Do I deserve reparations from the Catholic Church or Ireland?

[98cwitr]

With all this CRT talk I got to thinking, based on the logic behind the rhetoric. In October of 1641, my Ulster Scot ancestors were nearly all wiped out by Irish Catholics coming to take (what they considered) their ancestral lands back from the English and Scottish Protestant "invaders" who had started to immigrate into Ulster back in the late 1590s. Considering the whole sale slaughter of men, women, and children, do their past sins owe me something today?

More on the topic for those interested:

The Rebellion of 1641

The Irish Rebellion Of 1641 - History of Ireland

The Irish rebellion of 1641, with a history of the events which led up to and succeeded it : Hamilton, Ernest, Lord, 1858-1939 : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

 

[TLK Valentine]

With all this CRT talk I got to thinking, based on the logic behind the rhetoric. In October of 1641, my Ulster Scot ancestors were nearly all wiped out by Irish Catholics coming to take (what they considered) their ancestral lands back from the English and Scottish Protestant "invaders" who had started to immigrate into Ulster back in the late 1590s. Considering the whole sale slaughter of men, women, and children, do their past sins owe me something today?

More on the topic for those interested:

The Rebellion of 1641

The Irish Rebellion Of 1641 - History of Ireland

The Irish rebellion of 1641, with a history of the events which led up to and succeeded it : Hamilton, Ernest, Lord, 1858-1939 : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

Ain't nothing preventing you from asking. Let us know how it goes.

 

[Pavel Mosko]

I hate all the Reparations talk. No amount of money is going to heal this sort of thing especially when the most aggrieved people died centuries or decades ago. It is just chiseling for freebies for folks that probably have already received lots of stuff from the Government, not to mention it rewards irrational thinking as far as expecting that Life, the World is etc. is fair.

13 Irrational Beliefs (Albert Ellis) - Mindfulness Courses Ireland - Padraig O'Morain

 

[98cwitr]

Ain't nothing preventing you from asking. Let us know how it goes.

Most of my inquiry has been dismissed because of the color of my skin. What say you?

 

[A_JAY]

.

 

[hislegacy]

With all this CRT talk I got to thinking, based on the logic behind the rhetoric. In October of 1641, my Ulster Scot ancestors were nearly all wiped out by Irish Catholics coming to take (what they considered) their ancestral lands back from the English and Scottish Protestant "invaders" who had started to immigrate into Ulster back in the late 1590s. Considering the whole sale slaughter of men, women, and children, do their past sins owe me something today?

More on the topic for those interested:

The Rebellion of 1641

The Irish Rebellion Of 1641 - History of Ireland

The Irish rebellion of 1641, with a history of the events which led up to and succeeded it : Hamilton, Ernest, Lord, 1858-1939 : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

They were white - so it had to be a racist action.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Most of my inquiry has been dismissed because of the color of my skin.

Not in this thread, it hasn't.

What say you?

I already said it. You have the right to demand reparations from the Catholic Church. Let us know how it goes.

 

[durangodawood]

With all this CRT talk I got to thinking, based on the logic behind the rhetoric. In October of 1641, my Ulster Scot ancestors were nearly all wiped out by Irish Catholics coming to take (what they considered) their ancestral lands back from the English and Scottish Protestant "invaders" who had started to immigrate into Ulster back in the late 1590s. Considering the whole sale slaughter of men, women, and children, do their past sins owe me something today?

More on the topic for those interested:

The Rebellion of 1641

The Irish Rebellion Of 1641 - History of Ireland

The Irish rebellion of 1641, with a history of the events which led up to and succeeded it : Hamilton, Ernest, Lord, 1858-1939 : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

Is there some deficit imposed upon you from that event that you are suffering from?

 

[98cwitr]

Is there some deficit imposed upon you from that event that you are suffering from?

I could make a case that Ulster Scot descendants are still discriminated against by the Catholic Church based on the Church's dominance in current political decisions and policy, but it would require my deep cultural convictions of individualism to take a back seat, I'd also have to make some gross assumptive claims regarding whole groups of people based on ethnic and religious labels in order to do so. I would also have to discount any opposition to individual claims to the contrary, and only continue asserting that my group identity as an Scottish American is somehow discriminated against. Still, my family was slaughtered by Irish Catholics in 1641, doesn't that stand on it's own merit to claim reparations as we, as a distinct ethnic group, never received them for the injustice of it all?

 

[durangodawood]

I could make a case that Ulster Scot descendants are still discriminated against by the Catholic Church based on the Church's dominance in current political decisions and policy, but it would require my deep cultural convictions of individualism to take a back seat, I'd also have to make some gross assumptive claims regarding whole groups of people based on ethnic and religious labels in order to do so. I would also have to discount any opposition to individual claims to the contrary, and only continue asserting that my group identity as an Scottish American is somehow discriminated against. Still, my family was slaughtered by Irish Catholics in 1641, doesn't that stand on it's own merit to claim reparations as we, as a distinct ethnic group, never received them for the injustice of it all?

I'm not seeing the deficit there that you personally or even your Scottish - American group generally is suffering under.

As for the specific murder, I'm not sure theres a regime for civil claims going back that far. Criminally, the murderers are all dead, and so is any case

 

[98cwitr]

I'm not seeing the deficit there that you personally or even your Scottish - American group generally is suffering under.

As for the specific murder, I'm not sure theres a regime for civil claims going back that far. Criminally, the murderers are all dead, and so is any case

Right, in this case, the reparations would be paid by their descendants (anyone connected to the O'Neill family who organized and lead the rebellion), or the Catholic Church as a whole, or Ireland as the governing body? Who's responsible?

 

[Tiberius Lee]

I hate all the Reparations talk. No amount of money is going to heal this sort of thing especially when the most aggrieved people died centuries or decades ago. It is just chiseling for freebies for folks that probably have already received lots of stuff from the Government, not to mention it rewards irrational thinking as far as expecting that Life, the World is etc. is fair.

13 Irrational Beliefs (Albert Ellis) - Mindfulness Courses Ireland - Padraig O'Morain

You are right, no amount of money will heal the wound of slavery as long we have people like you who thinks like this ;

"It is just chiseling for freebies for folks that probably have already received lots of stuff from the Government"

 

[durangodawood]

Right, in this case, the reparations would be paid by their descendants (anyone connected to the O'Neill family who organized and lead the rebellion), or the Catholic Church as a whole, or Ireland as the governing body? Who's responsible?

I think countries and other durable institutions should be considered persons for these purposes. We do the exact same with corporations. If culpability can demonstrated, then there's your responsible party.

But responsible for what harm to you or your Scottish American group? You havent shown any. So I'm not seeing a case here.

 

[Pavel Mosko]

You are right, no amount of money will heal the wound of slavery as long we have people like you who thinks like this ;

"It is just chiseling for freebies for folks that probably have already received lots of stuff from the Government"

It's not just me.

 

[Pommer]

It's not just me.

View attachment 301273

“He’s [been] dead Jim”, for onwards of 106 years, yet still we’re here debating if blacks are equal enough.

 

[Tiberius Lee]

It's not just me.

View attachment 301273

Just because an African American agrees with you doesn’t make it right!

 

[Pavel Mosko]

Just because an African American agrees with you doesn’t make it right!

lol maybe you should read "Up From Slavery" sometime.... I did in the 5th grade. It was very educational. If you disregard Booker T. then their aint any hope for you so I'm putting you on ignore. Goodbye and have a nice life.

 

[SarahsKnight]

You are right, no amount of money will heal the wound of slavery as long we have people like you who thinks like this ;

"It is just chiseling for freebies for folks that probably have already received lots of stuff from the Government"

You've said it well, there, friend.

 

[SarahsKnight]

lol maybe you should read "Up From Slavery" sometime.... I did in the 5th grade. It was very educational. If you disregard Booker T. then their aint any hope for you so I'm putting you on ignore. Goodbye and have a nice life.

I also like how so many folks here feel the need to announce it aloud when they're putting someone on ignore, like it's a real "I sure showed you" moment. =/

 

[RDKirk]

lol maybe you should read "Up From Slavery" sometime.... I did in the 5th grade. It was very educational. If you disregard Booker T. then their aint any hope for you so I'm putting you on ignore. Goodbye and have a nice life.

I did read it. It was required reading for all of us at Booker T Washington Elementary.

While it was interesting for the time that it was written (and it was controversial among black people even at the time it was written), it's doubtful that Washington himself (who died in 1915) would have been satisfied with the status of black people under Jim Crow laws continuing until even I was in school.