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Did all the laws end at the cross- Part 2

Discussion in 'Sabbath and The Law' started by SabbathBlessings, Apr 21, 2022.

  1. SabbathBlessings

    SabbathBlessings Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Hi there,

    I noticed you referenced Colossians 2:14. but only quoted Col 2:17. Colossians 2:14 gives context to Colossians 2:17 so lets back up because many people use Col 2:17 to try to make a case that Paul is contradicting God and saying we can forget the Sabbath commandment, when God told us to Remember it. To me God said it, so I believe it.

    Colossians 2:14 having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.

    The Ten Commandments is God-written (finger of God), the law of Moses is handwritten so right there you have your proof this is not talking about any of God's Ten Commandments.

    having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us

    This is most certainly not referring to any of the Ten Commandments.

    1 John 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and His commandments are not grievous. So there appears to be a contradiction to Col 2:14 and the Ten Commandments. Since there are no contradictions in scripture, it must be referring to another law. The law of Moses was placed outside the ark of the covenant, written by Moses in a book as a witness against you, Deuteronomy 31:24 God's law is not grievous 1 John 5:3. The law of Moses was added because of sin Galatians 3:19, the law of God points out sin, Romans 7:7, Romans 3:20. The law of Moses contained curses Deuteronomy 29:20-21, Galatians 3:10 and made nothing perfect Hebrews 7:19. The law of God is perfect Psalms 19:7 and brings blessings and peace Proverbs 29:18, Psalms 119:165 the law of Moses in the book of ordinances ended with Jesus being our Perfect sacrifice. Ephesians 2:15, Col 2:14-16, Hebrews 8:13 not God's law which is ETERNAL and UNCHANGING Matthew 5:17-19

    So there is 100% proof Colossians 2:14-16 is not referring to the Ten Commandments it is referring to the law of ordinances, not the COMMANDMENTS of God. Is there a sabbath(s) in the law of ordinances? Yes, and fits Colossians 2:16 to a tee as is about food and drink and holy days called sabbath(s) in scripture which has nothing to do with the commandments of God that was before sin Genesis 2:1-3 and is a memorial to God's Creation "Remember" the Sabbath day to keep holy Exodus 20:8. The sabbath(s) feast days (animal and food offerings) is what ended, that is in the ordinances in the law of Moses, that was contrary to us and ended with Jesus our Sacrifice -See Hebrews 10 which is what Colossians 2:14-16 is referring to.

    Another consideration why Colossians 2:14-16 is not referring the seventh day Sabbath

    Colossians 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ. The Sabbath is not a shadow of anything, it points back to Creation "Remember" the Sabbath day to keep Holy and does not point to Christ on the cross.

    The Sabbath day continues to be God's chosen day of worship for eternity: Isaiah 66:23 just like God promised Exodus 31:1

    Hope this helps a little.
     
  2. Leaf473

    Leaf473 Well-Known Member

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    Well... We don't break the principles of God's law, but it's not about following the letter of it. If you can agree with that, then I'd say we agree.
     
  3. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    I am not quite sure what your saying here to be honest. It is not very hard to me. We either believe and follow what God's Word says or we do not.
     
  4. Clare73

    Clare73 Blood-bought

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    Last edited: May 9, 2022
  5. Leaf473

    Leaf473 Well-Known Member

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    Well... We both agree that it's not very hard. Do you want me to try to explain more?
     
  6. Ligurian

    Ligurian Other Sheep

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    10th Commandment: Matthew 5:28, Matthew 27:18, Matthew 15:21-28, Matthew 20:11-16, Matthew 21:37-39, Matthew 24:11, John 10:1-5, Revelation 2-3, Revelation 9:21, etc., (Because coveting is the base-metal upon which the others rest, from false gods to false Judaeans, it all stems from covetousness... from envy, to wanting, to murder and theft.)

    1 Corinthians 8:10 For if any man see thee which hast knowledge sit at meat in the idol's temple, shall not the conscience of him which is weak be emboldened to eat those things which are offered to idols;
    (you probably shouldn't try adding context to this verse... it will not help your case.

    Hebrews 13 quotes verse that's not about the Sabbath day.
    Galatians 4:9-10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.

    Each year has 52 "sabbath days (plural)".

    2Cor3 context doesn't help your case, it shreds it... but maybe not to you.

    The New Covenant is a Newer Bigger Ministry of Condemnation... much stronger than that of whitewashed-tombs... because it judges the reins and hearts. (Revelation 2:20-23) What lives deep within your minds is that which rules you... God searches these things, as well as the thoughts and feelings you show. If you are following Jesus and have the evidence thereof within your deepest mind, the Father purges what doesn't belong there. (John 15:1-8)

    Matthew 5:17-20 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.[18] For verily I say unto you, Till Heaven and Earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from (του)the Law, till all be fulfilled.[19] Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least Commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the Kingdom of Heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the Kingdom of Heaven.[20] For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the Kingdom of Heaven. του = properly, the genitive case of ho; of this person:--his.

    Matthew 5:21-26 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:[22] But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.[23] Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee;[24] Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.
    =
    John 12:48-50 Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on Me, believeth not on Me but on Him that sent Me.
    =
    Deuteronomy 18:18-19 [18] I will raise up to them a prophet of their brethren like thee, and I will put My words in His mouth, and He shall speak to them as I shall Command Him.[19] And whatever man shall not hearken to whatsoever words that Prophet shall speak in My name, I will take vengeance on him.LXX

    Psalms 89:20-37 [20] I have found David My servant, I have anointed him by My holy mercy: [28] I will keep My mercy for him for ever, and My Covenant shall be firm with him.[29] And I will establish his seed for ever and ever, and his throne as the days of Heaven.[30] If his children should forsake My Law and walk not in My judgments,[31] if they should profane My Ordinances and not keep My Commandments,[32] I will visit their transgressions with a rod, and their sins with scourges.[33] But My mercy I will not utterly remove from him, nor wrong My truth.[34] Neither will I by any means profane My Covenant and I will not make void the things that proceed out of My lips,[35] once have I sworn by My holiness that I will not lie to David.[36] His seed shall endure for ever, and his throne as the sun before Me;[37] and as the moon that is established for ever, and as the faithful witness in Heaven.

    Revelation 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

    This is the Davidic Covenant, the Sure Mercies of David... it's the New Covenant of Matthew 26:26-28, ratified by those to whom it was given at the last Passover, as the circumcision done by Abraham ratified the Promise Covenant. The Galilean Eleven are the fold of John 10:16... making those who hear "their word" (John 17:20) the "other sheep".
    ___________________
    Given how well is known the scattering of the 10-lost-tribes of the House of Israel into the nations, and them mixing themselves among their neighbors even in the Promised Land, it may be a given that the 10-tribes of the House of Israel have mingled their blood with the blood of the strangers among whom they have lived for +/-2756 years... and maybe much longer, with Dan being on ships, and historically large in females. So... if all you hear is Jesus' voice and not the voice of strangers, or want to become a proselyte... then this Gospel of the Kingdom speaks to you: Revelation 22:13-17
    [14] μακαριοι οι ποιουντες τας εντολας αυτου ινα εσται η εξουσια αυτων επι το ξυλον της ζωης και τοις πυλωσιν εισελθωσιν εις την πολιν.
     
  7. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Hi Lig nice to see you again.

    Please see post # 498 linked; post # 499 linked; and post # 500 linked. Your post here is unresponsive to the posts and the scriptures you are quoting from and do not address any of the posts or scripture content and contexts that disagree with your teachings. May you receive God's correction through His Word and be blessed ignoring it will not make it disappear according to the scriptures. According to Jesus the Words of God we accept or reject will become our judge come judgement day *see John 12:47-48. I hope only the best for you Lig. Take your time and review the scriptures and the context provided in the linked posts above that are in disagreement with your claims and teachings here that have only been shared in love and as a help for you. If your unable to respond to the content of the linked posts and scriptures provided above perhaps you can pray about what is being shared with you?

    You take Care now.
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2022
  8. Ligurian

    Ligurian Other Sheep

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    Those are all from the gospel to the gentiles.

    "Did all the laws end at the cross?"

    According to the Gospel of the Kingdom... nope.

    Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till Heaven and Earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from (του)the Law, till all be fulfilled.

    Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the Commandments of God, and have the Testimony of Jesus Christ.
    και ωργισθη ο δρακων επι τη γυναικι και απηλθεν ποιησαι πολεμον μετα των λοιπων του σπερματος αυτης των τηρουντων τας εντολας του θεου και εχοντων την μαρτυριαν του ιησου χριστου

    Revelation 22:14
    Blessed are they that do His Commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.KJV
    μακαριοι οι ποιουντες τας εντολας αυτου ινα εσται η εξουσια αυτων επι το ξυλον της ζωης και τοις πυλωσιν εισελθωσιν εις την πολιν.
     
  9. Akita Suggagaki

    Akita Suggagaki Well-Known Member

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    John 10:16, KJV: And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

    For those outside the Jewish fold, Christ offers more.
     
  10. Akita Suggagaki

    Akita Suggagaki Well-Known Member

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    I am not so sure. But then who am I to say? The Catholic Church has judged and persecuted fringe groups with minority opinions for centuries. I am sorry to say.
     
  11. Clare73

    Clare73 Blood-bought

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    Jesus was speaking of the Gentiles.
     
  12. Akita Suggagaki

    Akita Suggagaki Well-Known Member

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    Of course. No need to turn Jewish in any way.
     
  13. Ligurian

    Ligurian Other Sheep

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    The Gospel of the Kingdom came from the Father

    Deuteronomy 18:18-19 [18] I will raise up to them a prophet of their brethren like thee, and I will put My words in His mouth, and He shall speak to them as I shall Command Him.[19] And whatever man shall not hearken to whatsoever words that Prophet shall speak in My name, I will take vengeance on him.LXX

    John 5:44-47 [43] I am come in My Father's name, and ye receive Me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

    John 8:26 I have many things to say and to judge of you, but He that sent Me is true, and I speak to the world those things which I have heard of Him.

    John 12:44-50 Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on Me, believeth not on Me but on Him that sent Me.[49] For I have not spoken from Myself: but the Father which sent Me, He gave Me a Commandment, what I should say and what I should speak.[50] And I know that His Commandment is Life Everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto Me, so I speak.

    John 14:24 He that loveth Me not keepeth not My words, and the word which ye hear is not Mine but the Father's which sent Me.[31] But that the world may know that I love the Father, and as the Father gave Me Commandment, even so, I do. Arise, let us go hence.

    John 15:10 If ye keep My Commandments ye shall abide in My love, even as I have kept My Father's Commandments and abide in His love.

    John 17:6-8 I have manifested thy name unto the men which Thou gavest Me out of the world: Thine they were, and Thou gavest them Me; and they have kept Thy word.[7] Now they have known that all things whatsoever Thou hast given Me are of Thee.[8] For I have given unto them the words which Thou gavest Me: and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from Thee, and they have believed that Thou didst send Me.
     
  14. Ligurian

    Ligurian Other Sheep

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    The kingdom is still divided: The house of Judah is not the house of Israel. Hosea 1:6-10 = 1 Peter 2:10 = the House of Israel, the 10-lost-tribes.

    The "other sheep" of the 10-lost-tribes are the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel.

    Matthew 10:5-7 [5] These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:[6] But go rather to the Lost Sheep of the house of Israel.[7] And as ye go, preach, saying, The Kingdom of Heaven is at hand.

    Matthew 15:24 But He answered and said, I am not sent but unto the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel.

    Who sent Jesus? The Father. So, the Father sent Jesus to the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel. Was this ever going to change? Nope. Because "all things whatsoever I have commanded you", includes Matthew 10:5-7.

    Matthew 28:16-20 Then The Eleven Disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them.[17] And when they saw Him, they worshipped Him, but some doubted.[18] And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto Me in Heaven and in Earth.[19] Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.[20] teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
     
  15. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Hi Lig nice to see you again.

    Once again you have providing nothing in this post that has anything to do with the post and topic you are quoting from. It is like you are posted a bunch of random scriptures together on an unrelated topic and are hoping for the best. So I do not really have a response to your post again because I do not know how what you have posted is relevant to what you are quoting from or why you think what you have written is relevant to my posts you are trying to respond to? Please see post # 498 linked; post # 499 linked; and post # 500 linked. Your post once again here is unresponsive and has nothing to do with the posts and the scriptures you are quoting from and do not address any of the posts or scripture content and contexts that disagree with your teachings. May you receive God's correction through His Word and be blessed ignoring it will not make it disappear according to the scriptures. According to Jesus the Words of God we accept or reject will become our judge come judgement day *see John 12:47-48. I hope only the best for you Lig. Take your time and review the scriptures and the context provided in the linked posts above that are in disagreement with your claims and teachings here that have only been shared in love and as a help for you. If your unable to respond to the content of the linked posts and scriptures provided above perhaps you can pray about what is being shared with you?

    You take Care now.
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2022
  16. Leaf473

    Leaf473 Well-Known Member

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    Numbers 18:21 To the children of Levi, behold, I have given all the tithe in Israel for an inheritance, in return for their service which they serve, even the service of the Tent of Meeting. 22 Henceforth the children of Israel shall not come near the Tent of Meeting, lest they bear sin, and die. 23 But the Levites shall do the service of the Tent of Meeting, and they shall bear their iniquity. It shall be a statute forever throughout your generations.

    Did this law end at the cross? I see that it's a statute, and from the OP it looks like the statutes have ended. On the other hand it's a tithing law, and earlier in the thread it sounded like tithing laws didn't end, so... ?
     
  17. expos4ever

    expos4ever Well-Known Member

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    Your argument appears to be that we no longer have to the animal sacrifices because Jesus sacrifice "took the place" of those animal sacrfices.

    Well, by the same logic, why keep the Sabbath since it is pretty clear that Jesus "takes the place" of the Sabbath just as much as He takes the place of the animal sacrifices:

    Come to Me, all who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest.

    Also, Jesus rises on the first day of a new week and initiates new creation - you would be hard pressed to deny that "new creation" is a major Pauline theme. Well, just as Jesus's sacrifice makes animal sacrifices obsolete, so it is also the case that Jesus's initiation of a new creation makes celebrating the "old" creation obsolete as well.
     
  18. expos4ever

    expos4ever Well-Known Member

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    Romans 5:13a

    for until the Law sin was in the world,

    Paul clearly believes sin was there before the Law.
     
  19. Clare73

    Clare73 Blood-bought

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    Nope. . .
     
  20. daq

    daq Messianic

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    Again, the same body-temple analogy mentioned in a different thread. Who are "one of these little ones" the Master speaks of multiple times in the Gospel accounts? If you ignore the man-made chapter breaks even Eleazar-Lazarus is "one of these little ones". Are you therefore a sheep or a porter?

    It's all there in the Testimony, O porter. : )
     
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