Do not judge lest you be judged goes too far

[Hillsage]

If you are in congregational leadership in some capacity - you DO have the authority to judge.

1 Corinthians 5:12b
Do you not judge those who are within the church?
13 But those who are outside, God judges. Remove the wicked man from among yourselves.

1 Corinthians 6:1
Does any one of you, when he has a case against his neighbor, dare to go to law before the unrighteous and not before the saints? 2 Or do you not know that the saints will judge the world? If the world is judged by you, are you not competent to constitute the smallest law courts? 3 Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more matters of this life?​

That's good input Dave. But it kind of puts me in a 'questioning corner'. Do you believe it is wrong to serve on jury duty then? If not, then how do you reconcile that with the verses you've shared?

 

[Hillsage]

1 Corinthians 5:5
I have decided to deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

1 Corinthians 5:13b
Remove the wicked man from among yourselves.​

I see that as a punishment/judgement for sin. And I still don't see the word "ejection".

 

[Dave-W]

That's good input Dave. But it kind of puts me in a 'questioning corner'. Do you believe it is wrong to serve on jury duty then? If not, then how do you reconcile that with the verses you've shared?

No - as that comes under the jurisdiction of the state. We are to obey the state as long as it does not cause us to sin. And serving on a jury is not an individual acting as prosecutor, judge and executioner.

 

[Dave-W]

I still don't see the word "ejection".

Is not "Remove" close enough?


1 Corinthians 5:13b
Remove the wicked man from among yourselves.

 

[Halbhh]

Here's 2 things to first digest.

Christ's Words to you in Luke 6:37,

37 “Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven."

And learning the meaning of "condemn", and you'll get that judging an action is not condemning a person.

 

[seek2bboldwitness]

I am of those who do believe we Christians ARE to judge, but only within the limitations of what the Word of God permits. The explanation that I find most reasonable is found on the following link.

What does the Bible mean that we are not to judge others?

 

[Dave-W]

Here's 2 things to first digest.
Christ's Words to you in Luke 6:37,

And His words to YOU:

John 7:24
Judge not according to appearance, but judge righteous judgment.​

 

[Halbhh]

I am of those who do believe we Christians ARE to judge, but only within the limitations of what the Word of God permits. The explanation that I find most reasonable is found on the following link.

What does the Bible mean that we are not to judge others?

A fairly good and fairly competent exposition on how to judge actions correctly.

One could even just reduce it down to one key sentence, in a pinch -- "Jesus is giving us permission to tell right from wrong."

But it is missing!!! a more important command from Christ!

And so has to use so many words and scriptures, lacking the central command, that it's finally so long that many readers won't read all of it, and may miss the most important part of all!

The more important command? That in Luke chapter 6, v 37, and it's crucial message to us --
"Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven."

Fear God, and hurry to listen to what Christ commands you.

Judge actions correctly. But, do not condemn people. Don't judge persons as persons, but judge instead actions and words and ideas.

 

[Halbhh]

Fall over yourself, dropping everything, and rush to listen to Christ's commands to you, so that you may Live.

 

[Halbhh]

And His words to YOU:

John 7:24
Judge not according to appearance, but judge righteous judgment.​

You simply agree with me on that. But did you fear God and drop everything and rush to hear what Christ commands? We all must if we want to live.

 

[Rajni]

What do people mean when they say do not judge lest you be judge?

It could also refer to the psychological tendency to condemn
those things with which we have some similar shortcoming.

This is why I find that the things that bug me the most about
another person turn out to be things I, myself, have in common
with them either directly or indirectly. In this sense, I am being
judged at the very same moment I’m judging.

This can make the tendency to judge an excellent (and humbling)
self-diagnostic tool.

On another note, I find it amusing that people will tell you not to
judge them if what you say of them is negative in nature, yet no
one ever complains when you say something nice about them
(which is also judging).


-

 

[seek2bboldwitness]

Even the non-believer has heard and readily spews back at us the words “Do not judge, or you too will be judged” (Matthew 7:1), fellow Christians likewise. As posted above "And so has to use so many words and scriptures, lacking the central command, that it's finally so long that many readers won't read all of it, and may miss the most important part of all!", it is the reader that is missing out when one particular scripture is deemed to be the most important part of all. We are taught to understand the Word in context and each verse of this particular topic builds one onto another. I say if one is to have a biblical understanding of when and how Christians are to judge or not, then the foundation of those understandings must be taken as a whole for far too many Christians lack biblical knowledge and have not the inclination to read and study the Word and leave it to the theologians, scholars and most of all their pastors or priests to disseminate the knowledge and wisdom of God's Word to the reader, the listener, the members of a congregation, what have you. It's kin to what is written in James 2:19 "You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble!". My point is that one must decide to accept the entirety of the entire Holy Bible or cherry pick it. It is for each person to decide. I stand by my contention that the link I offered in an earlier post gives a well reasoned understanding on the matter.

 

[Introverted1293]

I will respond a little later.

 

[Introverted1293]

I'd say you're going to have to define 'soul' for me. When Peter judged Annanias and Saphira as being 'liars' you don't think that was a soulish judgment?

What about GOD? And what about the Son He sent to die for YOU? You might want to rethink your belief IMO.

What I mean is that I never judge someone about whether they are going to heaven or hell. I have in the past wished somebody burned in hell, but I knew that that was wrong. But I will still get very angry when someone hurts another person.

As for my sin hurting other people but myself, I am aware that my sin cause the death of Jesus Christ just like the whole entire world. But Jesus only died for his people. I am not really sure if I am his yet. If I end up in hell, that shows that Jesus didn't die for me.

True Christians don't continue to sin. For it is written in Scripture that a person that has been born of God does not continue to practice sin. I still sin because I am addicted to certain behaviors that is considered sinful. I don't know how to stop. But, like I said, it doesn't hurt anyone but myself. It angers God, but I don't think he is saddened by it. I am not deceived into thinking that my sin isn't going to have consequences. I know that it will.


It is written


For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

So I just want to let you know that I am not deceived into thinking that my sin won't have consequences. I have always seen God as an Angry God but not as someone who gets hurt. But maybe there is not a difference.

PS As for your question about Peter and the other apostle that judged ananias and Sapphira for their lies, no I do not think it was soulish because they were given the authority to make that judgement. That's how I see it. But I also recognize that I do not know everything.

 

[Introverted1293]

God is a God of absolute Justice. In the Bible God provided law and a system of Judges to settle disputes between people. Jesus talks about forgiveness and as God forgives us we are to forgive others.

You are right about that Joshua. I know I need to work on my forgiveness and you are right about God being the ultimate God of Justice. I just need to remember that.

 

[Halbhh]

Even the non-believer has heard and readily spews back at us the words “Do not judge, or you too will be judged” (Matthew 7:1), fellow Christians likewise. As posted above "And so has to use so many words and scriptures, lacking the central command, that it's finally so long that many readers won't read all of it, and may miss the most important part of all!", it is the reader that is missing out when one particular scripture is deemed to be the most important part of all. We are taught to understand the Word in context and each verse of this particular topic builds one onto another. I say if one is to have a biblical understanding of when and how Christians are to judge or not, then the foundation of those understandings must be taken as a whole for far too many Christians lack biblical knowledge and have not the inclination to read and study the Word and leave it to the theologians, scholars and most of all their pastors or priests to disseminate the knowledge and wisdom of God's Word to the reader, the listener, the members of a congregation, what have you. It's kin to what is written in James 2:19 "You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble!". My point is that one must decide to accept the entirety of the entire Holy Bible or cherry pick it. It is for each person to decide. I stand by my contention that the link I offered in an earlier post gives a well reasoned understanding on the matter.

I should put it in every post, to help each new person seeing any post not jump to the wrong guess that I'm somehow Fred or Bob or Stan from 2 or 5 years ago....

We can judge actions, and need to, But we are not to condemn people as persons.

Dear brother, I bet you'd agree we should each read fully through a gospel.

But how often???

For me, it's got to be every year, but I don't think someone is lost if they haven't in 3 years, or 4. Still, at some point, it's finally too long a time without listening to Him....

I tell people to take their time and really listen, try not to talk over Him, as we read. We are reading words that are actually eternal --

"Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away."

This is the solution to these problems of disagreeing on doctrines.

That He is the Teacher, not any of us.

"Nor are you to be called instructors, for you have one Instructor, the Messiah."

I certainly don't need you to agree with me, a mere mortal person here. It's Him we must learn from, and it's seems that a only a tiny minority of people have read through a gospel in the last few years, or 4 or 5 years.

Why is that?

 

[Introverted1293]

I should put it in every post, to help each new person seeing any post not jump to the wrong guess that I'm somehow Fred or Bob or Stan from 2 or 5 years ago....

We can judge actions, and need to, But we are not to condemn people as persons.

Dear brother, I bet you'd agree we should each read fully through a gospel.

But how often???

For me, it's got to be every year, but I don't think someone is lost if they haven't in 3 years, or 4. Still, at some point, it's finally too long a time without listening to Him....

I tell people to take their time and really listen, try not to talk over Him, as we read. We are reading words that are actually eternal --

"Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away."

This is the solution to these problems of disagreeing on doctrines.

That He is the Teacher, not any of us.

"Nor are you to be called instructors, for you have one Instructor, the Messiah."

I certainly don't need you to agree with me, a mere mortal person here. It's Him we must learn from, and it's seems that a only a tiny minority of people have read through a gospel in the last few years, or 4 or 5 years.

Why is that?

No, I completely understand. I know that I am not to condemn anybody. But I understand what you are saying.

 

[Almost there]

What do people mean when they say do not judge lest you be judge?

I know that I am sinful and that I am far from perfect. I struggle with inappropriate contentography, which I am seeking God's help, and lust. I struggle with anger and bitterness. I do not trust a lot of people, therefore I do not really attend church. I have lied to people. I have been slothful and lazy, which I am changing by going to school. I have glutton many times. Food was like a comforting to me because I gone through depression. I know that I am very sinful. I know that I deserve death and Wrath. I am far from perfect.

But that doesn't mean that I am not going to be upset when I hear of people killing other people; not just killing them, but brutally killing them. I am going to be upset when I hear of an uncle who drowned his nephew because he wanted to know what it would be like to kill somebody. I am going to be upset at the mother who drowned her own daughter, even though she said she didn't mean to, to teach her a lesson in obedience. I am going to always be upset at people who cause pain to other people. I know that I am sinful, but my sin only causes me pain and no one else's. When I get upset at somebody for drowning their nephew or killing their little girl to teach her a lesson, it is not me being self-righteous. I am just naturally reacting to the brutality of human behavior. But when I get upset I sometimes get Christians saying stuff like well you are not perfect yourself so you have no right to judge.

I am not judging them based on how sinful they are. I am judging them based on how I would feel if somebody was to do that to my niece or nephew or somebody that I love. To me going around saying stuff like you can't judge is false humbleness. I know that I am far from perfect. But would you actually say that if somebody had violated or hurt your little boy or girl or your mother or father? I doubt it.

So my question is what do people mean that you can't judge? It is almost impossible not to judge in this world. We all know that we are far from perfect. But how can you tell me not to judge someone that kills innocent people? Well according to the Bible nobody's innocent, but you know what I mean.

Let us use a less severe crime as an example. Let's say that you had your rent money in your purse or if you're a man in your wallet and somebody stole it from you, would you like it if somebody says you are just as sinful as that Thief if you we're upset to that somebody stole from you? It would be hard not to get upset when you were violated. I'm just saying it's hard not to judge. So what do people mean when they say that we cannot judge?

I don't judge people, but I sure judge what they do and say. I got in trouble with this in my old southern Gospel band. I'd hear really whacked preaching from "lay preachers" that really had nothing to say and missed, terribly, the meaning of the short scripture they used to come up with a half hour of ranting and yelling.

When I commented on this, I was told not to judge. Poppycock I said. I'm not judging the man. I'm judging his words. If a guy tells me it's ok to spend money on prostitutes, I'm going to judge what he said to me.

On a side note, we DID have a very judgemental member (is it judgemental for me to mention this?) who would say, to the congregationfrom the mic, that on Sunday morning he saw a farmer driving his tractor, pulling a load of hay or other crop. He'd then say, "Why is that man not in church?!"

Finally, one week, I'd had it, and I said, in my mic, to the whole congregation, "maybe he is Seventh Day Adventist.".

Who knows why he was driving his tractor? Maybe he's not Christian, maybe he IS seventh day adventist. Maybe he goes to Saturday night or Sunday night service. But I can't judge a man's heart.

Also, the bible tells us to judge many things people say and do. We are not to be idiots.

 

[Hillsage]

PS As for your question about Peter and the other apostle that judged ananias and Sapphira for their lies, no I do not think it was soulish because they were given the authority to make that judgement. That's how I see it. But I also recognize that I do not know everything.

You misunderstand, I was saying that Peter was not soulish with his 'spiritual judgment' of the lying SOUL's of Annanias and Saphira.

My definition of the soul is the 'mind, will, intellect' of a person. Many agree with this definition, some don't. You may be in 'that' camp.

 

[Introverted1293]

You misunderstand, I was saying that Peter was not soulish with his 'spiritual judgment' of the lying SOUL's of Annanias and Saphira.

My definition of the soul is the 'mind, will, intellect' of a person. Many agree with this definition, some don't. You may be in 'that' camp.

That's actually informative. And yeah, I did misunderstood what you were saying. I guess I just don't understand what the soul is. Well, I didn't understand until you kind of gave me the definition. I always thought the soul had to do with the spirit of a person. You know how when your physical body dies but your spirit doesn't die. I kind of thought that's what the soul was.

But I don't always understand what I am talking about. I sometimes think I know what I'm talking about but it turns out that I didn't know a thing that I was talking about.