Disturbing: Pennsylvania officials testify to 100,000 non-citizens registered and voting in state

NightHawkeye

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From the "Other shoe drops", files: 100,000 noncitizens registered to vote in Pennsylvania

More than 100,000 noncitizens are registered to vote in Pennsylvania alone, according to testimony submitted Monday in a lawsuit demanding the state come clean about the extent of its problems.

The Public Interest Legal Foundation, which has identified similar noncitizen voting problems in studies of Virginia and New Jersey, said Pennsylvania officials have admitted noncitizens have been registering and voting in the state “for decades.”
 

paul1149

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If true, this is an assault on representative government. And the leadership of one of the Parties is fully supportive of it.

There were reports of up to 2 million illegal votes in the last election, reports that were, of course, roundly denigrated in the media. But if the above report is true (and apparently it doesn't touch other kinds of voter fraud, just illegals), it would support those kinds of numbers.
 
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grasping the after wind

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I wonder how many illegals are voting in sanctuary cities and sanctuary states. Seems logical to suspect that if such cities and states are willing to shelter illegals from the law they would also be willing or perhaps even eager to let them vote.
 
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iluvatar5150

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There were reports of up to 2 million illegal votes in the last election, reports that were, of course, roundly denigrated in the media.

That's because the reports were unfounded and essentially made up by people who profit from making you afraid. 2 million is about 1 out of every 64 votes cast in that election. When you stand in line at the polls, does it look to you like 1.5% of the voters are illegal?

But if the above report is true (and apparently it doesn't touch other kinds of voter fraud, just illegals), it would support those kinds of numbers.

No, it wouldn't. If you read the complaint, it says that of the records they analyzed, 79% of the non-citizens who were registered never voted at all, and another 12% only voted once.

https://publicinterestlegal.org/files/1-PA-Complaint.pdf
 
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grasping the after wind

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That's because the reports were unfounded and essentially made up by people who profit from making you afraid. 2 million is about 1 out of every 64 votes cast in that election. When you stand in line at the polls, does it look to you like 1.5% of the voters are illegal?

Are you proposing that illegals look somehow different than other people?
 
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NightHawkeye

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Ahh ... so now we're just arguing about the remaining 21,000 who do vote?

And being told they ought to be easy to spot because I guess the are all supposed to look alike and different from everyone who is a legal citizen.
 
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iluvatar5150

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Ahh ... so now we're just arguing about the remaining 21,000 who do vote?

Hey, if Republicans want to put in place a plan for purging voter rolls that's careful, meticulous, and even-handed, and if they want to make it harder for non-citizens to register (while not making it harder for citizens to register) I'll totally get on board. As such, I haven't seen that.

Note that ID requirements wouldn't have fixed the problems in this case, because at least 2/3 of the non-citizens registered while getting a drivers license or registering a vehicle.
 
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iluvatar5150

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And being told they ought to be easy to spot because I guess the are all supposed to look alike and different from everyone who is a legal citizen.

Yeah, I'm stereotyping, but when I stand in line and see a bunch of bearded hipsters and Patagonia-wearing soccer moms without a foreign accent audible among them, I feel safe assuming they're not here illegally.
 
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NightHawkeye

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Hey, if Republicans want to put in place a plan for purging voter rolls that's careful, meticulous, and even-handed, and if they want to make it harder for non-citizens to register (while not making it harder for citizens to register) I'll totally get on board. As such, I haven't seen that.
It's not complicated. A federal judge can order Pennsylvania to purge its voter rolls tomorrow.

One hopes that will be one of the outcomes of this current lawsuit.
Note that ID requirements wouldn't have fixed the problems in this case, because at least 2/3 of the non-citizens registered while getting a drivers license or registering a vehicle.
Yes, the system has been corrupted in a number of insidious ways. Voter ID solves but one of the problems.
 
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grasping the after wind

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Hey, if Republicans want to put in place a plan for purging voter rolls that's careful, meticulous, and even-handed, and if they want to make it harder for non-citizens to register (while not making it harder for citizens to register) I'll totally get on board. As such, I haven't seen that.

Note that ID requirements wouldn't have fixed the problems in this case, because at least 2/3 of the non-citizens registered while getting a drivers license or registering a vehicle.

And they were all able to get licenses despite that placing such an unreasonable burden on them. Why we insist on ID to drive a car, buy alcohol, travel in airliners, go to political conventions?
The poor and elderly are being discriminated against in driving a car and in air travel by these onerous laws.
 
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And they were all able to get licenses despite that placing such an unreasonable burden on them. Why we insist on ID to drive a car, buy alcohol, travel in airliners, go to political conventions?
The poor and elderly are being discriminated against in driving a car and in air travel by these onerous laws.

I don't know why you guys keep bringing up alcohol as a valid argument in this. I go lots of places that don't card me and I'm in my mid-30s.

Somebody poor enough that they have trouble getting an ID isn't going to have the money to fly on an airplane, and owning a car would be a challenge, too. In fact, the lack of a car is often one of the things that makes it difficult for these folks to get an ID. I live in Baltimore and there's one single DMV office in the entire city, and people start lining up HOURS before it opens. I have a car and a flexible job and it's a pain in the butt for me. When I lived in Boston, it wasn't much better (IIRC, they had two offices in the whole city).

But I'm sure you've had this all explained to you before, so I don't know why I'm bothering...
 
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cow451

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From the "Other shoe drops", files: 100,000 noncitizens registered to vote in Pennsylvania

More than 100,000 noncitizens are registered to vote in Pennsylvania alone, according to testimony submitted Monday in a lawsuit demanding the state come clean about the extent of its problems.

The Public Interest Legal Foundation, which has identified similar noncitizen voting problems in studies of Virginia and New Jersey, said Pennsylvania officials have admitted noncitizens have been registering and voting in the state “for decades.”
I know you’re all excited but this is just the filing of a lawsuit. It’s one side’s viewpoint. So, I’ll wait for the case to play out more.

President Trump won the Hispanic vote, the Black vote, the Eastern European vote, the Soviet bloc vote (Putin wasn’t on the ballot), the popular vote and the Electoral vote and had the biggest Inaugural crowd in American history. That’s why he disbanded the commission on election stuff. Everybody loves him and votes for him any way.
 
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NightHawkeye

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President Trump won the Hispanic vote, the Black vote, the Eastern European vote, the Soviet bloc vote (Putin wasn’t on the ballot), the popular vote and the Electoral vote and had the biggest Inaugural crowd in American history. That’s why he disbanded the commission on election stuff. Everybody loves him and votes for him any way.
Yes, comrade, is exactly how elections happen in the motherland.
 
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whatbogsends

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If true, this is an assault on representative government. And the leadership of one of the Parties is fully supportive of it.

There were reports of up to 2 million illegal votes in the last election, reports that were, of course, roundly denigrated in the media. But if the above report is true (and apparently it doesn't touch other kinds of voter fraud, just illegals), it would support those kinds of numbers.

No, there were claims of up to 2 million illegal votes in the last election. I'm unaware of any "reports" which would support those claims.

While what they are reporting in PA is bad (100,000 registered illegals, where that number should be ZERO), even there at most 20% voted in the election, which would be 20,000. Absolutely not insignificant, but still a far cry from those claims (even if there were 20,000 in every state, which is a dubious claim, that would only be half of that 2 million).

We absolutely need to take measures to ensure that these types of situations don't happen, and if there was any criminal wrongdoing which made it happen (doesn't appear to be any in the PA case) it should be fully prosecuted.
 
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While what they are reporting in PA is bad (100,000 registered illegals

To be clear: the (alleged) 100k aren't illegal immigrants. They're legal immigrants who were improperly registered to vote.
 
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From the "Other shoe drops", files: 100,000 noncitizens registered to vote in Pennsylvania

More than 100,000 noncitizens are registered to vote in Pennsylvania alone, according to testimony submitted Monday in a lawsuit demanding the state come clean about the extent of its problems.

The Public Interest Legal Foundation, which has identified similar noncitizen voting problems in studies of Virginia and New Jersey, said Pennsylvania officials have admitted noncitizens have been registering and voting in the state “for decades.”

But Trump won Pennsylvania so you know what is going to be insinuated/said about that. :doh:
 
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whatbogsends

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To be clear: the (alleged) 100k aren't illegal immigrants. They're legal immigrants who were improperly registered to vote.

I apologize for any confusion. I was thinking "non-citizens" was referring to illegal immigrants, but you're correct - non-citizens means just that - non US Citizens. Still problematic, but maybe less of a hot button issue.
 
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