Do you think church attendance is important?

cloudyday2

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As I was saying, there really are not many churches/denominations that flatly consider missing Sunday worship to be a mortal sin.

The Roman Catholic Church is well-known for saying that it is, to which Cloudyday2 added the Eastern Orthodox churches. OK, so who else, out of the 30,000 remaining denominations we always read about agree with them on this issue?
Just to clarify: my understanding is that ex-communication in Eastern Orthodoxy means simply that the priest feels the parishioner should confess some sin before receiving communion. So ex-communication can be resolved simply by confessing. Also Eastern Orthodoxy emphasizes the uncertainty of salvation due to its dependence on the mercy of Jesus, so there is no concept of mortal sins.

But it is useful to remember that Catholics are about 50% of Christians and Orthodox are about 5%. The other 30,000 denominations are smaller percentages. So the views of Catholics are very important.
 
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Robban

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Just to clarify: my understanding is that ex-communication in Eastern Orthodoxy means simply that the priest feels the parishioner should confess some sin before receiving communion. So ex-communication can be resolved simply by confessing. Also Eastern Orthodoxy emphasizes the uncertainty of salvation due to its dependence on the mercy of Jesus, so there is no concept of mortal sins.

But it is useful to remember that Catholics are about 50% of Christians and Orthodox are about 5%. The other 30,000 denominations are smaller percentages. So the views of Catholics are very important.
Just to clarify: my understanding is that ex-communication in Eastern Orthodoxy means simply that the priest feels the parishioner should confess some sin before receiving communion. So ex-communication can be resolved simply by confessing. Also Eastern Orthodoxy emphasizes the uncertainty of salvation due to its dependence on the mercy of Jesus, so there is no concept of mortal sins.

But it is useful to remember that Catholics are about 50% of Christians and Orthodox are about 5%. The other 30,000 denominations are smaller percentages. So the views of Catholics are very important.

The tragic of it is that being owned by an organisation,

because that is what it amounts to,
when councils decide over what one should believe.

Fifth ecumenical council of 553 CE that anyone asserting the
the belief in the preexistence of souls, (reincarnation).

would anathema.

anathema=cursed, damned, excommunicated
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Blessed shall you be when you come in and blessed shall you be when you go out." (Deuteronomy 28:6)



May your departure from the world be as free of sin as was your entry into the world.
(Talmud)

If the soul did not preexist, how can it enter the world.

But they like to hold people in fear.
 
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ICONO'CLAST

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"bhsmte,
[You can repent all you like, if it works for you. Claiming to know what is best for me, is displaying arrogance.]
You can call names and make accusations but that will not change the fact that your conscience bears witness against you that there is a God who you are responsible to..
What is best for you as a professed atheist is to read the bible and see what it declares even if you do not believe it yet. See what it says, see what it says about those who remain in rebellion as truth suppressors. Hint, it does not end well for them.
As a side note, years ago I would have told you I would be the last person on earth who would ever believe the gospel. I starting to read the bible to find the mistakes and contradictions in it so I could curse out Christians.
i found all the mistakes, they were not in the bible, but in my own false world view,and rebellious attitude to God and his word, and people.
Not everyone will believe the bible. God has to allow you to. keep fighting and opposing yourself, but keep reading the scripture at the same time.:wave::idea:
 
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bhsmte

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"bhsmte,
[You can repent all you like, if it works for you. Claiming to know what is best for me, is displaying arrogance.]
You can call names and make accusations but that will not change the fact that your conscience bears witness against you that there is a God who you are responsible to..
What is best for you as a professed atheist is to read the bible and see what it declares even if you do not believe it yet. See what it says, see what it says about those who remain in rebellion as truth suppressors. Hint, it does not end well for them.
As a side note, years ago I would have told you I would be the last person on earth who would ever believe the gospel. I starting to read the bible to find the mistakes and contradictions in it so I could curse out Christians.
i found all the mistakes, they were not in the bible, but in my own false world view,and rebellious attitude to God and his word, and people.
Not everyone will believe the bible. God has to allow you to. keep fighting and opposing yourself, but keep reading the scripture at the same time.:wave::idea:

No name calling involved. When one claims to know what is best for someone and especially someone they dont know, it is indeed arrogant behavior.

In regards to your other statements, it is your opinion. If it works for you personally, knock yourself out.
 
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Francis Drake

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There was hardly any fellowship among the Corinthians,
Scripture says no such thing.
It was chaotic and nearest mayhem.
It was chaotic and full of schisms entirely because of the Nicolaitan way they followed after men.
Paul makes that abundantly clear in the first few chapters of 1 Corinthians.
Which is why Paul had to take the measures he did.
Measures to get rid of the hierarchical system that was working its way into the church.
 
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Robban

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Scripture says no such thing.

It was chaotic and full of schisms entirely because of the Nicolaitan way they followed after men.
Paul makes that abundantly clear in the first few chapters of 1 Corinthians.

Measures to get rid of the hierarchical system that was working its way into the church.

Social hierarchical.

There were well to do members turning up with expensive hairdos and fine clothes putting to shame those who did not have two pennies to rub together,

Drunkeness, trying fellows before a worldly court,
illicit sexual relations,
misuse of so called gifts.

anyone coming in from outside would think they had entered some kind of loonie bin.

There has to be a leadership but not like a pyramid,
instead like a plough,

the hard strong point first flanked by strong sides,

all for the protection of the weaker parts.

Influential in society members should not be given favours
over lesser influential members.

All have something to contribute.
 
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Robban

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Social hierarchical.

There were well to do members turning up with expensive hairdos and fine clothes putting to shame those who did not have two pennies to rub together,

Drunkeness, trying fellows before a worldly court,
illicit sexual relations,
misuse of so called gifts.

anyone coming in from outside would think they had entered some kind of loonie bin.

There has to be a leadership but not like a pyramid,
instead like a plough,

the hard strong point first flanked by strong sides,

all for the protection of the weaker parts.

Influential in society members should not be given favours
over lesser influential members.

All have something to contribute.


The template for Christian service, preaching, sermons etc,
can be found in Luke 4:16-20.
 
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Francis Drake

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Hate that you feel The Church has lost its way.
It's got nothing to do with feelings. The church lost its way centuries ago and has been on a decline ever since.
Actually The Church still has the same power of God it had in the first century. You just may not be familiar with it.
You must be joking. The church is completely powerless in comparison to the early church.
My earlier post was about the importance of going to "Church". Of course I know what 1 Corinthians says, the point is this occurs in a church setting not alone at one house.
What Paul calls for cannot possibly happen in a hierarchical church. Such a system is anathema to the Holy Spirit, which is why so many Christians are infantile, suckling weekly and weakly at the tit of their pastor.
I would urge you to go seek the real church it is still alive, powerful, and thriving in the world today and has surely not lost its way.
For me
to allow a pastor over my head is an affront to Christ, so there's n
o chance of me joining any such organisation ever again.
It was the Lord who told me to leave and shake the dust of my shoes.

My wife and I have occasionally gone to church over the least 12 years to see what's happening. But to us, its just like prison visiting, and we are so thankful we are free to pursue our calling free of all the garbage of church.
 
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bèlla

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Influential in society members should not be given favours over lesser influential members.

All have something to contribute.

I agree. But building projects, missions, and special events don't fund themselves. I recall a church who secured an interest free loan from a bank and $1million of it came from one source. Not to mention charitable giving and legacies. The majority who include the church in their estates are those with greater means.

I have always felt the Jewish approach of membership was better but I've yet to see it applied.
 
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bèlla

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It's got nothing to do with feelings. The church lost its way centuries ago and has been on a decline ever since.

I used to help an elderly woman with her mail. She contributed to Christian charities. I was appalled by the things I saw. Marketing gimmicks with blankets, dollar bills, and coins that were meant to convince her to donate to their cause. It was incredibly wasteful. And no matter how often she returned it they kept sending it. These weren't obscure organizations. They were very prominent.
 
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Robban

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I agree. But building projects, missions, and special events don't fund themselves. I recall a church who secured an interest free loan from a bank and $1million of it came from one source. Not to mention charitable giving and legacies. The majority who include the church in their estates are those with greater means.

I have always felt the Jewish approach of membership was better but I've yet to see it applied.

I once knew a Pastor, we were friends, I was often at his house.
He had come to town with his family,

The religeous in the town were not to keen about him coming.
It turned out to be a hard battle.

At home with the family the wife showed me a scrap book she was compiling, it contained pieces from newspapers

There were people going around the town with petitions against him.

This I did not understand.
Among other things, a new bigger church building,
something that the congregation wanted,

at a church meeting they voted to go ahead,

it turned out that it was mostly those who only attended
such meetings, never any other.

I could go on and on the whole evening,

about all the corruption,
it was unbelievable.

All the religeous in the town and neighbouring towns set all they had against him,
he had btw a handful of elders supporting him and a few other folks.

He was not given permission to start building.
So his wife phoned someone in the government,
to her surprise they answered,
"Of course no problem, when do you want it?"

Here comes the miracle part.

The wife was so over the moon, so she sent flowers to the person who had granted permission.

She got a call back and someone said,
"Sorry, no one here by that name."
 
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bèlla

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You can repent all you like, if it works for you. Claiming to know what is best for me, is displaying arrogance.

We cannot know anyone's heart. At best we are guessing or going by the things we've seen and experienced.

What brought you here?
 
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Robban

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Thank you for sharing the story. I love hearing about the miracles people have experienced. Especially those that show HaShem's lovingkindness to others.

May I ask a question please? Are you observant?

As much as I can, out of love for Him.
 
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Robban

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I am happy to hear that. Are you Orthodox? What is the Jewish community like in Sweden?

I reckon I will have to leave that for others, for me a Jew is a Jew is a Jew.

There is not much community other than in the big towns.
here where I live I am isolated.

So, I am a Chassid, :) a lamplighter,
shining a light wherever I can.

I,m happy with my lot.

Don,t think I would want it any other way.


(Contact with Chabad NY is only an e-mail away.)
 
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bèlla

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I reckon I will have to leave that for others, for me a Jew is a Jew is a Jew.

I understand your perspective. I have been in different settings and never think its philosophy. My mind is on Him.

There is not much community other than in the big towns.
here where I live I am isolated.

So, I am a Chassid, :) a lamplighter,
shining a light wherever I can.

If you are happy then that is through the grace of HaShem and you are where you're meant to be. I am familiar with Chabad. I live down the street from a house.

What are the biggest challenges that you face in shining your light?
 
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cloudyday2

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Blessed shall you be when you come in and blessed shall you be when you go out." (Deuteronomy 28:6)

May your departure from the world be as free of sin as was your entry into the world.
(Talmud)

If the soul did not preexist, how can it enter the world.
My question on reincarnation would be: what is preserved from CloudyDay1 to CloudyDay2? I seem to have started over the game of live with no inheritance from CloudyDay1. If I can't remember anything about CloudyDay1, then how is that reincarnation? I have inherited things, but they were not things specifically from CloudyDay1. I inherited my atoms, and my genetic code, and my upbringing, but those came from everybody in the past - not just CloudyDay1.
 
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Robban

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I understand your perspective. I have been in different settings and never think its philosophy. My mind is on Him.



If you are happy then that is through the grace of HaShem and you are where you're meant to be. I am familiar with Chabad. I live down the street from a house.

What are the biggest challenges that you face in shining your light?

Thanks.

I cannot think of any challenges directly.

All is by divine providence.

Nothing just happens.

Mind you I most surely have had, but if so,
then after coming through, I have learnt to trust more.

But we are all different, what is easy for one may be difficult
for another and vice versa.
But this you already know.
 
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bèlla

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Thanks.

I cannot think of any challenges directly.
All is by divine providence.
Nothing just happens.

No, it doesn't. I've seen that in my walk and marveled at the connections. He's woven everything together.

Mind you I most surely have had, but if so,
then after coming through, I have learnt to trust more.

Yes, my faith remains. I may experience an emotional response to what I'm enduring. But I trust Him.

But we are all different, what is easy for one may be difficult
for another and vice versa.
But this you already know.

Indeed, we were knit for a special purpose. There is little that I would change.
 
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