to be sinners? It's not possible, only Christ could refrain from sinning. Only Christ can save us! Humans can't refrain from sinning. By contemplating the Holiness of God we in comparision don't have any good in us. We are so far from God's holiness that if we ever saw him in his Glory (as humans) we would die on the spot. That just goes to show how low we are. How can someone so depraved even have any inclination to want to know God. God opens eyes and changes hearts; only then can we break the chains of sin. God works in us first, then we accept Him.

    The fact that God did this for us demonstrates HIs Love for US! However, God doesn't do this for all! In fact in Romans it says some objects (people) were destined for destruction and some for glory. Meaning, some people were brought into this world to never come to salvation wihle others do! THose who do are God's choosen people whom He Loves. Those who don't are out of luck. This is fair since all deserve hell from the beginning and since those who aren't chosen are still getting what they deserve, which is Hell.

     
     
  14. Loxly

    Loxly Gefilte fish

    478
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    Other Religion
    I can not think of anything that one of my childern could do to me or others that would merit me allowing one of them going to eternal torment and damnation, can you if it were one of your children? .... Of course were not god are we.
     
  15. SoccerAaron

    SoccerAaron Soccer Fairy

    401
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    Calvinist
    Single
    Ditto.
    Of course God hates some people.

    Malachi 2:16
    "For the man who hates and divorces, says the LORD, the God of Israel, covers[Probable meaning (compare Septuagint and Deuteronomy 24:1-4); or [For the] [LORD,] [the God of Israel, says that he hates divorce, and him who covers] ] his garment with violence, says the LORD of hosts. So guard yourselves in your spirit, and do not be faithless."

    Psalms 5:5: The arrogant shall not stand in thy sight: Thou hatest all workers of iniquity.
    Psalms 11:5: Jehovah trieth the righteous; But the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth.
    Psalms 26:5: I hate the assembly of evil-doers, And will not sit with the wicked.
    Psalms 31:6: I hate them that regard lying vanities; But I trust in Jehovah.
    Psalms 45:7: Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated wickedness: Therefore God, thy God, hath anointed thee With the oil of gladness above thy fellows.
    Psalms 97:10: O ye that love Jehovah, hate evil: He preserveth the souls of his saints; He delivereth them out of the hand of the wicked.
    Psalms 101:3: I will set no base thing before mine eyes: I hate the work of them that turn aside; It shall not cleave unto me.
    Psalms 119:104: Through thy precepts I get understanding: Therefore I hate every false way.
    Psalms 119:113: I hate them that are of a double mind; But thy law do I love.
    Psalms 119:128: Therefore I esteem all thy precepts concerning all things to be right; And I hate every false way.
    Psalms 119:163: I hate and abhor falsehood; But thy law do I love.
    Psalms 139:21-22: Do not I hate them, O Jehovah, that hate thee? And am not I grieved with those that rise up against thee? I hate them with perfect hatred: They are become mine enemies.
     
  16. bluewolf

    bluewolf Christian Counseling

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    Christian
    God is love. The shortest verse in the Bible is 'Jesus wept'. God also gave us and all other human beings freedom of choice. That means that we do suffer the consequences of our actions, but God in His eternal grace is there to pick us up when we fall.

    He gave freedom of choice to all human beings. That is why sometimes people who make bad choices result in hurting others.

    Our world is imperfect, it has thorns and thistles(as well as beauty-deep woods, the song of birds, waterfalls, we hurt and have pain because we are spiritual beings, created in God's spiritual likeness. In this frail body it can be hard. We have the faith (Heb 11:1 that faith is the evidence of things hoped for the substance (physical manifestation) of things not yet seen, to para phrase. We have the 'faith' of eternity in spirit ewth god, no longer bound by our imperfect bodies. We are given perfect ones.

    People die because they have freedom of choice and because our frail bodies are not meant to last forever.'We are just passing through. It is that simple.

    Laura

    'Without faith, no proof is possible, with faith no proof is necessary'
     
  17. SoccerAaron

    SoccerAaron Soccer Fairy

    401
    +5
    Calvinist
    Single
    So do you believe God hates certain people?
     
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