DID GOD DIE ON THE CROSS?

[Carl Emerson]

Hi there,

How comfortable are we with this suggestion?

Is this a case of applying human reason to the mysteries of God and coming out with an invalid answer?

Your thoughts very much appreciated.

Do some churches insist on believing this?

 

[ewq1938]

Hi there,

How comfortable are we with this suggestion?

Is this a case of applying human reason to the mysteries of God and coming out with an invalid answer?

Your thoughts very much appreciated.

Do some churches insist on believing this?

God cannot die but if God (God the Son) came and was born into a mortal human body, then he could die a mortal human death without the God part of him ever dying.

 

[returntosender]

Sorry, I misunderstood the question.
God couldn't but Jesus could.
No church that I know of believes that God died on the cross.

 

[SANTOSO]

Hi there,

How comfortable are we with this suggestion?

Is this a case of applying human reason to the mysteries of God and coming out with an invalid answer?

Your thoughts very much appreciated.

Do some churches insist on believing this?

Have you considered what Jesus have said :

saying, "The Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and on the third day be raised." -Luke 9:22

Jesus considers that the Son of Man who died on the Cross.

 

[Jeshu]

i think Jesus brought God the Father a present and that was the knowledge of suffering and death in human life to the extreme. It touched the heart of the Father like no other ever did or will do. So He raised Him back up to life. Eternally!

i believe that Jesus displayed God the Father perfectly, He did this all His life on this earth, but in particular through His crucifixion.

Humanity kills God out of their hearts, each and everyone of them, including you and me. The lies which we believe about God, ourselves and our neighbour kill Him stone death - time and again. Where else has humanities lovelessness and godforsakenness come from?(That is why we need Jesus to bring us back to life.)

Through Jesus God came down on this earth and experienced life as we do, and not just viewed from on high. This is why He can sympathise with our temptations, weaknesses and falls, for He has been tempted like we have been but came out on the truthful side time and again. What a blessing God came and bore His own judgement upon sin upon Himself. Made the effort to understand us and free us from what kept us from being 100 percent ourselves. i will always love Him for that.

We serve an awesome God.

 

[Aussie Pete]

Hi there,

How comfortable are we with this suggestion?

Is this a case of applying human reason to the mysteries of God and coming out with an invalid answer?

Your thoughts very much appreciated.

Do some churches insist on believing this?

God cannot die. The thought that it is possible is beyond ridiculous.

 

[returntosender]

If he did then he was resurrected along with Jesus and LIVES.

 

[SANTOSO]

i think Jesus brought God the Father a present and that was the knowledge of suffering and death in human life to the extreme. It touched the heart of the Father like no other ever did or will do. So He raised Him back up to life. Eternally!

i believe that Jesus displayed God the Father perfectly, He did this all His life on this earth, but in particular through His crucifixion.

Humanity kills God out of their hearts, each and everyone of them, including you and me. The lies which we believe about God, ourselves and our neighbour kill Him stone death - time and again. Where else has humanities lovelessness and godforsakenness come from?

Through Jesus God came down on this earth and experienced life as we do, and not just viewed from on high. This is why He can sympathise with our temptations, weaknesses and falls, for He has been tempted like we have been but came out on the truthful side time and again. What a blessing God came and bore His own judgement upon sin upon Himself. Made the effort to understand us and free us from what kept us from being 100 percent ourselves. i will always love Him for that.

We serve an awesome God.

Brother, I think you are mistaken when you said :
Humanity kills God out of their hearts, each and everyone of them, including you and me.

Why?
This is what apostle Paul have said :

For God, who said, "Let light shine out of darkness," has shone IN OUR HEARTS to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. -2 Corinthians 4:6

There is this light of the world in our hearts!
This light of the world shines brightly and ALIVE in our hearts !

 

[Carl Emerson]

Did the church Fathers insist on this belief - Than God died on the Cross ???

 

[Jeshu]

Brother, I think you are mistaken when you said :
Humanity kills God out of their hearts, each and everyone of them, including you and me.

Why?
This is what apostle Paul have said :

For God, who said, "Let light shine out of darkness," has shone IN OUR HEARTS to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. -2 Corinthians 4:6

There is this light of the world in our hearts!
This light of the world shines brightly and ALIVE in our hearts !

You are quiet right. God lives, and so do i, but at first i killed Him in my own heart. i betrayed Him for a kiss just like all sinners did and do. WE need to be saved out of our death into His life. It was for you like that as well?

If it hadn't been for Jesus i would have certainly died a miserable death.

All Glory to Him.

 

[Hmm]

As well as having created the universe, God sustains it in existence every moment. "In Him we live and move and have our being" Acts 17:28. If God died then the universe would have disappeared during the three days Jesus was in the tomb so all the events described in the Bible during that period would not have happened. And if there was no God, who or what could have resurrected Jesus?

 

[Friedrich Rubinstein]

To answer this question we should maybe define "death" first?
Humans are a spirit within a body. When we die the spirit leaves the body; the body decays and the spirit "goes somewhere, waiting to be resurrected on judgement day" - to put it simple.
We all know that Jesus is God, so when Jesus died on that cross we can indeed say "God died on the cross", but this does not imply that God disappeared.

Jesus was fully God and fully human. How is that possible? Well, we humans have a human spirit within a body, Jesus was God's spirit in a body. So when he died on the cross his body decayed but the spirit, the Holy Spirit, didn't vanish.

I believe God Himself experienced "death" on the cross, especially when you consider Jesus' last words: "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" This was a painful separation of God from God Himself. Something we can't fully grasp (and I don't want to start the whole debate about the trinity here), but I see no issue in saying that "God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself" (2 Cor 5:19).

 

[eleos1954]

To answer this question we should maybe define "death" first?
Humans are a spirit within a body. When we die the spirit leaves the body; the body decays and the spirit "goes somewhere, waiting to be resurrected on judgement day" - to put it simple.
We all know that Jesus is God, so when Jesus died on that cross we can indeed say "God died on the cross", but this does not imply that God disappeared.

Jesus was fully God and fully human. How is that possible? Well, we humans have a human spirit within a body, Jesus was God's spirit in a body. So when he died on the cross his body decayed but the spirit, the Holy Spirit, didn't vanish.

I believe God Himself experienced "death" on the cross, especially when you consider Jesus' last words: "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" This was a painful separation of God from God Himself. Something we can't fully grasp (and I don't want to start the whole debate about the trinity here), but I see no issue in saying that "God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself" (2 Cor 5:19).

So when he died on the cross his body decayed but the spirit, the Holy Spirit, didn't vanish.

Not so ....

Acts 13:37

Berean Study Bible
But the One whom God raised from the dead did not see decay.

 

[Friedrich Rubinstein]

Not so ....
Acts 13:37
Berean Study Bible
But the One whom God raised from the dead did not see decay.

You're right, because Jesus was resurrected his body didn't decay. What I tried to say is that Jesus met the requirements for experiencing "death".

 

[Knee V]

Natures don't do or experience things - persons do. Christ, the person who is God and man, died on the cross. God died on the cross.

The person of Christ underwent human death. As the God-man, being the perfect union of humanity and Divinity, Christ's soul was still the God-man even in death. Christ's human soul was still perfectly united to Divinity and was still the Divine-human person, although separated from His body. As the God-man separated from His body, He entered the abode of the dead - sheol/hades/hell - with all the others who had ever died. He conquered it, filled it with life, and freed the captives.

He then came back from the dead, and his body and soul were re-united, and the whole time never ceased being the God-man.

God died on the cross. Anything else is Nestorianism.

 

[grafted branch]

I believe God Himself experienced "death" on the cross, especially when you consider Jesus' last words: "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" This was a painful separation of God from God Himself. Something we can't fully grasp (and I don't want to start the whole debate about the trinity here), but I see no issue in saying that "God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself" (2 Cor 5:19).

I agree with you here that there was a separation. I think the Adam and Eve account can help show that there was at least some type of separation. As @Carl Emerson has said on another thread, there isn’t a lot of biblical information on this and every piece of information helps.

In case anyone reading this hasn’t heard of how Adam and Eve relate to the cross, I will give a brief description.

It says in Genesis 2:23-24 because the woman is taken out of the man that he shall leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife. Adam at this point has the propensity to cleave to his wife Eve. In Genesis 3:6 Eve eats the forbidden fruit and gave it to her husband. In the KJV there is a semicolon after this statement before Adam eats the fruit. This suggests that there was at least a pause before Adam eats the fruit. Because Adam wasn’t deceived (1 Timothy 2:14) he contemplated his choices of either not eating the fruit and remaining with God or choosing death and eating the fruit in order to cleave to his wife.

The similarity here is that Christ chose death in order to be with his bride (believers).

 

[renniks]

Hi there,

How comfortable are we with this suggestion?

Is this a case of applying human reason to the mysteries of God and coming out with an invalid answer?

Your thoughts very much appreciated.

Do some churches insist on believing this?

Did someone else die?
Of course, God died.
It sure wasn't Micky mouse!

 

[Carl Emerson]

I agree with you here that there was a separation. I think the Adam and Eve account can help show that there was at least some type of separation. As @Carl Emerson has said on another thread, there isn’t a lot of biblical information on this and every piece of information helps.

In case anyone reading this hasn’t heard of how Adam and Eve relate to the cross, I will give a brief description.

It says in Genesis 2:23-24 because the woman is taken out of the man that he shall leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife. Adam at this point has the propensity to cleave to his wife Eve. In Genesis 3:6 Eve eats the forbidden fruit and gave it to her husband. In the KJV there is a semicolon after this statement before Adam eats the fruit. This suggests that there was at least a pause before Adam eats the fruit. Because Adam wasn’t deceived (1 Timothy 2:14) he contemplated his choices of either not eating the fruit and remaining with God or choosing death and eating the fruit in order to cleave to his wife.

The similarity here is that Christ chose death in order to be with his bride (believers).

This scenario seems to suggest there was some virtue in Adam eating the fruit... ???

 

[1213]

DID GOD DIE ON THE CROSS?

According to the Bible, God raised Jesus from the death. And Bible doesn’t tell God died, therefore I think God did not die on the cross.

Now God raised up the Lord, and will also raise us up by his power.
1 Cor. 6:14

 

[Carl Emerson]

Well here is my take...

The question is a conundrum...

We have to carefully define terms first.

Was Jesus fully God ?

Yes - He chose to take human limitations while on earth but was fully God.

Did He die? Yes but we first must define death - The body stopped working, the Spirit departed.

Did the Spirit die? No...

Did the flesh die - yes

Did Jesus who is God die? Yes

Did The Spirit in Jesus who is God also die - No.

By the way I don't think "My God my God why has Thou forsaken Me" is evidence of separation for two reasons.

1. Jesus had taken on human limitations and didn't know for a time all the plans of the Father (Him not knowing the day of His second coming is a case in point) Because of this He perceived his plight as separation when His Father was right there with Him.

2. Psalms werent numbered and were referenced by key verses - often first verses. He was quoting Psalm 22:1 to indicate the fulfillment of the Psalm - He was not declaring He was separated. (Look at verse 3)