Do Jews still exist?

[Lazarus Short]

Christ himself is mixed blood, such as Ruth and Rehab and perhaps that alone is a large enough deviation. Certainly spiritual speaking the point seems to be the slightest amount has effect on the whole and can't be separated. But not being quite that strict and still considering the disciples to all be natural branches of Rom 11 how much mix blood must take place to no longer be what was 2000 years ago? Or does it matter? Are natural branches more about cultural and religious distinctions than genetic?

Ruth was an Israelite, and it is easily proven.

 

[solid_core]

It however seems to be a popular application. Perhaps identifying "Jews" in this way was in poor taste on my part and I don't mean to attack anyone's heritage or come across as antisemitic. Prejudice is not my focus but rather how we should look at the natural branches applied today or if we should at all. Implications of course affect how we view the world in a spiritual context and who our mission is and how we should be supporting that mission.

If you cut out a branch from a tree and it lays on the ground for 2,000 years and mix with all wrong spirituality and mix with other nationalities, is it still a natural branch?

 

[DamianWarS]

Ruth was an Israelite, and it is easily proven.

I was looking at Ruth as a Moabite, but either way, Rahab wasn't an Israelite.

 

[DamianWarS]

If you cut out a branch from a tree and it lays on the ground for 2,000 years and mix with all wrong spirituality and mix with other nationalities, is it still a natural branch?

It would be a hybrid and over time it's own variety. If there is only 1 true tree and all else is wild then of course given those two options it would be wild.

 

[Oldmantook]

Do you consider a "mostly" Ashkenazi Jew (today) as a natural branch as described in Romans 11?

That would depend on how you define "natural branch." In Romans 11 Paul refers to the natural branch and describes himself as "an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin" in v.1. So I suppose in order to be a natural branch - one must be a descendant of Abraham with ancestors who were of the 12 tribes. Does the purity of bloodline effect one's natural branch status? I don't know the answer to that. What I do find ironic and quite disturbing though is that the State of Israel subjugates the Palestinians, many of who are Christians and who may have more direct lineage to Abraham then do the Ashkenazis.

 

[redleghunter]

Considering antisemitism has been rampant since the 1st Century AD to this day, there have always been Hebrew-Jewish people and societies.

And actually it was 10th Century AD that we have the extant copies of the Hebrew Scriptures.

And no...The majority of the Jews who came home to Israel after 1948 were actually Jews and not converts to Judaism. They were what was left of what Hitler and Stalin did not murder.

 

[redleghunter]

What I do find ironic and quite disturbing though is that the State of Israel subjugates the Palestinians, many of who are Christians and who may have more direct lineage to Abraham then do the Ashkenazis.

Interesting as Palestinians living in Israel vote, have representatives in government and last few elections had a power block one Jewish party courted for a coalition government.

 

[Hank77]

And no...The majority of the Jews who came home to Israel after 1948 were actually Jews and not converts to Judaism. They were what was left of what Hitler and Stalin did not murder.

They were also Jews who had been living in Mid-Eastern countries/cities such as Aleppo, Syria for generations where they kept the Aleppo Codex safe for 500 yrs. Many of them didn't want to leave and move to Israel but the Muslims in Syria turned against them.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

I read somewhere that Palestinians are the closest relatives to biblical Israelites.

Today's Jews in Israel are mostly converts from Russia, Europe and other parts of the world.

Because the records of Israelite tribes lineages were destroyed in the Great Judgement in the first century, all such claims todays are just guesses or simply invented.

Where do you get this stuff from?? Where is your proof of this?

 

[Quietus]

Jewish Conspiracy: Christian Zionism - The Overlords of Chaos

Jewish Conspiracy 40: Roots of Zionism - The Overlords of Chaos

Jewish Conspiracy 25: Kabbalah- the Luciferian Doctrines of "the Jews" - The Overlords of Chaos

 

[Hank77]

That would depend on how you define "natural branch." In Romans 11 Paul refers to the natural branch and describes himself as "an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin" in v.1. So I suppose in order to be a natural branch - one must be a descendant of Abraham with ancestors who were of the 12 tribes. Does the purity of bloodline effect one's natural branch status? I don't know the answer to that. What I do find ironic and quite disturbing though is that the State of Israel subjugates the Palestinians, many of who are Christians and who may have more direct lineage to Abraham then do the Ashkenazis.

This is an interesting article about those living in Israel today.
The Status of Arabs in Israel

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

What is an "Ashkenazi Jew" and how pure is the blood line compared with Moses or Abraham?

Ashkenazim are diaspora Jews that left Israel and lived in the Roman Empire and then moved into European nations. Persecution forced them eastward. Other Jewish populations include the Sephardim (Jews from Spain) and Mizrahim (Jews living in Arabic nations). Ethiopian Jews too.

 

[mkgal1]

So then are we all gentile? Have all original branches of the olive tree been broken off and only the grafted remain or are added to it?

I hope not, because that would mean the whole foundation of our faith would also be broken off (including Jesus). I believe the faithful ancient Israelites are part of the Olive Tree...but I also believe ancient Judaism ended in 70 AD.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Christ himself is mixed blood, such as Ruth and Rehab and perhaps that alone is a large enough deviation. Certainly spiritual speaking the point seems to be the slightest amount has effect on the whole and can't be separated. But not being quite that strict and still considering the disciples to all be natural branches of Rom 11 how much mix blood must take place to no longer be what was 2000 years ago? Or does it matter? Are natural branches more about cultural and religious distinctions than genetic?

There have always been gentile converts to Judaism

 

[Swan7]

there has been a number of Jewish diasporas over the centuries, most notable the destruction of the temple in 70 AD and subsequent exile. A lot of time has passed and since then Hebrew has become a dead language since the 2nd century (now revived only a little over 100 years ago). Over this wide spread of people to distant lands, time and loss of identity is there really any such thing as a Jew today? or are we all Gentile?

Isaiah 49:1
Revelation 7

Yes, but they are scattered all over this earth. God knows exactly where His remnant will be and will seal them when the time comes.

 

[Josheb]

there has been a number of Jewish diasporas over the centuries, most notable the destruction of the temple in 70 AD and subsequent exile. A lot of time has passed and since then Hebrew has become a dead language since the 2nd century (now revived only a little over 100 years ago). Over this wide spread of people to distant lands, time and loss of identity is there really any such thing as a Jew today? or are we all Gentile?

Great question.

I liken it to the question about whether or not Israel actually exists or not because the geo-political nation-state currently known as Israel bears little to no resemblance to the Israel of the OT.

It's intriguing that I read this post today because earlier I was reading how 10 of the twelve Jewish tribes were lost in the Assyrian enslavement and by Jesus' time only two were known. That reading has prompted some curiosity in me because I've never heard such a thing before and the author did not provide much detail.

 

[robycop3]

Do Jews still exist ? OF COURSE they do !

 

[mkgal1]

There have always been gentile converts to Judaism

Agreed. It was a part of the old covenant to provide inclusion for everyone:

Genesis 17:12 ~ Generation after generation, every male must be circumcised when he is eight days old, including those born in your household and those purchased from a foreigner—even those who are not your offspring


Isaiah 56 ~

Salvation for Foreigners

This is what the LORD says:

“Maintain justice and do what is right,

for My salvation is coming soon,

and My righteousness will be revealed.

Blessed is the man who does this,

and the son of man who holds it fast,

who keeps the Sabbath without profaning it,

and keeps his hand from doing any evil.”

Let no foreigner who has joined himself to the LORD say,

“The LORD will utterly exclude me from His people.”

And let the eunuch not say,

“I am but a dry tree.”

For this is what the LORD says:

“To the eunuchs who keep My Sabbaths,

who choose what pleases Me

and hold fast to My covenant—

I will give them, in My house and within My walls,

a memorial and a name

better than that of sons and daughters.

I will give them an everlasting name

that will not be cut off.

And the foreigners who join themselves to the LORD

 

[redleghunter]

Where do you get this stuff from?? Where is your proof of this?

It’s the stuff the History channel and liberal theology spouts out to the public.

 

[lsume]

there has been a number of Jewish diasporas over the centuries, most notable the destruction of the temple in 70 AD and subsequent exile. A lot of time has passed and since then Hebrew has become a dead language since the 2nd century (now revived only a little over 100 years ago). Over this wide spread of people to distant lands, time and loss of identity is there really any such thing as a Jew today? or are we all Gentile?

When Christ foretold the destruction of the temple, the Spiritual message he was giving was that every stone in your temple must be placed by God The Father with Christ as the cornerstone. Every stone not placed by God The Father is coming down.