Do we lose our memories in heaven?

[Phil 1:21]

It seems like you want heaven, but on your terms, not God's terms. Our feeble human reckoning is not capable of grasping the totality or glory of Heaven. Put your faith in God that His plan for your eternity is far better than anything you could think of and stop worrying about it.

 

[Radrook]

In that case in a way that makes hell AND heaven both awful in different ways. Tortured on one end, brainwashed to be happy and forget forever on the other (and in the latter case then you're not really you).

Kind of a sadistic choice if that's the case, really. Is it any wonder that there's a drive to live forever on the Earth (and eventually on other planets) then die? Honestly if the choice between heaven and hell involved both places being like that I'd pick option 3 of "living forever on Earth/this universe where we keep our personalities and memories and live for extended centuries and possibly forever".

Well, it is definitely a scenario that certain Charismatics constantly present as part of their Gospel.
Curiously, they don't seem to mind having friends and family members roasted alive forever. In fact, they speak with great enthusiasm when describing how the wicked will roast forever as they in contrast enjoy eternal heavenly bliss.

So I guess for such persons the gruesome situation would be simply unceremoniously brushed aside as a righteously necessary. For such individuals no memory modification would seem to be needed. That is of course providing that they are really being sincere and not merely reacting out of sheer terror in hopes of convincing their god that they don't deserve being sent there themselves.


BTW
Fortunately, not all Christians subscribe to the eternal torment in a literal hell teaching. So one doesn't have to believe that particular interpretation in order avail oneself of Christ's Ransom Sacrifice for our sins.

 

[Radrook]

It seems like you want heaven, but on your terms, not God's terms. Our feeble human reckoning is not capable of grasping the totality or glory of Heaven. Put your faith in God that His plan for your eternity is far better than anything you could think of and stop worrying about it.

I suggest instead that we stop describing being resurrected to heaven as if there is something very seriously wrong involved that we should indeed be worried about.

 

[Radrook]

That's different though. Pain in some small forms helps us grow (malicious enduring pain though is senseless) and learn better next time. Sometimes it shapes who we are. For instance, someone might love mountain biking but know not to go too fast own a certain hill because they got hurt last time. Or someone becomes and athlete, messes up a few times, but they fight through it to be a better athlete.

So take away the minor pain that played some part in growing (in the more positive cases) and you take away who that person is. If you wipe all memories of pain, even the tiniest, then in some cases part of you might be lost. In which case you are not you. "You" is gone.

Absolutely true. That applies as well; to how we feel concerning human suffering. If we were once greatly disturbed by unnecessary human agony and are somehow changed so that we can suddenly calmly countenance it even if family or former friends are involved-then we are definitely no longer the same person. In fact, it can be argued that instead of being glorified in to morally superior condition we will have been degraded by being made callously unconcerned and incapable of feeling mercy or compassion.

 

[CrystalDragon]

It seems like you want heaven, but on your terms, not God's terms. Our feeble human reckoning is not capable of grasping the totality or glory of Heaven. Put your faith in God that His plan for your eternity is far better than anything you could think of and stop worrying about it.

My problem is the implication that "God's terms" means "'people being tortured forever' one way and 'taking the memories of his followers so they don't care about anyone they knew and just blindly worship God' the other way". And if that's the case, that is the exact opposite of love. If that's the case then that would paint God as an evil egoistic masochistic sadist who should be fought against and not worshipped.

 

[Phil 1:21]

My problem is the implication that "God's terms" means "'people being tortured forever' one way and 'taking the memories of his followers so they don't care about anyone they knew and just blindly worship God' the other way". And if that's the case, that is the exact opposite of love. If that's the case then that would paint God as an evil egoistic masochistic sadist.

At some point is truly comes down to whether you have faith in God or not.

I see you listed yourself as Catholic. I would highly suggest you sit down with your parish priest and see if he can talk you through some of these issues you're struggling with (including the divine inspiration of scripture). Sometimes some face time with clergy is better than keyboard time with people on the internet.

 

[Halbhh]

For myself, to answer this question, it helps me to remember how overwhelming and transformative it is to experience the glory of God (which is beyond words, but overwhelming we know). We will be transformed, and the old will fall away. Also, when you think about it, the reason you miss anyone when they die is because of their love towards you. It's their love you miss. But love is the central command of Christ to us, and so the people we miss now are the people who were obeying Christ in this way, and we miss them to the extent that they truly showed real love...so.... Those that we would miss the most we also might well expect to see there.

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

Here's the thing: hell is an awful place. I have things I could say on it but I won't (yet) for the purposes of this thread.

If we have any sort of conscience at all, we'd feel terrible for those suffering in hell. But it's said that in heaven there will be no more tears, and we'll only be focused on worshipping God.

By the sound of it, in heaven we basically lose our memories and personalities and are only focused on worshipping God and nothing else.

If that's the case, then if we discount Purgatory our afterlife options are either being tortured forever in hell or being brainwashed until we aren't "us" anymore in heaven. Which if that's the case then God is not love and is instead a sadistic tyrant.

So, DO we lose our memories in heaven? Are we able to stay who we were on Earth? If our memories are erased, then what was the point of us being judged for our actions if God could easily wire our brains to act a certain way from when we were young?

I would say no becuase the pain of memorizing people who you know for sure...friends...cousins...maybe your own parents... that died outside of christ would be too much. Also the bible indicates this as well when it talks about how their will be no pain and such...IDk about you but thinking about someone who is in hell while i'm up there is pain.

The bible isn't clear on this though we know the saints get a new body but that's it really and I guess it's cause it isn't important to know while on Earth but it's a good question nevertheless.

 

[CrystalDragon]

For myself, to answer this question, it helps me to remember how overwhelming and transformative it is to experience the glory of God (which is beyond words, but overwhelming we know). We will be transformed, and the old will fall away. Also, when you think about it, the reason you miss anyone when they die is because of their love towards you. It's their love you miss. But love is the central command of Christ to us, and so the people we miss now are the people who were obeying Christ in this way, and we miss them to the extent that they truly showed real love...so.... Those that we would miss the most we also might well expect to see there.

That's a problem I have. "Overwhelming" "Transformed", it means we'll be changed to the point we'll cease to be us. That's almost as much as hell as hell, because you're no longer you. All you focus on is worshipping God and his glory. It would be like going to church and kneeling every second for all eternity. That's not the kind of existence I think most people would want. Something like that is still brainwashing to be a certain way and lose everything that made you "you". It's like having the "God doesn't interfere with free will" view (which I think is false since he interfered with free will even in the Bible) and then having that view snatched away. You cease to be you. "You" then die because you're changed so much.

Again, two afterlife sides and both of them are awful in different ways if that's the case. One you stay yourself and are tortured. The other you are unrecognizable as your old personality and just want to worship.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

The other you are unrecognizable as your old personality and just want to worship.

If you don't choose this one,
you remain the other one.

This one is much much better and different than you have been made or led to believe.

Remember in the vision of Jesus , Moses, and Elijah,
they were all recognizable,
and everyone will be perfectly recognizable in the life to come;
everyone who makes it there.

Everyone else will be forgotten. No sorrows, no pain, no grief in heaven.

 

[frettr00]

If becoming a mindless worship zombie makes me happy, so be it. It'll be an improvement from my happiness in this life for sure.

 

[CrystalDragon]

If you don't choose this one,
you remain the other one.

This one is much much better and different than you have been made or led to believe.

Remember in the vision of Jesus , Moses, and Elijah,
they were all recognizable,
and everyone will be perfectly recognizable in the life to come;
everyone who makes it there.

Everyone else will be forgotten. No sorrows, no pain, no grief in heaven.

I'd rather keep my personality than be turned into something that loses all my interests and has only kneeling down and singing praises on their mind all the time. If you take away our personalities, we are no longer "us".

 

[CrystalDragon]

If becoming a mindless worship zombie makes me happy, so be it. It'll be an improvement from my happiness in this life for sure.

You must not be very happy in your life then. I'm sorry to hear that.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

That's different though. Pain in some small forms helps us grow (malicious enduring pain though is senseless) and learn better next time. Sometimes it shapes who we are. For instance, someone might love mountain biking but know not to go too fast own a certain hill because they got hurt last time. Or someone becomes and athlete, messes up a few times, but they fight through it to be a better athlete.

So take away the minor pain that played some part in growing (in the more positive cases) and you take away who that person is. If you wipe all memories of pain, even the tiniest, then in some cases part of you might be lost. In which case you are not you. "You" is gone.

Here's a thought I'd like to offer for your consideration, Crystal...

In whatever state we find ourselves in the future in the presence of God, Jesus will always be the Lamb of God who was slain from before the foundation of the world. In mulling this over, it doesn't sound like we are going to 'forget' the fact that Jesus was crucified for the sins of the world; our sins even. We will always know Him as our Wonderful Savior who gave Himself for us. I'm thinking the remnants of His wounds will always be a part of His person, serving as reminders to us of how far we've come with Him, and why.

If God is planning on wiping out our minds, then He'll also be also wiping out one of the central characteristics by which we associate with Jesus in our identity as people and as Christians. He'll be wiping away both the pain of our sin but also one of the main contexts for which we praise and love Him. So, if God isn't going to wipe out our association with the pain of Christ, I don't think He'll be wiping out as much as you're concerned He will.

Something to think about.

Peace,
2PhiloVoid

 

[Hillsage]

No, we don't lose our memories in heaven. I would ask you this, if the thought of people being tormented bugs you, what are you doing about it? Are you spreading the word, etc...?

What if you are being MR/MS EVANGELIST, but God isn't.

2TI 2:25 ...God may perhaps grant that they will repent and come to know the truth,

JOH 6:37 All that the Father gives me will come to me; and him who comes to me I will not cast out.
PHI 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

I personally don't think 'your will' is going to ever trump 'His will'. And when He is ready HE 'draws and calls'. And you WILL hear and answer yes to His will. because you will, for the first time, have 'the faith' to do so.

ROM 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word/rhema of God.

[/quote]That all being said, when we past into the afterlife our understanding increases. I am an awakened individual, meaning I can understand a lot now that most people don't. I fully comprehend that people choose to be selfish, they choose to love themselves more than others. They choose to hurt others for their own gain. I do not. When it comes down to it, people will be on hell for their own unrightousness, for the evil they continue to do because it gives them pleasure.[/quote]
They simply are manifesting the curse God place on them through no 'asking of their own'.

ROM 5:20 Law came in, to increase the trespass;

ROM 11:32 For God has consigned all men to disobedience,

 

[christopher mccarthy]

Yea, it's kinda like wiping a hard drive. UGH, nope!.........Start reading the "Left Behind " series, it'l explain everything

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I'd rather keep my personality than be turned into something that loses all my interests and has only kneeling down and singing praises on their mind all the time. If you take away our personalities, we are no longer "us".

Potentially good then.
Do you want to keep the old sinful nature ?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Yea, it's kinda like wiping a hard drive. UGH, nope!.........Start reading the "Left Behind " series, it'l explain everything

The left behind series is like deep quicksand - not solid rock to build anything on.

 

[CrystalDragon]

Potentially good then.
Do you want to keep the old sinful nature ?

Depends what "sinful nature" means. If sin is defined by God, then anything could suddenly become a sin. The Old Testament said no one with a blemish could stand before the altar of God. So that puts us glasses-wearers out, for instance. It was a bad things to eat shellfish, or eat pork, or wear mixed fabrics, or do so much as pick up a stick on the Sabbath. God could technically say anything is "sinful" and it would be sinful. So it depends on what part of "sinful nature" you would mean.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Depends what "sinful nature" means. If sin is defined by God, then anything could suddenly become a sin. .... So it depends on what part of "sinful nature" you would mean.

No, it matters not at all what I would mean.

What YHWH means is what is all - important; and potentially leads to eternal life, or eternal condemnation,
as YHWH has Said Clearly.
(all sin, every kind, every thought, every 'flesh' must be crucified)
(i.e. worldly crystals, heathen dragons, and meanings and motives and all sexual desires and all mental worldly idols and everything thereof that are of the world, apart from and opposed to Christ Jesus)

Learn from His Word, (requires learning from YHWH Himself, usually always by/from reading His Word personally, not learning fables of mankind, nor lies nor doctrines nor traditions of religion)

particularly
not "anything could suddenly become a sin"
but "everything IS sinful"

and the only freedom from guilt and shame,
the only hope for anyone ,
is in calling personally on Jesus as He Says Repeatedly and Clearly.

 

[CrystalDragon]

No, it matters not at all what I would mean.

What YHWH means is what is all - important; and potentially leads to eternal life, or eternal condemnation,
as YHWH has Said Clearly.
(all sin, every kind, every thought, every 'flesh' must be crucified)
(i.e. worldly crystals, heathen dragons, and meanings and motives and all sexual desires and all mental worldly idols and everything thereof that are of the world, apart from and opposed to Christ Jesus)

Learn from His Word, (requires learning from YHWH Himself, usually always by/from reading His Word personally, not learning fables of mankind, nor lies nor doctrines nor traditions of religion)

particularly
not "anything could suddenly become a sin"
but "everything IS sinful"

and the only freedom from guilt and shame,
the only hope for anyone ,
is in calling personally on Jesus as He Says Repeatedly and Clearly.

If everything is sinful and all "sin" is eradicated, then that means that by what you're saying that we completely lose who we are in heaven.

I think most (me included) would want to stay as they are and keep their personalities and memories rather than being brainwashed to have the old you be eradicated and no longer having a mind of your own and just being part of a worship-centered thinks-about-nothing-else-with-no-free-thought collective.