DeSantis carefully moves to end Trump dominance of GOP

[East of Eden]

Basically this.

I love it when conservatives try to use interstate migration as evidence that conservative policies are somehow better than liberal policies, because it shows they don't know what they're talking about.

For one thing: @East of Eden, you're wrong. Lots of people move to those states:
State-to-State Migration Flows

In 2019, about 255,000 people moved to NY; 132,000 to Michigan, 190,000 to Illinois; etc. Yes, those states had net negative migration (i.e. more people left), but a net negative doesn't mean nobody moved there. In terms of gross migration figures (i.e. not adjusted for inflation), NY was the 8th most popular destination state.

Last year, New Jersey, New York, Illinois, Connecticut, and California saw the highest proportion of outbound migration.

 

[East of Eden]

Actually, the Californians moving to Texas are having a good effect. Texas has been bluing for some time, and they are definitely helping that along.

It works the other way too. CA, the capital of homelessness and poverty, suffocating gas and income tax rates, lost a House seat for the first time in it's history due to the last census. FL and TX both gained.

 

[East of Eden]

Let's take a look. From your link...

Much of the press is concentrating on Horowitz’s conclusion that there was no evidence of “political bias or improper motivation” in the FBI’s probe of Donald Trump’s Russia contacts, an investigation Horowitz says the bureau had “authorized purpose” to conduct.

Yeah, that seems like an important thing, given all the fake stories about the FBI oppressing poor Vladimir Putin and his associates. But you were going to show us what allegation in the dossier proved to be false. You apparently forgot to do that. Let's take a look at just one...

A glimpse at Trump's actions over the last few decades shows a concerted effort by the real-estate mogul to lay a foundation for the Trump name in the heart of Moscow:

• Trump has shown a particularly keen interest in building a Trump Tower in Moscow.
• Last year, Michael Cohen, Trump's longtime former lawyer and fixer, admitted to prosecutors that the Trump Organization was actively pursuing the Trump Tower Moscow deal during the election.
• He said the company sought direct assistance from the Russian government in pushing it through.
• Cohen pleaded guilty to lying to Congress and is now cooperating with Mueller.

Prosecutors said in Cohen's charging document that in addition to exploring traveling to Russia to discuss getting the Russian government's backing for the Trump Tower Moscow deal, Cohen also asked Trump and a "senior campaign official" about the possibility of Trump himself going to Russia for business.

According to Cohen's plea agreement, in May 2016, the Russian-born businessman Felix Sater and Cohen discussed whether Trump's trip to Moscow should happen before or after the Republican National Convention in July. Cohen responded that he would head to Russia before the convention, and Trump would go after.

Over the next few days, Cohen and Sater discussed an invitation to Cohen from a Russian official — believed to be Dmitry Peskov, an aide to Putin — to attend the St. Petersburg Forum in June, at which the official said he would introduce him to Putin or Russian Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev. Cohen initially signaled that he was willing to go.

From June 9 to 14, Sater sent Cohen information about the event and travel, but Cohen met with Sater in the lobby of Trump Tower on June 14 and told him he would not go to Russia after all, the plea agreement said.
...
Around the same time Cohen was considering traveling to Russia, other Trump campaign officials were arranging a separate meeting with two Russian lobbyists offering dirt on Hillary Clinton's campaign.

Trump Jr. — along with Manafort, then the campaign chairman, and Jared Kushner, a senior adviser — met the lobbyists at Trump Tower on June 9.

Trump Jr. initially said the meeting had nothing to do with campaign business, but it later emerged that the meeting was pitched to him as "part of Russia and its government's support" for Trump's candidacy.
Grading the Steele dossier 2 years later: what’s been corroborated and what's still unclear



Actually, as you see... Manafort lost his job and was convicted of other crimes in the scandal. Flynn was convicted of lying to the FBI about his Russian contacts. And so on. There's quite a list in this scandal, but I don't see any of them who actually had anything to do with putting the dossier together.



As you probably know, Trump pardoned most of the criminals involved. It's his right as president to do that. Probably another reason he was fired by the voters.

Who, specifically, involved in writing the Steele dossier, do you think was fired, demoted, or found guilty of any crime?

I'm talking about the whole Russia matter in general, over 30 FBI/DOJ personnel were fired, demoted or took early retirement, the most prominent being McCabe, who was referred for criminal prosecution. Some involved even took out personal liability insurance in case they were ever sued for their conduct, I don't recall any Watergate or Whitewater investigators doing that. One of Mueller's team said they had a 'get Trump' attitude, well duh. These gross civil rights abuses were part of what enraged the 1/06 crowd. When people think a shady banana-republic style prosecution attempted to disenfranchise them, when they are censored on social media and called names, when we have a blatant two-tiered justice system, and when possible voter fraud can't even be questioned, what else are they to do? When riots happened last summer we were told we had to understand why there were doing so, it is no different here.

FBI Tragedy: Elites above the Law | National Review

Look, I don't think it is beneficial for me to continue these conversations, we aren't going to change anybody's mind. Politics has no eternal consequences, Jesus never told the government to do anything. The world was a screwed up place then, as it is now. The world will only be 'fixed' when He returns, anything else is idolatry. If the world could be corrected politically it would have been done by now. Instead, the greatest mass murders in history were done by political 'saviors'. Personally I find these dialogues only waste my time and energy and, and we all end up "hating and being hated" as the New Testament warns against. It only takes away from making money in my business, some of which goes to really advance the Kingdom and fulfill the great commission, unlike my involvement with this forum.

Although I could really use a mean tweet and $1.89 gas right about now, lol.

Have a good day everyone.

 

[probinson]

Link doesn't open.

It works for me, but here it is again;
https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...ing-unusual-about-floridas-excess-death-toll/

 

[The Barbarian]

Idaho, too. Looking over the stats, it seems the biggest influxes to Idaho have been from California and Washington. I wouldn't mind grabbing a couple more senate seats.

Texas is a bigger deal. As suburbs grow, and minorities become a larger and larger portion of the state's voters, it's an existential problem for republicans. Even worse for them, as they become more and more under the control of white nationalists and other far-right groups, the business community is shying away from them.

Business Coalitions Speak Out Against Voting Restrictions in Texas
Companies including HP, Microsoft and Unilever are calling for expanded voting access in the state after weeks of silence from national businesses on Republicans’ voting bills there.
Business Coalitions Speak Out Against Voting Restrictions in Texas

It's happening on a national level, too.
Inside the GOP's tense fallout with the big business lobby - CNNPolitics

Racism and far-right fascism are bad for business.

 

[East of Eden]

It works for me, but here it is again;
https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...ing-unusual-about-floridas-excess-death-toll/

Telling me I need a subscription, which isn't going to happen.

Look, I know you guys think Trump is the devil, millions of us thought the same of Obama, and Biden now. It is what it is.

 

[The Barbarian]

I'm talking about the whole Russia matter in general

We were talking about the dossier. As you know, no one has proven anything in it to be wrong, and we now know much of it was correct.

But yes, Manafort's corruption in helping Putin in Ukraine, Trump's national security advisor, Michael Flynn lying to the FBI about his contacts with Russian agents, and the Trump people meeting with Russian agents in Trump tower "to get dirt on Hillary Clinton" according to Donny Jr., are all major concerns, as was the effort by Trump's people to weaken the republican party platform on Ukraine, as Putin wished.

Small wonder Putin pulled out all the stops to help Trump be elected.

 

[The Barbarian]

Look, I know you guys think Trump is the devil

Trump just a mediocre grifter, who had the good fortune to be born very rich. The devil would be a lot more effective than Trump, who has failed at almost everything he's ever done, including the presidency.

millions of us thought the same of Obama

Just not enough of you. Obama continues to be held in high esteem by most Americans. Currently, a 57.2 approval rate average of all polls at Real Clear Politics.
RealClearPolitics - Election Other - President Obama Job Approval!

Trump never got close to that.

and Biden now.

He's doing a lot better than Trump, too. Unfortunately they didn't have polls in James Buchanan's time, so Trump is pretty much out there as the worst president in our lifetimes.

 

[East of Eden]

Texas is a bigger deal. As suburbs grow, and minorities become a larger and larger portion of the state's voters, it's an existential problem for republicans.

Not sure about that, the most latino county in TX near McAllen gave 45% of their vote to Trump, and they just elected a GOP mayor. Texas Republicans celebrate mayoral win in McAllen

Personally, I'm Puerto Rican, almost no Democrats in my family.

Even worse for them, as they become more and more under the control of white nationalists and other far-right groups, the business community is shying away from them.

Business Coalitions Speak Out Against Voting Restrictions in Texas
Companies including HP, Microsoft and Unilever are calling for expanded voting access in the state after weeks of silence from national businesses on Republicans’ voting bills there.
Business Coalitions Speak Out Against Voting Restrictions in Texas

It's happening on a national level, too.
Inside the GOP's tense fallout with the big business lobby - CNNPolitics

Racism and far-right fascism is bad for business.

There isn't any racism or fascism, other than from big tech censors. It is bad for the pro sports business, they have taken a big hit since becoming a mouthpiece for your party. It's hilarious, 75% of Georgians favor this common sense bill, you have to show a photo ID when picking up tickets at a pro game, or vote in a union election.

See Brett Favre Is Right. Pushing Politics Is Alienating Lots Of Pro Sports Fans

"A recent YouGov/Yahoo News poll showed that going woke is costing sports leagues a lot of fans. According to the survey, 34.5 percent said they were watching fewer sports because of leagues adopting leftist ideology. That’s three times as many as those who said it increased their likelihood of watching.

The same evidence was on display in the ratings for the NBA finals, which fell by 50 percent when compared to the previous season when BLM slogans did not dominate the screen.

Viewership of sports on TV is down across the board. But the attempt to claim that politics has nothing to do with it is contradicted by polls. One from Marist showed the increased political content has alienated almost a third of the potential audience and caused fans to look elsewhere for entertainment."

 

[East of Eden]

Trump just a mediocre grifter, who had the good fortune to be born very rich. The devil would be a lot more effective than Trump, who has failed at almost everything he's ever done, including the presidency.

I get you think that, IMHO he was one of the greatest presidents of my lifetime.

Just not enough of you. Obama continues to be held in high esteem by most Americans. Currently, a 57.2 approval rate average of all polls at Real Clear Politics.
RealClearPolitics - Election Other - President Obama Job Approval!

Trump never got close to that.

No wonder, Obama had 95%+ positive press from the corrupt media, Trump was the reverse.

 

[The Barbarian]

Texas is a bigger deal. As suburbs grow, and minorities become a larger and larger portion of the state's voters, it's an existential problem for republicans.

Not sure about that

Some very conservative people are, and are alarmed about it:

If the Republican Party doesn’t take drastic action, it will lose Texas to the Democratic Party faster than a sneeze through a screen door. The GOP has held the Lone Star State for decades, but there have been signs that their reign is coming to an end.

During last year’s midterm elections, Texans saw how close the Democrats are to becoming a dominant force in their politics. Indeed, many were completely convinced that Beto O’ Rourke would become the state’s next senator despite his blatant cultural appropriation. But now, there are more indicators that Texas might soon be saying “happy trails” to the GOP.
...
Texas has long been essential for the Republican Party when it comes to winning presidential elections. The state’s electoral votes have helped the GOP rival those of coastal states which typically favor Democratic candidates. Losing the Lone Star State would strike a death blow to the GOP’s ability to win the presidency in future elections. For this reason, it is crucial that the party reimagine its strategy. Otherwise, they might not win another presidential election. As Ted Cruz told The Christian Science Monitor, “If we lose Texas, it’s game over.”
Texas Turning Blue: Why the GOP is losing the Lone Star State

 

[The Barbarian]

I get you think that, IMHO he was one of the greatest presidents of my lifetime.

Problem is many more millions of Americans think he's the worst. And that still matters. As his many criminal and civil problems work through the courts in coming years, that's unlikely to improve.

No wonder, Obama had 95%+ positive press from the corrupt media,

I don't think that story is going to fly. A quick survey of newspapers and television outlets quickly debunks that story. In fact, the more partisan the media, the less likely they liked Obama.

 

[The Barbarian]

Rift, what rift? Trump says HE told Gov. DeSantis to stay in Miami and deal with condo collapse amid claims 2024 GOP rival told ex-president Florida rally was inappropriate after tragedy

• Florida governor DeSantis did not attend Donald Trump's rally in Sarasota on Saturday night
• It came amid reports that he had fallen out with DeSantis, a rising star of the Republican Party and possible 2024 rival
• DeSantis's office had reportedly 'made a direct plea' for Trump to call off his rally after the Surfside condo collapse in Miami
• The former president insisted he had told the governor to stay in Miami
• Trump said: 'I told him: "You should stay there, this is not that important for you"'
• Two weeks ago, DeSantis bested Trump 74-71 in the annual Western Conservative Summit's straw poll in Denver

Trump says HE told Gov. DeSantis to stay in Miami and deal with condo collapse amid rumors of rift | Daily Mail Online

For Trump, loyalty is strictly a one-way deal. And he doesn't like his lackeys getting big ideas.

 

[The Barbarian]

There isn't any racism or fascism, other than from big tech censors.

Americans disagree with you...

64 percent of Americans say racism remains a major problem
Poll: 64 percent of Americans say racism remains a major problem

It is bad for the pro sports business, they have taken a big hit since becoming a mouthpiece for your party.

There are a few libertarian owners, but most tend to support republicans. Someone really led you astray there. The only reason they objected to voter suppression tactics, is because it was good business to do so.

 

[The Barbarian]

When sports fans are asked to describe the viewing impact of athletes’ calls for racial justice, 70% of Republicans say they are less likely to watch live sports for this reason. Meanwhile, 61% of Democrats and a plurality of Independents (47%) say athletes speaking out has not changed their viewing habits, while about 3 in 10 (31% and 24%, respectively) say this is the reason for tuning in more often. In fact, 27% of Black sports fans say they are watching live sports broadcasts more as a result, significantly more than White fans (17%).
Marist Center for Sports Communication/Marist Poll Results & Analysis | Home of the Marist Poll

It's another example of the ongoing withdrawal of the extreme right from American values and institutions. Seems like a bad choice to me, but then I still like Chick-fil-A, in spite of the lack of American values among their major stockholders.

Go figure. Cancel culture is pretty much its own punishment, far as I can see.

 

[probinson]

Telling me I need a subscription, which isn't going to happen.

If I open the link on my phone, I can read it. If I try to open it on my computer, it prompts for a subscription. Just an FYI.

Look, I know you guys think Trump is the devil,

I don't think Trump is the devil, and I have no idea who "you guys" are or where that came from. I am a former lifelong republican, now a registered independent as of 2 years ago. However, I do believe Trump did immense damage to the Republican Party, and it would behoove the party to find a new frontman.

 

[The Barbarian]

One from Marist showed the increased political content has alienated almost a third of the potential audience and caused fans to look elsewhere for entertainment."

Here's another one... from Marist:
A new poll shows almost half of Americans believe the country is heading in the right direction.

Forty-seven percent of respondents in a PBS News-Hour NPR Marist Poll said so. That's the highest number in the past 12 years.
Poll: 47% say country headed in the right direction

 

[9Rock9]

Not a guess. From the conversation with my mother, she said the reason she could never register as an independent was because "I might vote for a democrat one day." This goes to show you that there are some people (quite a few actually) who vote straight ticket. They've already decided that the Republican Party = GOOD! and the Democratic Party = BAD! regardless of who is running.



You didn't? You said;

...considering that there are, in the Republican Party, many other people in leadership to choose from...​

That sure sounded to me like you were suggesting there were far better choices for the Republican Party than Trump.



Yep. A lot of people have great disdain for typical politicians, and that is likely why they continue to support him. It's probably why some of my neighbors are already flying flags that say TRUMP 2024: NO MORE BS. It boggles my mind that people believe that, but here we are.



But the Democrats severely underestimated how much people disliked Hillary. There were many people that voted for Trump because he wasn't Hillary. Just like there were many people who voted for Biden because he wasn't Trump.

But the question now is, why do they still stand behind Trump since he's not the President anymore? I honestly have no idea.

They like what he represents. They're fed up with the establishment, and he's an outsider who shook things up. Biden is seen as a continuation of the neo-liberal establishment.

Trump supporters see the mainstream media as the kingmakers of the elections, and for once, the kingmakers didn't get their king.

Some of it is anger over how he was treated by the media and the Democratic Party, and how they feel he was never given a fair chance.

 

[EDMOMD]

South Africa is now going into some difficult times everywhere. It will help to have people praying for our country as this is the weakest and dark time for South Africa


His frequent appearances on Fox News put him in the national spotlight almost nightly. Last weekend, DeSantis beat Trump 74-71 in the annual Western Conservative Summit’s straw poll in Denver — results that surprised even organizers of the summit. Last year, Trump won the same straw poll with nearly 95 percent support.
...
The governor’s backers say he is aware of the dangers of appearing to rise too quickly. One Republican consultant close to the governor, who spoke on condition of anonymity to speak freely about DeSantis and Trump, said the governor is “very wary” of eliciting the former president’s rage.
...
Trump is scheduled to hold a campaign-style rally on July 3 in Sarasota, Fla., one of a series of public events aimed at boosting the former president’s standing ahead of a possible 2024 presidential run. A Trump official planning the Florida rally told POLITICO that DeSantis’ team was contacted about the rally, but the governor’s office did not return a request seeking comment about whether or not he will be attending.
DeSantis ‘very wary’ of upsetting Trump[/QUOTE]

 

[The Barbarian]

They like what he represents. They're fed up with the establishment, and he's an outsider who shook things up. Biden is seen as a continuation of the neo-liberal establishment.

That would seem to conflict with the fact that Biden's approval rate is far about Trump's. And the percent of people thinking the country is going in the right direction is the largest since Obama.