doctors call to ban smacking children!

[Serendipity..]

Banning Smacking children


AM - Doctors call for smacking ban 26/07/2013

I think it is a very good thing. I wish they did it before I gave my daughter that excessive smack fueled by sleeplessness and frustration I have regretted for the last 10 years.


I think anyone who believes beating up kiddies for obedience should also allow the same correction technique to be used on them to teach them obedience as adults. I wonder how long that would last..

Smacking children is just so wonderful because it made me a violent hot tempered adult.

 

[ebia]

How would you enforce it?

What is needed is much more skilling up of parents in better disciplinary techniques and a change of culture on the acceptability of corporal punishment. Simply banning it would cause more problems than it solves.

 

[Serendipity..]

If there is a better substitute that achieves well behaved respectful kids I am all for it. Hopefully smacking has a good non violent equivalent somewhere.

 

[TheDag]

Banning Smacking children


AM - Doctors call for smacking ban 26/07/2013

I think it is a very good thing. I wish they did it before I gave my daughter that excessive smack fueled by sleeplessness and frustration I have regretted for the last 10 years.


I think anyone who believes beating up kiddies for obedience should also allow the same correction technique to be used on them to teach them obedience as adults. I wonder how long that would last..

Smacking children is just so wonderful because it made me a violent hot tempered adult.

smacking is not the same as beating up a kid.

Sure you may say that it turned you into a violent hot tempered adult. However there are plenty who were smacked as a kid and did not turn into violent hot tempered adult. Therefore you can not legitimately argue cause and effect. There really is no hard and fast rule for parenting. What works for one does not work for another. For example a friend of mine has three kids. With the youngest if they don't reward him before he does the task it will not get done. However if they do reward him before the task then it will be done. With their older kids they would not dream of rewarding them before the task is done as it would not work. Likewise when my brother and I were grounded one time my brothers response was to fill his time with studying. My response was to try and find a way around the rules. Two kids raised the same way by our parents but different response. Yes I can point to why I responded differently if you like. Point is there is no hard and fast rule that works for every single kid. I agree with smacking as a rarely used method of discipline but I stepped inbetween a parent and their kid when they hit their kid around the head because that is wrong.

 

[Serendipity..]

I grew up in a time where verbal abuse and caning kids or belting them was a normal everyday thing. It sure toughened me up, and it did it in away I still struggle to accept modern societies wimpy soft touch with discipline. At the same time I also oppose hitting defenseless young people without the ability to understand things.

Kids are taught better ways than fighting now to solve things. As christians we are to turn the other cheek and be peacemakers not violent to each other when we are helpless.

The children are in a helpless stage of their lives..

 

[darkaus32]

Romanian custom tradition hit their children out of love, not fear or contempt but for discipline and correction(i'm sure tradtiional parents do likewise). I know english had this tradition as well but english are liberals who change by the years and morality declines in time, discipline was a part of life along time ago.

Proverbs 13:24

King James Version (KJV)

24 He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes.


proverbs 23:18



Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die

 

[tgg]

Whilst I don't have any children myself, there is definitely a line between giving a kid a single smack or slap and beating them black and blue due to your own lack of maturity and self-control.

According to the book "I'm OK - You're OK" by Thomas Harris, he believes that the only time you should smack a child is if they are too young to comprehend danger.

The Bible also mentions corporal punishment in the book of Sirach:

Sirach 30: 1 - 13 He who loves his son will whip him often,
in order that he may rejoice at the way he turns out.
2 He who disciplines his son will profit by him,
and will boast of him among acquaintances.
3 He who teaches his son will make his enemies envious,
and will glory in him in the presence of friends.
4 The[a] father may die, and yet he is not dead,
for he has left behind him one like himself;
5 while alive he saw and rejoiced,
and when he died he was not grieved;
6 he has left behind him an avenger against his enemies,
and one to repay the kindness of his friends.
7 He who spoils his son will bind up his wounds,
and his feelings will be troubled at every cry.
8 A horse that is untamed turns out to be stubborn,
and a son unrestrained turns out to be wilful.
9 Pamper a child, and he will frighten you;
play with him, and he will give you grief.
10 Do not laugh with him, lest you have sorrow with him,
and in the end you will gnash your teeth.
11 Give him no authority in his youth,
and do not ignore his errors.
12 Bow down his neck in his youth,[b]
and beat his sides while he is young,
lest he become stubborn and disobey you,
and you have sorrow of soul from him.[c]
13 Discipline your son and take pains with him,
that you may not be offended by his shamelessness.

 

[Serendipity..]

.................

 

[Mikaeri]

Banning Smacking children


AM - Doctors call for smacking ban 26/07/2013

I think it is a very good thing. I wish they did it before I gave my daughter that excessive smack fueled by sleeplessness and frustration I have regretted for the last 10 years.


I think anyone who believes beating up kiddies for obedience should also allow the same correction technique to be used on them to teach them obedience as adults. I wonder how long that would last..

Smacking children is just so wonderful because it made me a violent hot tempered adult.

I have no idea how old you are Serendipity, but your logic defies me, I'm from New Zealand and we passed the so=called anti smacking law a few years ago..why did we do this?

For our size as a country we had one of the highest child abuse rates in the world..so called liberal researchers/doctors, their minds brainwashed from the childcare teachings of Spock and like many of that ilk.
reasoned that the cowardly bully that kicks/punches/beats/murders our children are the same parents with a desire to teach their children how to behave would smack/spank their child in love with cuddles afterwards.

This policy has not changed our children are still being beaten/punched/kicked/murdered..it is still happening...WHY! because the above is done in rage and evil anger.

How dare you, I am not a violent hot tempered Adult thank you very much, all my kids have been spanked when naughty and disobedient, all six are well rounded adults brought up with respect..

Maybe Serindipity you should take your rose-coloured glasses off and look around you..with how kids are brought up nowadays.

In closing here's a little story when my kids were younger and at primary School, I was doing some work at my boys School, most of the kids new me as Uncle Mike..one day this little 8 year old came running up to me, his face beaming with excitement..
"Hey Uncle Mike guess what I done"
Asking this little kid what he did..
"I made Miss cry! I punched her in the face"

I knelt down and looked this lad directly in the eye and stated calmly..
"If you were my Son and you had done that to a teacher, your bottom would be spanked good young fella.that was naughty and you should not be proud of it"

Sharing t with the School principal later..he stated in all honesty about spanking/punishing kids..
"I agree Mike, the law says we're not allowed to..the kids end up losing really"

Food for thought to the anti spankers.

 

[Serendipity..]

I have no idea how old you are Serendipity, but your logic defies me, I'm from New Zealand and we passed the so=called anti smacking law a few years ago..why did we do this?

For our size as a country we had one of the highest child abuse rates in the world..so called liberal researchers/doctors, their minds brainwashed from the childcare teachings of Spock and like many of that ilk.
reasoned that the cowardly bully that kicks/punches/beats/murders our children are the same parents with a desire to teach their children how to behave would smack/spank their child in love with cuddles afterwards.

This policy has not changed our children are still being beaten/punched/kicked/murdered..it is still happening...WHY! because the above is done in rage and evil anger.

How dare you, I am not a violent hot tempered Adult thank you very much, all my kids have been spanked when naughty and disobedient, all six are well rounded adults brought up with respect..

Maybe Serindipity you should take your rose-coloured glasses off and look around you..with how kids are brought up nowadays.

In closing here's a little story when my kids were younger and at primary School, I was doing some work at my boys School, most of the kids new me as Uncle Mike..one day this little 8 year old came running up to me, his face beaming with excitement..
"Hey Uncle Mike guess what I done"
Asking this little kid what he did..
"I made Miss cry! I punched her in the face"

I knelt down and looked this lad directly in the eye and stated calmly..
"If you were my Son and you had done that to a teacher, your bottom would be spanked good young fella.that was naughty and you should not be proud of it"

Sharing t with the School principal later..he stated in all honesty about spanking/punishing kids..
"I agree Mike, the law says we're not allowed to..the kids end up losing really"

Food for thought to the anti spankers.

Thanks for your comment I guess you will advocate that next time you get a speeding fine and need a lesson a 7 foot tall guy can tie you to a pole and whip you to teach you right from wrong just like in Jesus day? Your logic of using violence as a correctional tool should fix society according to you so it should not be age dependent. If you think you should will it on another what's wrong with the same corporal punishment to you? I'll bet that's different...

 

[Mikaeri]

Thanks for your comment I guess you will advocate that next time you get a speeding fine and need a lesson a 7 foot tall guy can tie you to a pole and whip you to teach you right from wrong just like in Jesus day? Your logic of using violence as a correctional tool should fix society according to you so it should not be age dependent. If you think you should will it on another what's wrong with the same corporal punishment to you? I'll bet that's different...

Like many today, you mix violence which has a negative effect as I described in my post with what kids today are missing out on..
Discipline done in love which is positive and not violence.
Spanking is not violence..
As I said..look around you today and see what this anti family child rearing philosphy is doing to kids..out of control and disrespect

 

[ebia]

I have no idea how old you are Serendipity, but your logic defies me, I'm from New Zealand and we passed the so=called anti smacking law a few years ago..why did we do this? For our size as a country we had one of the highest child abuse rates in the world..so called liberal researchers/doctors, their minds brainwashed from the childcare teachings of Spock and like many of that ilk. reasoned that the cowardly bully that kicks/punches/beats/murders our children are the same parents with a desire to teach their children how to behave would smack/spank their child in love with cuddles afterwards. This policy has not changed our children are still being beaten/punched/kicked/murdered..it is still happening...WHY!

Because parents aren't being equipped with better alternative ways to teach their kids appropriate behavior, most likely.

In closing here's a little story when my kids were younger and at primary School, I was doing some work at my boys School, most of the kids new me as Uncle Mike..one day this little 8 year old came running up to me, his face beaming with excitement.. "Hey Uncle Mike guess what I done" Asking this little kid what he did.. "I made Miss cry! I punched her in the face" I knelt down and looked this lad directly in the eye and stated calmly.. "If you were my Son and you had done that to a teacher, your bottom would be spanked good young fella.that was naughty and you should not be proud of it" Sharing t with the School principal later..he stated in all honesty about spanking/punishing kids.. "I agree Mike, the law says we're not allowed to..the kids end up losing really" Food for thought to the anti spankers.

I am a school teacher. I would be very seriously concerned about any teacher, let alone school principal, who still favoured corporal punishment.

 

[ebia]

Like many today, you mix violence which has a negative effect as I described in my post with what kids today are missing out on.. Discipline done in love which is positive and not violence. Spanking is not violence.. As I said..look around you today and see what this anti family child rearing philosphy is doing to kids..out of control and disrespect

Hitting someone is violence.

Just saying its different doesn't make it so.

 

[Mikaeri]

Hitting someone is violence.

Just saying its different doesn't make it so.

I understand how you would hold such a loopy philosophy, being a green party member and all, in New Zealand this crowd is looked on as the loopy left with Marxist leanings.

I repeat, look around you and see how this anti family/anti child philosophy has effected society and kids in general.

Teachers and parents today have been brainwashed by this Marxist new age teaching..the biggest losers are the kids.

 

[TheDag]

I am a school teacher. I would be very seriously concerned about any teacher, let alone school principal, who still favoured corporal punishment.

many teachers I have spoken to say that the problem is they removed corporal punishment from schools. I disagree. It most certainly is not a teachers role and I did know teachers who refused to use it when it was allowed and not one student would dare be rude to them. Every student feared these teachers. I guess we can just conclude that non-corporal punishment just induces fear which is just as or more damaging than physical punishment.

What nobody has ever been able to answer for me though is that there is a stage in a childs life when punishment needs to be connected to the crime straight away. So what does one do when that isn't possible like if your on the way to the airport to catch a plane? Some have said do the punishment. Am I going to then fork out another $1000 to buy new plane tickets when we miss the plane? No sorry so no good. Others then respond get up earlier. Am I going to get the child up at 4am just in case they misbehave and require punishing? No of course not because getting them up that early is going to make them tired and grumpy and almost guarantees a problem in which case it is cruel to punish the child. Sure you may have yet another answer but I can guarantee this. No solution will be practical 100% of the time and therefore an alternative is required for those few, rare occasions when it is not suitable.

Hitting someone is violence.

Just saying its different doesn't make it so.

hitting and smacking are different and just because you say they are the same does not make them the same. You need a better argument than that.

 

[Serendipity..]

I understand how you would hold such a loopy philosophy, being a green party member and all, in New Zealand this crowd is looked on as the loopy left with Marxist leanings.

I repeat, look around you and see how this anti family/anti child philosophy has effected society and kids in general.

Teachers and parents today have been brainwashed by this Marxist new age teaching..the biggest losers are the kids.

the biggest looser with domestic violence is the victim. The same people that stoned adulterers to death recommended beating your children into a subservient state.

If you want to see why society is messed up turn your tv on because that is why! Our society started degrading when that was invented and the internet will be the final nail in the moral coffin.
The answer is not a lack if domestic violence on helpless individuals who can't fend for themselves it's a lack if good examples for them to learn from.

Every part of me would love to take out and belt a guy who tells me he beats up his kid.

Why wouldn't I naturally want to do that because I was flogged as a kid and used to have belt marks on my legs and cane blisters on my fingers. Yeah it's all ###wonderful.

 

[TheDag]

Thanks for your comment I guess you will advocate that next time you get a speeding fine and need a lesson a 7 foot tall guy can tie you to a pole and whip you to teach you right from wrong just like in Jesus day? Your logic of using violence as a correctional tool should fix society according to you so it should not be age dependent. If you think you should will it on another what's wrong with the same corporal punishment to you? I'll bet that's different...

yes of course it is different and I bet you agree it is a totally different situation. Do you believe in the theory of gravity? Do you believe in any science at all? If so then why do you not agree with the science that shows a childs mind works completely different to an adult mind. The reasoning that we have as adults is not the part of the brain a child uses in reasoning. We acknowledge that men should not get maternity leave because they are incapable of giving birth so parental leave was introduced because guess what! Men and women are different.
Secondly as a minor point of course it would be unreasonable to flog a person for speeding because the punishment does not fit the crime and because the predetermined penalty for that is a monetary fine plus demerit points. So why would you change the predetermined punishment? Makes no sense.
You know how I taught my kid not to pinch and hurt other kids like that at child care? After trying all the non-physical methods like so called experts suggested that didn't work my wife and I sat him down after he had hurt another child and pinched him hard. We then explained that how he felt and responded was how other kids felt when he did that to them and that it hurt. He didn't understand until the physical part of the punishment was used. He immeadiately stopped. Needless to say when the staff at childcare were amazed how he just suddenly stopped we did not tell them how we did it because people like you would overreact to it.

 

[TheDag]

the biggest looser with domestic violence is the victim. The same people that stoned adulterers to death recommended beating your children into a subservient state.

If you want to see why society is messed up turn your tv on because that is why! Our society started degrading when that was invented and the internet will be the final nail in the moral coffin.
The answer is not a lack if domestic violence on helpless individuals who can't fend for themselves it's a lack if good examples for them to learn from.

Every part of me would love to take out and belt a guy who tells me he beats up his kid.

Why wouldn't I naturally want to do that because I was flogged as a kid and used to have belt marks on my legs and cane blisters on my fingers. Yeah it's all ###wonderful.

see this explains a lot. You got beaten not smacked so you now just assume smacking is the same as beating.

You are naïve if you think things degraded with the invention of TV. Ever read history as to how first world war started? Racism. Racism exists today but is that because of TV? Nope it already existed. A teacher once did a great exercise. She printed out on paper a news article about some people going out on the town for drinks and ended up dead from being assaulted. As we discussed the article people made comments like you have. They denounced the falling moral standards. It was then that the teacher revealed the article was from a paper from the 1860's. Nothing has changed much. There is more people now which leads to problems that didn't exist in smaller communities. There is more media now and more efficient and widespread so we hear about more and more stuff. Media these days is very much about making money not news reporting so they make it more dramatic. Perfect example is the anti-bikie laws in Queensland. Crimes committed by Bikies make up less than 1% of crime in the state. Sure they are a smaller group so it could be a larger amount. However look closer and you find that the majority of those crimes are failure to turn up for bail and possesions of small amounts of drugs that would be considered personal use not dealing. Certainly there are some rather serious crimes committed by bikies but that is by far the minority yet they are being targeted in a massive way. Guess its fine for all the other drug users to continue to steal and assault people to get money to buy drugs because nobody is really targeting that.

I am thankful that because of TV I got to see the Berlin Wall come down. I got to see the extrodinary acts that people have done to help save people from raging flood waters including the boy who told rescuers to take his younger brother first and then ended up drowning himself. Or what about the image of Pope John Paul II visiting and forgiving the man who tried to assasinate him. Just because sometimes it is used for bad purposes don't forget all the wonderful things we have seen on tv that we would never hear about or see otherwise.

 

[ebia]

many teachers I have spoken to say that the problem is they removed corporal punishment from schools. I disagree. It most certainly is not a teachers role and I did know teachers who refused to use it when it was allowed and not one student would dare be rude to them. Every student feared these teachers. I guess we can just conclude that non-corporal punishment just induces fear which is just as or more damaging than physical punishment. What nobody has ever been able to answer for me though is that there is a stage in a childs life when punishment needs to be connected to the crime straight away. So what does one do when that isn't possible like if your on the way to the airport to catch a plane? Some have said do the punishment. Am I going to then fork out another $1000 to buy new plane tickets when we miss the plane? No sorry so no good. Others then respond get up earlier. Am I going to get the child up at 4am just in case they misbehave and require punishing? No of course not because getting them up that early is going to make them tired and grumpy and almost guarantees a problem in which case it is cruel to punish the child. Sure you may have yet another answer but I can guarantee this. No solution will be practical 100% of the time and therefore an alternative is required for those few, rare occasions when it is not suitable. hitting and smacking are different and just because you say they are the same does not make them the same. You need a better argument than that.

Smacking is hitting - your hand connects with the other's body in a manner intended to cause pain. The onus is on the one claiming they are different to demonstrate a difference.

 

[Serendipity..]

Smacking is hitting - your hand connects with the other's body in a manner intended to cause pain. The onus is on the one claiming they are different to demonstrate a difference.

Complex multilevel problems in society are solved with simplistic easily thought of answers, have you ever noticed that? Just snack kids that will fix everything without introducing new problems..