Discussion Doctrines of Demons?

[GoldenKingGaze]

In Timothy we read about the doctrines of demons the Spirit through Paul warned us about. I think I see they began in the RCC, with priests not being allowed to marry and in some fasting rules. But more obviously when the Pope's first began to burn at the stake the so called "heretics" after inquisition this was clearly a doctrine of demons in effect! It was like bringing back pagan crucifixion, just the alternative the Roman governors could order in their day.

This led to the protest of Luther, and then the 30 years war and other religious violence still visible in Northern Ireland. Because of this, many English for example are atheists and anti-theists. And they prefer secular science. Some of them become Satanists. Then there are neo-pagans and new agers... People hate this religious scandal.

Scriptures also write of a great falling away. It has been discussed in these forums before. So one asks, "what is a true convert?" And "who is falling away?"

Rome began to be converted by the diaspora and then Paul and Peter. Under persecution faith went underground, later it became the state religion and there were half hearted converts.

I heard of conversion by sword in Poland and a war in Hungary... From paganism to Roman Catholicism.

Then after the protest gradually missions started. To the local and abroad. Wesley, Whitefield, Finney, Spurgeon. I read more about the first two. Also John G Lake. Seymour, and from Seymour in the Azusa st Revival, Pentecostalism. Then millions converted to Christ around the world as well as at home. Evidence of conversion sought in thing like tongues, healings, vocal gifts and the fruit of the Spirit.

New converts based their conversion and faith in the Spirit and in God's power as Paul taught. Not on persuasive wisdom...

In dangerous countries people still convert, because of the love of Christ.

I hope you will agree, there must be true conversions before there is a great falling away.

Those who use terms that refer back to old church times and Protestant, Catholic violence are still in the doctrines of demons. Terms like papist, heretic, apostasy, witch. Some violence was directed at so called witches. From which comes the saying, "sink or swim." A kangaroo court test.

These above people refer to those making converts, of being involved in the demonic. Kundalini yoga, kriyas. Even though the fruits are different!

The history is clear. Revival of the Spiritual gifts... the role of the teacher, preacher, then the evangelist, the prophet and then ones of a less great revelation of God than the twelve, but apostles/church planters. And along the way the revival of the anointing and Jesus' sacred blood, fire of God and the inpouring of the Father's love. Together with professional academia. These are the free thinkers. Even free hearts.

Do you see fault in my view or have another view?

Here are the scriptures:
1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
1Ti 4:2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
1Ti 4:3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
1Ti 4:4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
1Ti 4:5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.

1Ti 4:13 Till I come, give attendance to reading, to exhortation, to doctrine.
1Ti 4:14 Neglect not the gift that is in thee, which was given thee by prophecy, with the laying on of the hands of the presbytery.

2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
2Th 2:5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
2Th 2:6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
2Th 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
2Th 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
2Th 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

1Co 2:4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:
1Co 2:5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

 

[Dave L]

I think doctrines of demons are lies that call certain biblical truths false and replace them with false definitions. I normally look for direct quotes from scripture that harmonize with other scriptures to support a view. No direct scripture quotes = probable false doctrine.

 

[com7fy8]

I am fine with however the Holy Spirit really is blessing with gifts, but I do not emphasize them as much as >

"faith working through love" (in Galatians 5:6) >

Isn't faith the "evidence"? Hebrews 11:1

Also, Paul speaks of how there was evidence of his successful ministry >

The obedience of the Philippians increased, even in Paul's absence > Philippians 2:12-13.

The Thessalonians so spoke that Paul and Silvanus and Timothy could not add anything, plus the Thessalonians became "examples" > 1 Thessalonians 1:6-10.

But the Corinthians had gifts; yet, they could so mess up like they did. But they did not fall away, but repented with correction ministered by Paul's letter.

So, does God fail to correct His own children, so they can fall away? How about Hebrews 12:4-14? This says every child of God gets correction, and this correction brings the child to share with God in His own holiness, in the "peaceable fruit of righteousness" of God's love . . . I personally understand.

So, if children can't permanently fall away > who can?

There can be the falling away of the husk, as you might say, of the anti-Christ, so anti-Christ can be seen more clearly. But that husk is not attached to Jesus, but to the anti-Christ.

And there could be the ones who stick around the Christian people; but they are not gentle and humble and quiet in Jesus (1 Peter 3:4, Matthew 11:28-30), but are . . . around . . . perhaps cultural copy-cats, but not having roots in God's love > "rooted and grounded in love" > Ephesians 3:17.

So, you ask what I think; I think be open.

Oh, and actively seek our Father for how He is able to correct our character > Hebrews 12:4-14. This is more important than trying to decide what labels to put on people. And your example can help anyone, however God uses your example to effect people > maybe like how Christian wives, even "without a word" can help a disobedient husband.

"nor as being lords over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock." (1 Peter 5:3)

Oh, so I think of this > if we are seeking outward evidence which we can see and maybe control, this might not be obedience which increases in our absence!

 

[1stcenturylady]

I heard of conversion by sword in Poland and a war in Hungary...

Can you go back and edit into your post what these were converted from and into what denomination? You left that part hanging...

 

[SolomonVII]

Honestly the scriptures seem to me to be a better analogy of the vegan culture of the intersectional genderless prudes that has arisen out of the faithlessness of this generation.
Nietzsche's criticism of the priests was that they were meat-eaters, after all.
The lusts and excesses of warring Christians in medieval wars of religion were the same lusts and excesses that exist throughout history. It is human appetite.

End times evil is something very different. It is brought in by such profound atheism that the church of Auguste Compte becomes possible, where the absence of God means that man need worship himself as God.
These are the demons voices whispering to the generation that sees everything that has come before— the killing of animals, the wars and the greed, and the fecundity that they believe is a blasphemy against nature itself—
as a disgusting oppression worthy only of contempt and eradication.
It is a humanism descended into nihilism, so focused on misery and blaming suffering on the Oppressor scapegoat, that Life itself becomes oppression.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

This video sparked my comments: