Do Baptist believe they can hear God today immediately, or only through scripture?

[LoveofTruth]

The apokalupsis (revelation) as a gift of the Spirit is not some new understanding of Scripture. Scripture means the same always (although more precise interpretations can be discovered), but the 'revelation' as a gift of the Spirit is a driving force behind the gift of prophecy..

Many things you commented here are interesting and i tend to agree with some of it about revelation in your entire post.

But yes believers can have a new understanding of scripture , or to put it properly they can have the right understanding of scripture. All false doctrine comes from men who did not hear clearly or at all the Spirits guidance of truth either in their hearts or scripture. For example the catholic church had wrong understandings of scripture and God revealed certain truths from scripture that were apparently new, but in fact they were always there and only seen in a revelation or wisdom of understanding by God in some measure.


Revelation and prophecy can also be confirmed, in the act doing such a revelation or prophecy itself, by scripture. For scripture says all can prophesy and have revelations etc.But sometimes a word pf prophecy or revelation may be towards an individual or situation, and it may seem more vague.

For example, I met a man one time as I was ministering downtown, he came up to me and was slightly intoxicated and wanted money . I told him about Jesus and warned him about drunkeness, then I said words that just came to me i said "if you keep going the way your going your going to walk across the road get hit by a car and break your leg". He scoffed at me and went way. I did not plan to say that to him but it came out when I opened my mouth. About a week later or so i was in a different pat of the city up further about 15 minutes from where i saw that man, and i was with another brother in Christ ministering and as we saw this man walk towards us he had a broken leg and crutches. When he saw me he looked shocked and pale, he approached and I asked him what happened, he said "I walked across the road got hit by a car and broke my leg" I said to him, "do you remember what I said to you before"
He said "yes and was terrified". I shared more of the gospel with him and we went and bought him some food.

That situation happened of real and it was not a specific even you could point to in scripture. But scripture can be used to confirm that such things are possible among the saints.

And scripture is the same and the text shouldn't change. But the way we rightly divide scripture is wonders in the Spirit. God can connect many verses in a way that truths are revealed that would often be hidden to the wise and prudent in this world and he reveals them unto babes and to those who walk in the Spirit. I have often read scriptures over and over and after many years seen a new revelation in the text that was right there in front of me. Sometimes even a verse that i had read for years becomes new. It connects with other verses and a new understanding is shown.

There are many example of this.

We know that when jesus walked along the road with the two men after his resurrection he opened their understanding that they might understand the scriptures. This opening of our understanding can come in the spirit and we can see rightly. But if men are not hearing Gods voice or have Christ in them to open their understanding and reveal all things in the Spirit to them, then they can only know what they know naturally as brute beast and they are like clouds without rain tossed to and fro, and they do the same to those who listen to them.

 

[OzSpen]

But yes believers can have a new understanding of scripture , or to put it properly they can have the right understanding of scripture. All false doctrine comes from men who did not hear clearly or at all the Spirits guidance of truth either in their hearts or scripture.

LoT,

Do you read, understand and are able to translate OT Hebrew & Aramaic and NT Greek?

Many errors of interpretation have come about through inadequate or incorrect understanding of the original languages. Not 'all false doctrine' comes from people 'who did not hear clearly or at all the Spirit's guidance of truth'.

If you and I do not understand fundamentals of hermeneutics (interpretation of Scripture), we can make mistakes in doctrine.

I think you are too focussed on the Spirit's guidance for interpretation when it should be the Spirit + knowledge of the original languages + knowledge of hermeneutics.

Oz

 

[LoveofTruth]

Do you read, understand and are able to translate OT Hebrew & Aramaic and NT Greek?

God overshadowed the writing of the Old Testament as he did the New Testament and he was the one I believe who guided the scriptures to be right for man.

"...not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power: 5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God. 6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought: 7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:" ( 1 Cor. 2:4-7 KJV)

Yes, a person should be able to read scripture if they want to study it. But this is not how any know the scriptures. The Spirit guides into all truth, ( not just some truth about spiritual matters, but all) the anointing teaches us all things, ( not just some but all). 1 John 2;27.

While it might be helpful to know the meanings of words as in Greek and Hebrew. Do not change the text just get the sense of the word meaning.

The pharisees knew the language and meaning of words and yet they missed the Lord right in front of them. They also rebuked the apostles and said they were unlearned and ignorant, and they would have looked down on the apostles thinking they themselves were so so wise in their own eyes. Jesus said he thanked God that he revealed thing to the babes and hid them from the wise and prudent.

man by wisdom knew not God.

And yes, when men try to tamper with the King James Bible that God gave to men, they will have errors. But thats a 45 hour talk, maybe for another post.

Many errors of interpretation have come about through inadequate or incorrect understanding of the original languages. Not 'all false doctrine' comes from people 'who did not hear clearly or at all the Spirit's guidance of truth'.

Yes, all those who tampered with scripture can be in error. But all truth is known in the spirit and the Spirt will guide us into all truth. And all true doctrine comes in the spirit in Christ as we are led by him, all false doctrine comes by men who did not follow the Spirit. That should be obvious.

always remember these verses,

"...the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God....14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned." ( 1 Cor 2:11,14 KJV)

Take for example, some groups that have tampered with scripture and added words and changed meaning according to their false doctrines they have not followed the Spirit of God n doing so. Just by adding the article "a" they have made another God by saying "the Word was a god" (NWT). This is not the truth of scripture.

If you and I do not understand fundamentals of hermeneutics (interpretation of Scripture), we can make mistakes in doctrine.

The Spirit of God teaches all believers all things. He gives understanding to the faithful and guides them in how to understand the scriptures and the meanings. Christ is the head of the church working in the body and as they all work together he guides and gifts each one with gifts and understandings (Ephesians 4:15,16 KJV).

Men can also be tossed about by ever wind of doctrine by men who are out of the Spirits guidance and who claim to know natural learning and exalt themselves over the faithful spirit led believer as if they are ignorant and don't understand the Hebrew and Greek.I have found many times the simple text gives clues to the meaning in the spirit.if you see the things God is showing many things are hidden in the text that even if you know the meaning of the words you won't understand it.

For example jesus talks of the sower sowing the seed. How hard is it to know what a sower is or a seed. Even knowing the language in its original doesn't change the meaning of a sower and a seed and weeds and good ground etc. But the spiritual meanings are not as clearly seen. In fact the natural man cannot even know them. Yes he can puppet another mans words, but the reality of that truth he does not know.

How many people have simply quoted other men of the past as if they understood the truths they spoke and quoted them and talked of the Greek says this and that, as if that give the revelation of the truth. While I said it is helpful to know how to read and the general meanings of words, the truth is not seen by man's wisdom and natural learning.

Even to Know that jesus Christ is the Son of God is a revelation of the Father, flesh and blood cannot reveal that to a person. It is a revelation of Jesus Christ and the spiritual reality is the starting point. Jesus must open our understanding to understand the scriptures.

I think you are too focussed on the Spirit's guidance for interpretation when it should be the Spirit + knowledge of the original languages + knowledge of hermeneutics.

Oz

The Spirit will lead me into whatever I need to understand a scripture. If I should find out the meanings of certain words he will guide me into that. But all truth is known ONLY by the Spirit as many scriptures show.

"11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. 13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned." ( 1 Cor 2:11-14 KJV)

"20 But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things....27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him. ( 1 John 2:20..27 KJV)

John 16:13 KJV
"..Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth:"

Jude 1:10 KJV
"But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.

1 Corinthians 1:21 KJV
"For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe."

Proverbs 1:7 KJV
"The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction."

Proverbs 2:6 KJV
For the Lord giveth wisdom: out of his mouth cometh knowledge and understanding."

Luke 11:52 KJV
Woe unto you, lawyers! for ye have taken away the key of knowledge: ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye hindered."

Acts 4:13 KJV
Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marvelled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus."

-------

Romans 2:20 KJV
"An instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, which hast the form of knowledge and of the truth in the law.

--------

Romans 11:33 KJV
"O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!"

Romans 15:14 KJV
"And I myself also am persuaded of you, my brethren, that ye also are full of goodness, filled with all knowledge, able also to admonish one another."

1 Corinthians 1:5 KJV
"That in every thing ye are enriched by him, in all utterance, and in all knowledge;"

1 Corinthians 12:8 KJV
"For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;"

2 Corinthians 4:6 KJV
"For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ."

Ephesians 1:17 KJV
"That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:"

Ephesians 3:19 KJV
"And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God."

2 Peter 1:3 KJV
"According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:"


But some are,

2 Timothy 3:7 KJV
"Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth."

Romans 1:22 KJV
"Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,"

John 5:16,38,39 KJV
"16 And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day....38 And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not. 39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

Matthew 22:23,29 KJV

"23 The same day came to him the Sadducees,...29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God."

 

[OzSpen]

God overshadowed the writing of the Old Testament as he did the New Testament and he was the one I believe who guided the scriptures to be right for man.

"...not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power: 5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God. 6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought: 7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:" ( 1 Cor. 2:4-7 KJV)

Yes, a person should be able to read scripture if they want to study it. But this is not how any know the scriptures. The Spirit guides into all truth, ( not just some truth about spiritual matters, but all) the anointing teaches us all things, ( not just some but all). 1 John 2;27.

While it might be helpful to know the meanings of words as in Greek and Hebrew. Do not change the text just get the sense of the word meaning.

The pharisees knew the language and meaning of words and yet they missed the Lord right in front of them. They also rebuked the apostles and said they were unlearned and ignorant, and they would have looked down on the apostles thinking they themselves were so so wise in their own eyes. Jesus said he thanked God that he revealed thing to the babes and hid them from the wise and prudent.

man by wisdom knew not God.

And yes, when men try to tamper with the King James Bible that God gave to men, they will have errors. But thats a 45 hour talk, maybe for another post.



Yes, all those who tampered with scripture can be in error. But all truth is known in the spirit and the Spirt will guide us into all truth. And all true doctrine comes in the spirit in Christ as we are led by him, all false doctrine comes by men who did not follow the Spirit. That should be obvious.

always remember these verses,

"...the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God....14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned." ( 1 Cor 2:11,14 KJV)

Take for example, some groups that have tampered with scripture and added words and changed meaning according to their false doctrines they have not followed the Spirit of God n doing so. Just by adding the article "a" they have made another God by saying "the Word was a god" (NWT). This is not the truth of scripture.



The Spirit of God teaches all believers all things. He gives understanding to the faithful and guides them in how to understand the scriptures and the meanings. Christ is the head of the church working in the body and as they all work together he guides and gifts each one with gifts and understandings (Ephesians 4:15,16 KJV).

Men can also be tossed about by ever wind of doctrine by men who are out of the Spirits guidance and who claim to know natural learning and exalt themselves over the faithful spirit led believer as if they are ignorant and don't understand the Hebrew and Greek.I have found many times the simple text gives clues to the meaning in the spirit.if you see the things God is showing many things are hidden in the text that even if you know the meaning of the words you won't understand it.

For example jesus talks of the sower sowing the seed. How hard is it to know what a sower is or a seed. Even knowing the language in its original doesn't change the meaning of a sower and a seed and weeds and good ground etc. But the spiritual meanings are not as clearly seen. In fact the natural man cannot even know them. Yes he can puppet another mans words, but the reality of that truth he does not know.

How many people have simply quoted other men of the past as if they understood the truths they spoke and quoted them and talked of the Greek says this and that, as if that give the revelation of the truth. While I said it is helpful to know how to read and the general meanings of words, the truth is not seen by man's wisdom and natural learning.

Even to Know that jesus Christ is the Son of God is a revelation of the Father, flesh and blood cannot reveal that to a person. It is a revelation of Jesus Christ and the spiritual reality is the starting point. Jesus must open our understanding to understand the scriptures.



The Spirit will lead me into whatever I need to understand a scripture. If I should find out the meanings of certain words he will guide me into that. But all truth is known ONLY by the Spirit as many scriptures show.

"11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. 13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned." ( 1 Cor 2:11-14 KJV)

"20 But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things....27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him. ( 1 John 2:20..27 KJV)

John 16:13 KJV
"..Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth:"

Jude 1:10 KJV
"But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.

1 Corinthians 1:21 KJV
"For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe."

Proverbs 1:7 KJV
"The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction."

Proverbs 2:6 KJV
For the Lord giveth wisdom: out of his mouth cometh knowledge and understanding."

Luke 11:52 KJV
Woe unto you, lawyers! for ye have taken away the key of knowledge: ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye hindered."

Acts 4:13 KJV
Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marvelled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus."

-------

Romans 2:20 KJV
"An instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, which hast the form of knowledge and of the truth in the law.

--------

Romans 11:33 KJV
"O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!"

Romans 15:14 KJV
"And I myself also am persuaded of you, my brethren, that ye also are full of goodness, filled with all knowledge, able also to admonish one another."

1 Corinthians 1:5 KJV
"That in every thing ye are enriched by him, in all utterance, and in all knowledge;"

1 Corinthians 12:8 KJV
"For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;"

2 Corinthians 4:6 KJV
"For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ."

Ephesians 1:17 KJV
"That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:"

Ephesians 3:19 KJV
"And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God."

2 Peter 1:3 KJV
"According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:"


But some are,

2 Timothy 3:7 KJV
"Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth."

Romans 1:22 KJV
"Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,"

John 5:16,38,39 KJV
"16 And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day....38 And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not. 39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

Matthew 22:23,29 KJV

"23 The same day came to him the Sadducees,...29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God."

LoT,

You have a bad habit of replying with red herring logical fallacies. Do you know what a red herring fallacy is? See the Nizkor Project for a description of a red herring fallacy.

When you use a red herring fallacy, you divert attention to what you want to talk about and not what the other person discusses. That's what you have done here in your response to my post.

Oz

 

[LoveofTruth]

LoT,

You have a bad habit of replying with red herring logical fallacies. Do you know what a red herring fallacy is? See the Nizkor Project for a description of a red herring fallacy.

When you use a red herring fallacy, you divert attention to what you want to talk about and not what the other person discusses. That's what you have done here in your response to my post.

Oz

No no fallacy here, each verse relates to things you said. There will be some need of spiritual discernment to understand what they mean as i used each one towards your arguments.

Some things might not be as easy to understand , But peter said that Paul also spoke some things hard to be understood. But i was directly speaking to your words.

 

[OzSpen]

No no fallacy here, each verse relates to things you said. There will be some need of spiritual discernment to understand what they mean as i used each one towards your arguments.

Some things might not be as easy to understand , But peter said that Paul also spoke some things hard to be understood. But i was directly speaking to your words.

LoT,

So are you telling me that you are the super spiritual one with true discernment and I'm the spiritual dumbo?

Have you noticed in this short thread the number of people who do not reply to you? If you continue to reply to me like you have done here, I'll be joining them.

Oz

 

[LoveofTruth]

LoT,

So are you telling me that you are the super spiritual one with true discernment and I'm the spiritual dumbo?

Have you noticed in this short thread the number of people who do not reply to you? If you continue to reply to me like you have done here, I'll be joining them.

Oz

I would never use the word "super spiritual" or dumbo

And some might not reply because there is not a disagreement or else some things may have to be thought over

I not saying I am any better than another I just saying that spiritual things are different thsn natural things to see

Paul said he wanted to talk spiritual things to some or as spiritual but they were not able in some cases

Some might have not got along with Paul as well for such things . . in fact some thought Paul didn't love them, that he was not an apostle , that he walked according to the flesh, that he was thier enemy when he spoke the truth. All forsook him in Asia etc. These type of misunderstandings are common it seems. These things seem more so in this confusing climate if many different church gatherings with all sorts of different doctrines

But God bless

 

[LoveofTruth]

LoT,

Have you noticed in this short thread the number of people who do not reply to you? If you continue to reply to me like you have done here, I'll be joining them.

Oz

It takes great humility to receive correction. I love correction and I look for it eagerly. But if you are in error let humility and patience be strengths. Pride destroys many relationships and from learning anything

I have met many many many many many of those who trust in their natural learning more than spiritual for almost 30 years. They will give lips service to spiritual understanding but in reality many trust in natural learning as if none can understand God but through their learning of languages and study.

Some today don't believe that Jesus Christ is actually in every believer. Quite a few actually. But that is a great error. Some don't believe that the anointing teaches us all things either ( 1 John 2;27 KJV)

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[OzSpen]

It takes great humility to receive correction. I love correction and I look for it eagerly. But if you are in error let humility and patience be strengths. Pride destroys many relationships and from learning anything

I have met many many many many many of those who trust in their natural learning more than spiritual for almost 30 years. They will give lips service to spiritual understanding but in reality many trust in natural learning as if none can understand God but through their learning of languages and study.

Some today don't believe that Jesus Christ is actually in every believer. Quite a few actually. But that is a great error. Some don't believe that the anointing teaches us all things either ( 1 John 2;27 KJV)

LoT,

That's a red herring fallacy, which means that you didn't answer what I wrote and changed the topic to what you wanted to say.

Oz

 

[LoveofTruth]

LoT,

That's a red herring fallacy, which means didn't answer what I wrote and changed the topic to what you wanted to say.

Oz

no, you just did that by avoiding my comments. I answer your words directly, your accusation is not true. And to make further comments about what is said that can go into other areas is not a red herring fallacy they are all in context and related to your comments.

You seem to be avoiding things by changing the topic and going off into a unrelated area.

By the way when the Pharisees came to Jesus and asked him "by what authority do you do these things. He changed the topic and asked them by what authority does John baptism? what would you call that kind of change of topic and redirection of his question to them when he was asked a question?

anyway back to the topic.

Some trust in human understanding of scripture more than spiritual understanding where Jesus opened the understanding to know the scriptures. Yes some will give lip service to the scriptures and the Spirit. But generally i have found that the spiritual anointing of God to teach them ALL things is put aside for natural learning and study. Some, (many in fact) even call themselves Masters of Divinity", even though Jesus said call no an "master:, for one is their Master, Jesus Christ. The word "Master" means , "a guide". But Jesus said the Holy Spirit would guide believers into ALL truth.

 

[Episaw]

Hello all and God bless,

It has come to my attention over the years that many seem to say they have never heard God at any time and that they cannot hear God speak today. They say God only speaks through the scriptures.

Is this the case with Baptist?

Do you believe you can hear God speak today apart from the scriptures? Though we know that God speaks through scripture as we are given understanding of them by Jesus. The Holy scriptures are vital and they were given by the inspiration of God. But no man can know the scriptures unless they are taught by God through the Spirit.

Having been involved with the Baptist Church in many forms for several years, I would say that generally, they do not believe God speaks to you outside of scripture.

My experience has been quite to the contrary as God has anointed me with a prophetic teaching ministry and much of that comes from waiting on God and listening to him to get direction direct from the Holy Spirit.

It is as plain as day that the nine gifts of the Holy Spirit are alive and well today and most of them happen because of some direction direct from the Holy Spirit.

What that means is that if you restrict yourself to scripture for guidance, you are cutting yourself off from a large chunk of Christain experience.

And please bear in mind that the New Testament Church was not led by the scriptures as the New Testament did not exist. They relied on the apostles teaching which would have come from the Old Testament as they were all Jews. And you note on the day of Pentecost, Peter expounded the Old Testament scriptures and related it to Jesus death. There was nothing of the New Testament in his sermon.

 

[Goodbook]

Hey, OP
There are many baptist churches some are cessationist and some arent.
It depends where you go.
As far as I know, the one I go to people generally believe God speaks to them, as confirmed in scripture. Still small voice often, sometimes audibly. He spoke to me, I heard Him, and He still speaks to me today, when Im quiet and still to hear Him.

We dont despise prophecy...if its in line with His word, its prophetic. There are some churches that have really gone of track with this i wont name them but they have got themselves into a pickle because of what amounts to witchcraft and clairvoyancy which many disguise as prophetic.

My sheep hear my voice, another they wont follow.

 

[Goodbook]

Having been involved with the Baptist Church in many forms for several years, I would say that generally, they do not believe God speaks to you outside of scripture.

My experience has been quite to the contrary as God has anointed me with a prophetic teaching ministry and much of that comes from waiting on God and listening to him to get direction direct from the Holy Spirit.

It is as plain as day that the nine gifts of the Holy Spirit are alive and well today and most of them happen because of some direction direct from the Holy Spirit.

What that means is that if you restrict yourself to scripture for guidance, you are cutting yourself off from a large chunk of Christain experience.

And please bear in mind that the New Testament Church was not led by the scriptures as the New Testament did not exist. They relied on the apostles teaching which would have come from the Old Testament as they were all Jews. And you note on the day of Pentecost, Peter expounded the Old Testament scriptures and related it to Jesus death. There was nothing of the New Testament in his sermon.

Hmm you kind of contradicted yourself there because Old Testament IS scripture.
Its still holy spirit inspired. Timothy became a minsiter because he knew scripture from a young age, was taught scripture. He said all scripture is Gods word not just the new testament...these were letters written by Paul mostly and they became scripture and there are so many references to the old testment in it that its wrong to say scripture is not important. It is essential.

Jesus himself said not one jot or tittle will be changed. We need BOTH. To hear his word, which is written down for us and to know his spirit.

 

[Episaw]

Hmm you kind of contradicted yourself there because Old Testament IS scripture. Its still holy spirit inspired..

Which is what I said.

 

[Goodbook]

Ok your post was abit confusing thats all. You wrote the new testament church was not led by scriptures as the new testament did not exist. Uh..makes no sense. It did exist, Paul wrote those letters and sent them to the early church they had them and copied them out for everyone to read! Of course they existed!!! The whole point of them was to guide the early church at that time, who were made up of phillipians, colossians, cornthians, ephesians, thessalonians, galatians etc. they were read out IN THOSE CHURCHES.

 

[Goodbook]

They were Gods word to those churches because God had appointed Paul as an apostle to the gentiles, an dhe inspired Paul to write most of them, as He also inspired John for .revelation. Thats why they were in greek the most gentiles language at the time not hebrew. And even the hebrews were speaking greek then.

Just because they werent all collected together in one until later doesnt mean the early church had nothing to go on. There were 4 gospels and they spread as soon as they could everywhere. Jesus words mark, luke, matthew and john repeated and wrote down all they could remember. PLUS they had already all the prophecies from the old testament that were thousands of years old.

 

[Episaw]

Ok your post was abit confusing thats all. You wrote the new testament church was not led by scriptures as the new testament did not exist. Uh..makes no sense. It did exist, Paul wrote those letters and sent them to the early church they had them and copied them out for everyone to read! Of course they existed!!! The whole point of them was to guide the early church at that time, who were made up of phillipians, colossians, cornthians, ephesians, thessalonians, galatians etc. they were read out IN THOSE CHURCHES.

No it didn't. For about two decades after the Cross, the message of Jesus was proclaimed orally. Then from the early 50s on, Paul’s letters began to appear. During the 60s, the three synoptic Gospels and the Book of Acts were written, and by the end of the first century, when John wrote the Book of Revelation, all the books of the New Testament were completed.

In the formation of the New Testament canon, which took place over a period of about 250 years, apostolic authorship became the primary criterion for acceptance of individual books into the canon

At the end of the first century, all the books of the New Testament were in existence as the possession of particular churches or individuals to whom they were addressed. Sometime after Paul’s death, a collection of his letters bearing the title The Apostle began to circulate among the churches. Soon after the fourth Gospel was completed, the four Gospels were brought together in another collection called The Gospels. Thus, during the second century, most churches came to possess and acknowledge a collection of inspired books that included the four Gospels, the Book of Acts, 13 of Paul’s letters, 1 Peter, and 1 John.

During the latter half of the fourth century, the New Testament canon received its full and final form. Athanasius, the bishop of Alexandria, in 367, to eliminate the use of certain apocryphal books in church, listed in his Easter Letter the 27 books of the New Testament.

Thirty years later, the Third Council of Carthage (397 A.D.) accepted the list of the 27 books as canonical and decreed that “nothing should be read in church under the name of the divine scriptures except the canonical writings.” With this Third Council of Carthage, the canon assumed permanently the form and content as it exists to this day.

What this means is that the Church in Acts did not have the Canon of the New Testament to draw on. The oral reporting of what Jesus said was its main source of inspiration that is why the 12 disciples were so important to the early church.