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Featured Discussion on Is Jesus Christ coming back?

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by mlepfitjw, Jan 1, 2021.

  1. mlepfitjw

    mlepfitjw May you be blessed!

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    What do you think about this discussion?


    [Christianity Anarchy Today Episode 93] Is Jesus Coming Back????? - Part 2

    Here is a description for you:

    This is a discussion about if Jesus Christ is coming back or not between three believers of God, and the Lord Jesus Christ who discuss on also many other topics aside from this.

    Jan 1, 2021

    19:51 minutes.

    What do you think about this discussion?
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2021
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  2. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    I'm not sure how this is even much of a discussion?

    We confess that Christ will come again as judge of the living and the dead, and His kingdom is everlasting.

    If that's not true, then Christianity is meaningless. As the Apostle himself says, if the dead do not rise then Christ is not risen, and if Christ is not risen then we are the most pitiable of all people.

    Or as Jaroslav Peilikan put it,

    "If Christ is risen -- then nothing else matters. And if Christ is not risen -- then nothing else matters."

    If Christ is risen, then we have hope of resurrection, and that is at Christ's coming. If Christ is not returning, there is no resurrection, then Christ is not risen, and we should all go find a better religion.

    -CryptoLutheran
     
  3. mlepfitjw

    mlepfitjw May you be blessed!

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    @ViaCrucis I believe that if you see the scriptures for what they say they seem to talk a lot about how Jesus Christ was coming quickly.

    Some believe he already came, some believe he has not already came back.

    What do you believe?

    What you are saying though is truth the Lord Jesus was risen again by God.

    They speak on a lot of different topics on the show mostly being about if Jesus Christ has returned, and would you say that it is a good question or a bad question sir?
     
  4. Dave G.

    Dave G. Well-Known Member

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    For those who believe that Christ came again, we have gone through the millennial reign and that this now is the new heaven on earth, all I can say is if you see perfection in all that is on earth now, no evil etc etc., I feel sorry for you. If this is all that Christianity was ever to offer then the whole thing was a big scam.
     
  5. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    Before any meaningful conversation can be had here, we first need to establish that we agree when we say that Jesus Christ was risen from the dead.

    Come Sunday morning, on the first Easter, was Christ's tomb empty? And was it empty because the Lord had been raised bodily from the dead? Can we first establish our agreement on this most basic and elementary of Christian doctrines.

    -CryptoLutheran
     
  6. Richard T

    Richard T Well-Known Member

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    I watched only part of this and it seems to be biased against rapture believers. I am glad our salvation does not depend on our end time beliefs. There is little downside that I know of for anyone with an incorrect position except what is found in this scripture.
    2 Timothy 4:8, KJV: "Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing."

    The main thing is that regardless of our end time beliefs, we should walk in the spirit. If we do that, we will not lack in our service to God. That should be our focus.
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2021
  7. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    Skipping to several parts of the video, I don't see any advocacy of dominionism. The angle seems to be hyper-preterism: everything already happened in 70 AD. And so there is no future Parousia, there is no bodily resurrection of the dead, there is no renewing of creation. There is no just conclusion to history.

    I say this as a somewhat self-identified partial Preterist. Hyper-Preterism is simply heretical. There's really no way of getting around it. The video presents it as "freeing", but there's no freedom to be had in the reality of a universe in which justice shall never prevail, and in which the ultimate death and decay of all things is the only end.

    God is not deaf to the groan and pleas of His creation. And God's answer to creation's plea is freedom.

    "For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worth comparing with the glory that is to be revealed to us. For the creation waits with eager longing for the revealing of the sons of God. For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of him who subjected it, in hope that the creation itself will be set free from its bondage to corruption and obtain the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation has been groaning together in the pains of childbirth until now. And not only the creation, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for adoption as sons, the redemption of our bodies. For in this hope we were saved. Now hope that is seen is not hope. For who hopes for what he sees? But if we hope for what we do not see, we wait for it with patience." - Romans 8:18-25

    -CryptoLutheran
     
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  8. Richard T

    Richard T Well-Known Member

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    Ok, thanks for watching the whole video and pointing out my flaws. I will edit my post to reflact a more honest portrayal.
     
  9. Jesus is YHWH

    Jesus is YHWH my Lord and my God ! Supporter

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    Agreed and we know He will come back in like manner from Acts 1(physically,bodily) and that every eye will see Him as He said in Matthew 24. So we are still awaiting His 2nd Coming where He sets this world right and destroys evil once and for all and we have a new heavens and new earth.

    hope this helps !!!
     
  10. Minister Monardo

    Minister Monardo Truth In The Nebulous

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    Quickly or suddenly? The word can mean both. What do the scriptures say?
    1 Corinthians 15:52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet.
    For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

    1 Thessalonians 4:16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.

    To say that Christ has already returned is to say that the Resurrection has occurred.
    Any evidence to support that?


    Revelation 1:7. Behold, He is coming with clouds, and every eye will see Him, even they who
    pierced Him. And all the tribes of the earth will mourn because of Him. Even so, Amen.

    If Christ has returned, where is the eyewitness testimony?
     
  11. Jesus is YHWH

    Jesus is YHWH my Lord and my God ! Supporter

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    ditto well said my friend and Happy New Year !
     
  12. mlepfitjw

    mlepfitjw May you be blessed!

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    Minister Monardo,

    If you do not mind may I share the start of Revelation please?

    Hope you find these scripture expositions for Revelation 1:1-7 are helpful.

    Revelation of Jesus Christ to the Seven Churches, from John who was the disciple.

    Revelation 1: 1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:​

    Verse 1A: This is the letter written of the Revelation of Jesus Christ. Which God gave to Jesus to show his servants things (Revelation).

    Verse 1B: Which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel (messenger) unto his servant (Disciple ) John.

    2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.​

    Verse 2: John bare record of the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ, and all records o all things that he saw. (The Gospel of Jesus according to John)

    3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.
    Verse 3: Blessed is he that reads this and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein; for the time is at hand.

    Verse 3 Question: What do you believe for the time is at hand?

    Verse 3 Question 2: Who would understand this message when they received this letter?

    Verse 3 Question 3: Jewish people first before the gentiles?

    4 John to the seven churches which are in Asia: Grace be unto you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is to come; and from the seven Spirits which are before his throne;
    Verse 4: John is writing a message to the seven churches which are in Asia. Then blesses those people at the 7 churches.

    Verse 4 Question: who is this message being written to ?

    Verse 4 Question 2: Was it the 7 churches of Asia minor, or was it to someone else?


    5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,​

    Verse 5, John continues his blessing to the 7 churches, in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, who washed our sins with his own blood.

    6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.​

    Verse 6 Speaking the something about being made Kings and priest because of the blood shed of the Lord.

    7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.​

    Verse 7: This talked about the region of earth that would wail because of him, which would do with the rejection of Israel because of them not worshiping the true living God and worshipped a false god, that was a deception, and did nothing for no one. Like the true living God wish can be seen throughout all creation, and the creation are able to call out to him freely because of the the Lord God Almighty has done.

    More of the message is left off.
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2021
  13. Minister Monardo

    Minister Monardo Truth In The Nebulous

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    This is the only question that would seem to be on topic for your thread.
    Your question presupposes some understanding of time relevant to the discussion.
    Here is a clue:

    2 Peter 3:8 But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as
    a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

    If His Ways are not our ways, and His Thoughts are not our thoughts (Isaiah 55:8, 9), thinking
    to understand His Time could be considered a vanity. Here is something I have read in the past.
    The disciples thought the Lord was coming back in their lifetime, and that mistaken notion caused
    errors in their actions and decisions. Let me make clear to you why that is irrelevant. Throughout
    the Gospels, the Lord taught that His servants should live their lives as if their master could return
    at any time, in the middle of the night, and to watch for His return. Rather than impute error upon
    the apostles, I would argue that they lived in obedience to exactly what they were instructed.
    We would be wise to do the same.

    Revelation 2:29 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

    As to the messages to the seven churches, I take them as personal instruction, and try to hold
    to verse 3, instructing us to keep them in our heart, even as Mary kept and pondered upon
    every Word the Angel spoke to her.
    In closing, I would take note that I do not consider your post (#12) on the first seven verses of Revelation, with questionnaire, to be an appropriate response to my post at #10.
    If you want to come back to that later.
     
  14. mlepfitjw

    mlepfitjw May you be blessed!

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    You are right sir, Minister Mondardo.

    Anytime we spend time with the Lord is endless, because he is there to hear us always and forever.

    I do not believe the topic interferes with if Jesus Christ has come back or not.


    According to your point of view about the disciples. Thought the Lord was coming back in their lifetime, and where mistake? How were they were mistake if they knew times of the Age would end for them, which was told by to the by Jesus?

    You are free to believe how you desire if you desire so about this view, though I disagree, and believe full well the disciples knew about the return of the Lord God Almighty.




    Okay I can respect that, thank you so much for your responses, and hope my responses are good and helpful to my view, most certainly are we to aim for unity in the faith and love each other and bear each others burdens, minister monardo.

    God bless all who read and enjoy the new year.
     
  15. Daniel Marsh

    Daniel Marsh Well-Known Member

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    I live as if he will return at midnight. I do not want to be caught with my pants down.
     
  16. mlepfitjw

    mlepfitjw May you be blessed!

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    Well dayum, Daniel.

    You should know, These are three mens opinions, and you should know they use scriptures, and they explain what they know and what they believe, and also ask questions relating to the topics that are being explained to be answered.

    just a side note, you should know also the person on the left, named Ethan Foster (16yr), and Shawn McCranny(61yearold), and this named Steve Uteley (27? maybe) but they are very well known in what it says about the bible, and when it comes to doctrines and when it comes to faith.'

    I do not understand what the big deal is.:hug:
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2021
  17. mikeforjesus

    mikeforjesus Senior Member Supporter

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    Jesus could not have come again the bodies of ancient people still exist which prove we are not on a new earth

    Revelations 21:1 Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea.

    The below conditions for new earth is no infant will die so we can’t be living in new earth now and righteousness must dwell

    Isaiah 65:17-20
    17 “For behold, I create new heavens and a new earth;
    And the former shall not be remembered or come to mind.
    18 But be glad and rejoice forever in what I create;
    For behold, I create Jerusalem as a rejoicing,
    And her people a joy.
    19 I will rejoice in Jerusalem,
    And joy in My people;
    The voice of weeping shall no longer be heard in her,
    Nor the voice of crying.
    20 “No more shall an infant from there live but a few days,
    Nor an old man who has not fulfilled his days;


    2 Peter 3:13
    Nevertheless we, according to His
    promise, look for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells.
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2021
  18. FaithWillDo

    FaithWillDo New Member

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    There is no truth in the video. Jesus Christ fulfilled all of Matthew 24 on the Day of Pentecost when those in the Upper Room received the Spirit. This is the fulfillment of the second coming of Christ. And He has been fulfilling it over and over again down through the age when He comes a second time to each of His chosen Elect. That is why scripture says He will come quickly. If you are chosen, then He will come quickly within your lifetime. If you are not chosen to be a First Fruit, then you will die in your sins and be saved in the final age. At the end of the final age, every eye will have seen Him. There is no future visible second coming of Christ to this world as is commonly taught. He comes a second time spiritually (within us). When He comes, He changes us in the twinkling of an eye, heals our spiritual vision (every eye will see Him) and we are born again. It is the time of the Latter Rain. It is at that point we cross the Jordan River and begin defeating the giants in the land (happens within us to make us into a Son of God). It is the maturing process. It is our time of judgment when we learn righteousness. It is the 1000 year reign Christ within us until we are mature and are producing the spiritual fruit God desires from us. The second coming of Christ is salvation.

    Heb 9:28 So Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.

    Joe
     
  19. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    Is there a resurrection of the body?

    If not, then this talk of "salvation" doesn't mean anything.

    -CryptoLutheran
     
  20. FaithWillDo

    FaithWillDo New Member

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    Our salvation is spiritual, not physical. We first need the Early and Latter Rains of the Spirit before we are born again (saved). It happens now, in this body. After we physically die and are resurrected, we will then receive a spiritual body to match our spiritual condition.

    You should understand that "salvation" is a restored relationship with the Father and a life free from ever sinning again. In other words, we will be like Christ. Our salvation occurs now in this life. The Old Man (who is the one who sins) begins to die when we are born again. The New Man which is Christ in us never sins. From God perspective, the New Man is who we are once we are born again. The Old Man is being destroyed and the New Man is maturing to produce spiritual fruits. John the Baptist, who is a "type" of our Old Man said this:

    John 3:30 He must increase, but I must decrease.

    Salvation comes to us in the twinkling of an eye when Christ comes to us a second time. That is the time when we receive the Latter Rain.
    Joe
     
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