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Do you guys think that it's a sin to train martial arts / grappling as an Orthodox Christian ?

Discussion in 'The Ancient Way - Eastern Orthodox' started by Jude1:3Contendforthefaith, Jan 3, 2020.

  1. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith Well-Known Member Supporter

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    *** You Are In The Eastern Orthodox Forum ***


    I know that the spiritual side of eastern martial arts does absolutely have negative occult / demonic stuff :
    The Secrets Behind Martial Arts !

    But I'm specifically referring to :

    • The Self Defense Aspect

    and

    • The Physical Sporting (Wrestling) Combat / Exercise Aspect


    .
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
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  2. Kaon

    Kaon Well-Known Member

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    No.

    In fact, if you ask Him, He may train you Himself. But eventually you will have to QUIT the art if you learn from a human, or you can find a supremely westernized instructor that has little clue about the connecting philosophy.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
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  3. Kaon

    Kaon Well-Known Member

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    Why ask?
     
  4. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Mostly just to get an Orthodox perspective.

    Yesterday, at Divine Liturgy for Saint Seraphim of Sarov I was thinking about it. I remember my priest talking about how 3 robbers beat Saint Seraphim up with an axe handle while he was a monk in the forrest and they injured him to where it made him have a hunched back for the rest of his life.

    He didn't resist the thieves and his story just got me thinking about the topic.

    Seraphim of Sarov - Wikipedia


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    .
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
  5. ArmyMatt

    ArmyMatt Regular Member Supporter

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    that depends on the martial art. the ones that are tied in to eastern spirituality and theology are best to be avoided, even if the instructor doesn't get the theological implications.
     
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  6. Kaon

    Kaon Well-Known Member

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    I do think *everyone* needs to know a martial art, because everyone should know to defend one's self.

    But, even if I was "Jet Li" level in terms of mechanics, I don't think it is necessary to respond with force every time - even in the circumstance of your priest.

    Now, if I knew how to channel my ki, and project force balls or induce paralysis (from jitsu), then maybe I would do something.

    But, then I wouldn't be a [christian] priest if I executed that power without the blessing of the Most High.
     
  7. Jude1:3Contendforthefaith

    Jude1:3Contendforthefaith Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Oh, It wasn't my priest that it happened to. It happened to the monk that my priest was talking about during The Divine Liturgy.


    .
     
  8. Kaon

    Kaon Well-Known Member

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    Ah, my mistake.
     
  9. GreekOrthodox

    GreekOrthodox Psalti Chrysostom

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    If you take anything to extremes, it could be seen as problematic. Physical competitions in classic Greece were done in the nude and often attributed to the gods. From Wikipedia, it was said that the heroes Heracles and Theseus invented pankration (one of the Olympic sports) as a result of using both wrestling and boxing in their confrontations with opponents. Theseus was said to have utilized his extraordinary pankration skills to defeat the dreaded Minotaur in the Labyrinth. Heracles was said to have subdued the Nemean lion using pankration, and was often depicted in ancient artwork doing that. Heck, the Grecian Olympics were shut down by the Emperor Theodosius in AD 393 because they were pagan and dedicated to Zeus.

    So theoretically, you shouldn't run competitively, wrestle, box, perform martial arts of any kind or exert yourself physically in ANY manner because St. Paul writes to Timothy that "For bodily exercise is of a little profit, but godliness is profitable for everything, holding the promise of the present life and of the one coming."

    Of course, lack of exercise is one of the reasons why I developed diabetes during seminary and can not do the longer fasts because of their reliance on carbohydrates. IMHO, we've pretty much removed the spiritual side of eastern spiritual practices and have remarketed them as Christianized versions. Kajukenbo - Christian Martial Arts - Harvest at Kumulani Chapel So I do do yoga at home for its low impact (my knees at 51 can't take the pounding of running and I'm probably going to need to have my shoulder replaced at some point). I'd love to try tai chi because I have no interest in the hard martial arts.

    TL; DR Everything can have a pagan origin, just avoid the practitioners who still utilize Eastern spiritual exercises as a part of their program. You wouldn't go to a boxing school that practices as the Greeks did, nude and dedicated to Zeus.

    Chronia polla! Happy New Year!
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
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  10. rusmeister

    rusmeister A Russified American Orthodox Chestertonian

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    No. (with Fr Matt's proviso above)
    Stuff like yoga can be really dangerous. But just disciplining your body - a form of readiness, as long as you don't get carried away.
     
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  11. Deus Vult!

    Deus Vult! Member

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    Should you need to fight a "just war" how could you if you know not how to fight? Just approaching it from a philosophical pov kinda let's you know that you do not sin at all in this.
     
  12. ArmyMatt

    ArmyMatt Regular Member Supporter

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    from the Orthodox POV, there is no such thing as a just war. even when necessary, it's still sinful.
     
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  13. Not David

    Not David Der Ewige Katechumene

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    Do boxing and wrestling count?
     
  14. Deus Vult!

    Deus Vult! Member

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    Not true. But I am not going to waste time on a matter like that. You know in your heart that there are justifiable wars. This thread was about this guy asking if it was a sin to train in MMA. I said no, and said that should he be required to defend himself, family, town, or nation, training would only help that cause.
     
  15. ArmyMatt

    ArmyMatt Regular Member Supporter

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    well, as someone who fought in Afghanistan and is an Orthodox Christian, I can say from the Orthodox POV that all war is a sin, even when necessary.

    that being said, if you read my previous post, I said as far as martial arts goes it depends on which one.
     
  16. Deus Vult!

    Deus Vult! Member

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    "that all war is a sin" Yes, neither I, nor the Catholic Church, teaches that there are not sins occurring while wars are being carried out.
    The language in the Catechism of the CC clearly presents warfare as sinful.
     
  17. ArmyMatt

    ArmyMatt Regular Member Supporter

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    right...so if warfare is sinful, there is no just war.

    and, as a sidebar, the OP was asking for the Orthodox understanding.
     
  18. Deus Vult!

    Deus Vult! Member

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    Incorrect. This is non sense.
    Stick to your MMA discussion I will excuse myself.
     
  19. Anhelyna

    Anhelyna Handmaid of God Supporter CF Senior Ambassador

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  20. ArmyMatt

    ArmyMatt Regular Member Supporter

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    well, as a veteran and an Orthodox Christian (and this is the Orthodox forum), I can say I am not incorrect.

    whether or not you agree theologically is irrelevant, since he was asking from our POV and not yours, and I think I know our faith better than you do.
     
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