Did the event of 1948 Israel fulfill any Bible prophecy?

[Copperhead]

Did the event of 1948 Israel fulfill any Bible prophecy?

I believe the answer was shown previously in the affirmative.

 

[Dave L]

No. Sounds like you don't want to put in the legwork to research it. I don't hold to the concept so I am not obligated to describe it for you. But I am aware of the concept and have looked into it and a lot of what you are talking about mirrors quite a bit of that theology. Not specifically saying you are in that camp, only that a lot of what you state sounds a lot like Restoration Theology stuff. And the theology has a lot of questionable attributes.

A simple definition would help. I never heard of it before.

 

[Yarddog]

Conversation from another thread:

Who believes we are in the latter days and that the Rapture will happen in our lifetime?
Discuss............

OT prophesy just may have nailed the exact year that the present Hebrew Nation would be created. Genesis is full of prophesy about Jesus and future events.

Jesus said. "I am the light". The Gospel of John begins with "In the beginning" for a reason and that was to point to Genesis 1. Jesus is the light of Genesis which foretells of the Son coming into the world.

When man is created Genesis counts the lifespan of the generations for a few thousand years and stops. It we count until the birth of Abraham we find 1 thousand 9 hundred and 48 years. Does Abraham's birth foretell of the future Hebrew Nation 1948 years after Jesus was born into the world. Future events may she'd light on this as Abraham was called out of Babylon at age 75 which would be 2023.

Will the tribes of Israel be called out of those areas to which they were scattered in 2023?

 

[jgr]

It can mean a singular house, a nation or people, etc. You have applied it to the city. I applied it to the house of the Lord. I am not incorrect in what I stated. did you actually read the 3624 link you provided?

Check it again.

Here again is the specific reference:

οἶκος ὑμῶν, of the city of Jerusalem, Matthew 23:38; Luke 13:35.

It is the only definition in which Matthew 23:38 is specifically cited.

 

[Douggg]

You need to study circumcision and learn about the role it played in making one a physical Jew and a physical member of Israel. And then consider Jesus abolished it on the cross.

Dave, I don't deny that the doctrine that the Church has become Israel exists. But that doctrine was proved wrong in 1948.

I would say come to grips with reality and devout your attention to the parable of the fig tree. Accept that Israel is a nation again, with Jerusalem back in the hands of the Jews. And formulate your eschatology and the blessed hope evidenced by that reality.

Make the Kingdom of Heaven a priority, store up treasure in heaven, and look forward to the blessed hope of Jesus's appearing for redemption of your body, the corruptible putting on incorruptible.

 

[Grip Docility]

The thing to note about the question the disciples asked... Yeshua does not say it was a invalid question but that it was not for them to know when it would happen. The idea of the Messiah restoring the kingdom of Israel is paramount in Hebrew thinking and fully supported in the OT. And never refuted by Yeshua.

It’s like people ignore this! Jesus literally validates that a secret time is set aside. God is about to ascend to the right hand of God and those words are contained in His last Earthly, Corporeally Residential word’s...

And people are like.... SOO WHAT!?!

Face Palm

 

[Grip Docility]

Dave, I don't deny that the doctrine that the Church has become Israel exists. But that doctrine was proved wrong in 1948.

I would say come to grips with reality and devout your attention to the parable of the fig tree. Accept that Israel is a nation again, with Jerusalem back in the hands of the Jews. And formulate your eschatology and the blessed hope evidenced by that reality.

Make the Kingdom of Heaven a priority, store up treasure in heaven, and look forward to the blessed hope of Jesus's appearing for redemption of your body, the corruptible putting on incorruptible.

This

 

[Grip Docility]

Check it again.

Here again is the specific reference:

οἶκος ὑμῶν, of the city of Jerusalem, Matthew 23:38; Luke 13:35.

It is the only definition in which Matthew 23:38 is specifically cited.

Galatians 4

Check that one. As surely as there's a Jerusalem above, so there’s a Jerusalem Below.

Ahem...

Let it be! On earth so it is in... well... you know the rest.

Ones free, the other is “currently” “in bondage”

 

[throughfiierytrial]

I have not a clue what you are talking about.

Talking about this verse...
II Timothy 2:15:
Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a workman who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the Word of Truth.

 

[Copperhead]

A simple definition would help. I never heard of it before.

Another name for it is Two House Theology or Two House Movement. Does that help?

But to assist.....

https://torahresource.com/EnglishArticles/Two House Fatal Errors.pdf

 

[Grip Docility]

Your #1 question is where the disciples/apostles ask when Jesus will restore Israel. Remember that at that time these disciples did not understand the full nature of Christ's Kingdom yet...though they were taught they did not comprehend and that is fully brought out in the Gospels. It was on Pentecost and beyond that the Holy Spirit visited them...at baptism and as I said beyond...and their Kingdom work assignments and understanding of it unfolded as we read in Acts...no unclean meat, etc.
Paul gives us the parable of sorts of the olive tree in Romans which bears out that Israel is all true believers. He also says "even the Israel of God" in Galatians. Jesus says no man comes to the Father but by Me...the covenant stipulations apply to each and every member of His body equally, no exceptions and no qualifiers to bypass this requirement. Also Scripture says our old labels fade away and we all unite as one body...
Colossians 3:10-12:
and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge in the image of its Creator. Here there is no Gentile or Jew, circumcised or uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave or free, but Christ is all, and is in all.
Therefore, as God’s chosen people, holy and dearly loved, clothe yourselves with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience.
As concerns the return of Jesus from where He left the Apostles on Ascension Day, are the angels there not speaking of His departure and return to the earth for the final judgement and not the identical spot of earth Jesus stood on when He ascended? Yes, Indeed that is my stand!.

The Kingdom of God is currently "in Heaven". Are you attempting to Preterism the idea in that first off, the "But" should be ignored in the context of Jesus' answer, before he spoke about Pentecost, and preceded the but with "NOT REVEALING THE DAY NOR THE HOUR" verbiage, then... saying "But", .... and He goes on to explain what will happen "until" that time.

All I have to do is cite Romans 11 and note "The fullness of the gentiles", which immediately brings you back to square one.

notice you still ignored questions 2 and 3? I wonder why?

 

[jgr]

Galatians 4

Check that one. As surely as theirs a Jerusalem above, so there’s a Jerusalem Below.

Ahem...

Let it be! On earth so it is in... well... you know the rest.

Ones free, the other is “currently” “in bondage”

Where does Galatians 4 appear in the Greek explanation?

 

[Grip Docility]

Where does Galatians 4 appear in the Greek explanation?

It's Impossible to pull the gymnastics you're attempting to pull.

Galatians 4:24 These things are illustrations, for the women represent the two covenants. One is from Mount Sinai; and bears children into slavery—this is Hagar 25 Now Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children. 26 But the Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother.

Paul literally says "Present Jerusalem" and "The Jerusalem Above".

Easy Peasy..... Are you caught up in the third heaven, as you type? Yes? Oh, well forgive my ignorance. No? Okay, then you have to reference all from the "Present Jerusalem" stance.

Paul, himself states TWO JERUSALEM's.

Context shredder, maybe? Should we feed that through the contextshreado-matic?

 

[Copperhead]

Check it again.

Here again is the specific reference:

οἶκος ὑμῶν, of the city of Jerusalem, Matthew 23:38; Luke 13:35.

It is the only definition in which Matthew 23:38 is specifically cited.

Not quite. Per Strongs on House in Matthew 23:38.....

Dictionary Definition g3624.
οἶκος oikos; of uncertain affinity; a dwelling (more or less extensive, literal or figurative); by implication, a family (more or less related, literally or figuratively): — home, house(-hold), temple.
AV (114) - house 104, household 3, home + g1519 2, at home + g1722 2, misc 3;
a house, an inhabited house, home, any building whatever of, a palace, the house of God, the tabernacle
any dwelling placeof the human body as the abode of demons that possess itof tents, and huts, and later, of the nests, stalls, lairs, of animalsthe place where one has fixed his residence, one's settled abode, domicile

 

[jgr]

Not quite. Per Strongs on House in Matthew 23:38.....

Dictionary Definition g3624.
οἶκος oikos; of uncertain affinity; a dwelling (more or less extensive, literal or figurative); by implication, a family (more or less related, literally or figuratively): — home, house(-hold), temple.
AV (114) - house 104, household 3, home + g1519 2, at home + g1722 2, misc 3;
a house, an inhabited house, home, any building whatever of, a palace, the house of God, the tabernacle
any dwelling placeof the human body as the abode of demons that possess itof tents, and huts, and later, of the nests, stalls, lairs, of animalsthe place where one has fixed his residence, one's settled abode, domicile

I don't see Matthew 23:38.

 

[jgr]

It's Impossible to pull the gymnastics you're attempting to pull.

Galatians 4:24 These things are illustrations, for the women represent the two covenants. One is from Mount Sinai; and bears children into slavery—this is Hagar 25 Now Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children. 26 But the Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother.

Paul literally says "Present Jerusalem" and "The Jerusalem Above".

Easy Peasy..... Are you caught up in the third heaven, as you type? Yes? Oh, well forgive my ignorance. No? Okay, then you have to reference all from the "Present Jerusalem" stance.

Paul, himself states TWO JERUSALEM's.

Context shredder, maybe? Should we feed that through the contextshreado-matic?

It appears that you misunderstood the question, so here it is again:

Where does Galatians 4 appear in the Greek explanation?

 

[Ken Rank]

I think the Jewish people returning to their land is a sign of the times but I also don't believe that the parable of the fig tree is speaking of this event. First of all, we are at 71 years now and most generations in Scripture seem to be 40 years. But more to the point... the parable of the fig tree is showing Israel, in the nations I believe (where most of Israel still is) awakening. The fig tree (Israel) was dormant, asleep, hibernating, and then new leaves, new sprouts... and awakening. So an end time awakening, if we are looking for anything (and I would suggest we don't... I think Scripture stands on the side of doing all we can until we have no more time to do it) is what will happen and those alive to see it won't all pass before the end.

The most interesting and pin point event that tells us what time it is is Adam. It has been 6000 years since Adam (roughly) and the Sabbath... while held in disdain by some denominations, was designed to point to the Millennial Kingdom. 6 days of work are equal to 6000 years of toil and death... and the day of rest equal to the 1000 year rest and Messiah's reign.

 

[LovesOurLord]

It's unfortunate that people think the founding of the secular, anti-Christian state of Israel has anything to do with God or His promises.

I see nothing in the Bible where Jews would continue to be God's chosen, simply on account of their birth regardless of their rejection of Christ due to that the Bible plainly states that those who deny the Son are of the devil. Are we to suggest that rejection of Christ is only a damnable offense if committed by a non-Jew?

This new theology replacing historical theology regarding what is disparagingly called "replacement theology" is especially popular among Messianic Jews and Dispensationalists. It is clearly, however, a false teaching. It seems to be heavily based on a literalist reading of the book of Ezekiel regarding the building of the Third Temple. Since Jesus' sacrifice not only replaced animal sacrifice but the Law itself, there is no reason to build a literal third temple and hold animal sacrifices there. Such a thing is to legitimize the rejection of Christ as the Sacrificial Lamb.

Matthew 21:42-43 :

"Jesus said to them, 'Have you never read in the Scriptures:
'The stone the builders rejected
has become the cornerstone;
the Lord has done this,
and it is marvelous in our eyes’?

'Therefore I tell you that the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a people who will produce its fruit.'"

Reject the cornerstone (Christ) and lose the Kingdom. Plain and simple. Refer also to Romans 10:9, Acts 4:12, John 1:12, Galatians 3:26, Mark 16:16, etc.

Moses warned the Jews that disobeying God would lead them to be vomited out of the Promised Land like those before them. Leviticus 18:24-29. They were warned of being replaced for their behavior and lack of faith and those who broke the Law among them were to be cut off from the people - regardless of their being Jewish. God's promises were strictly in relation to the faithfulness of Jews, not regardless of. Qualifiers always existed.

Furthermore, Christ's sacrifice discharged the Jews from the Law, rendering it void.

Romans 7:4-6 :

“[Y]ou have died to the law through the body of Christ, so that you may belong to another, to him who has been raised from the dead in order that we may bear fruit for God. While we were living in the flesh, our sinful passions, aroused by the law, were at work in our members to bear fruit for death. But now we are discharged from the law, dead to that which held us captive, so that we are slaves not under the old written code but in the new life of the Spirit.”

A New Covenant was predicted:

Jeremiah 31:31-

'"The days are coming,' declares the LORD, 'when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah. It will not be like the covenant I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they broke my covenant, though I was a husband to them,' declares the LORD. 'This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel after that time,' declares the LORD. 'I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.'"

God did not save all Jews, but a remnant He chose by grace. That remnant are believers in the Messiah. Romans 11:1-36

There is no difference between Jew and Gentile : "For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him" - Romans 10:12

Sadly, I've come across not only bad arguments for rejecting "replacement theology," but ones that antisemite bait while doing so, such as here. Jews are called, like everyone else, but they do not get special seats at the table regardless of their rejection of Christ simply because they have a Jewish mother.

 

[Copperhead]

It's unfortunate that people think the founding of the secular, anti-Christian state of Israel has anything to do with God or His promises.

Why would it be unfortunate? The scripture is pretty clear that the restoration of Israel would begin with them initially in unbelief. That they are not singing praises to Yeshua on a national level yet does not mean that it is not scriptural what has happened.

 

[LovesOurLord]

Much of it at the instigation of the “church”. Martin Luther said their synagogues should burned, Torah scrolls destroyed, all their property and homes confiscated, and driven out of the countries where they live. Of course Hitler and others have run with that. And it is on the rise again, and in some mainline denominations of the church. The recent BDS movement is part of that.

Somehow I missed the passage where it says that is the church’s responsibility. But there seem to be ample passages in both OT and NT that talk about being judged on how the Hebrew people were treated.

I'm wondering how you rationalize the idea that a country founded explicitly by a group of anti-Christian, anti-Christ, Jesus-rejecting secular leftists is a special place in God's eyes. Not only do they reject Christ, but Christian churches continue to be vandalized by Jews and Christian pilgrims harassed. It seems you're taking a few Bible verses out of context and placing people on a pedestal due to their ethnicity.

The OT and NT both state that the behavior of Jews regarding their acceptance or rejection of God is directly related to their continuing to be His people and allowed to live on that land.

And what's wrong with the BDS movement? It's kind of odd to invoke the evil of Hitler in the same post where you're going out of your way to defend a country founded on ethnoreligious discrimination and the ethnic cleansing of Gentiles.