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Depart from Me...I don't understand

Discussion in 'Requests for Christian Advice' started by Hopeful37, Jul 4, 2020.

  1. Hopeful37

    Hopeful37 Active Member

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    why does Jesus say "Depart from Me" if works/obedience don't have a part to play in salvation? The people who He was speaking to "cast of devils" etc which means they had faith.


    Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
    Matthew 7:21‭-‬23 KJV
    Matthew 7:21-23 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we n | King James Version (KJV) | Download The Bible App Now

    Can someone help me understand?

    I've read that it's unbelievers He was talking about but how can these people be unbelievers if they do these acts? It takes faith to do these things.
     
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  2. Richard T

    Richard T Well-Known Member

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    I think a clue to your question can be found here. Matthew 12:26-27 (KJV)
    26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? 27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges. Also, false prophets I do not think are always wrong, they just are not speaking from God.
     
  3. CaspianSails

    CaspianSails Well-Known Member

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    He is talking, as it says to people He does not know. He says, I never knew you. In the preceding verses He is talking about fruit, good fruit and bad fruit. He also talks about doing the will of His Father. I think this is the key. These two things. What is fruit? We know that a tree which does not produce fruit is useless. If you look at this in conjunction with the parable of the three stewards and the fact the one steward buried what was given him and he was rejected this is the same thing. Christians are to bear fruit. This is followed by doing the will of the Father. If we do the will of the Father then we will bear fruit. If we do our own will, even with faith, we do not bear good fruit. Some teach false messages and while they have fruit it is not good fruit. The question then becomes how do we know the will of the Father. We cannot see Him. God is always at work around us it is our responsibility to look for where He is working and join Him in that work. God is not interested in joining us in our work only in us joining Him in his work. We seek Him to know what He is doing and how we can join Him. He will show you.
     
  4. thecolorsblend

    thecolorsblend If God is your Father, who is your Mother? Supporter

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    I think the answer is in the question.

    "... but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in Heaven."
     
  5. Tradidi

    Tradidi Member

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    From the Haydock Bible Commentary:

    Ver. 21. Here Jesus Christ shews, that it is not sufficient to believe in him and hear his words, but that in order to [obtain] salvation, we must join works with faith; for in this shall we be examined at the last day. (Menochius) — Without faith they could not cry out, Lord, Lord. (Romans x.) But the strongest faith without the works of justice, will not be available to salvation. (1 Corinthians xiii.) (Bristow) — Many who have the lord continually in their mouths, but care little about putting on the Lord, or penetrating themselves with his true spirit, will find their presumption, and the false consciences they have made to themselves, woefully disappointed. (Haydock)

    Ver. 22. Have not we prophesied in thy name? The gift of prophecy, and of doing miracles, may sometimes be granted to bad men, as to Caiphas, and Balaam. (Witham) — Under the name of prophets, the Hebrews comprised not only such as predicted future events, but also in general all such as gave themselves out for inspired, or who undertook teaching and interpreting the holy Scriptures; and here by prophesying is understood, in a general acceptation, all public functions, predicting futurity, expounding Scripture, instructing the people, preaching, &c. (Bible de Vence)

    Ver. 23. So as to approve and reward your works. Here he shews that even prophecy and miracles will not save us without good works. (Menochius) — How much less will faith, unassisted by good works, preserve us from condemnation. (Haydock) — the gift of miracles is bestowed on men not for their own good, but for the advantage of others. We must not then be surprised if men, who had indeed faith in Christ, but whose lives did not correspond with their faith, should be honoured with these extraordinary gifts, since the Almighty sometimes employs as his instruments in working similar wonders, men destitute both of faith and virtue. Balaam, void of faith and probity, still by the will of God, prophesied for the advantage of others. To Pharao and Nabuchodonosor were revealed future events of the greatest moment; and the wicked Judas himself cast out devils. Therefore St. Paul said, “if I had all faith so as to remove mountains, and if I knew all mysteries, and was possessed of all wisdom, but had not charity, I am nothing.” (St. Chrysostom, Hom. xv.)​

    In short, faith without works is dead and a dead faith will not save us.
     
  6. Jeshu

    Jeshu Bought by His Blood Supporter

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    It is quiet simple really. If you have never sought after a personal relationship with Jesus - The Word Of God in Spirit of love - then you will not do the will of God either, which is to love God and neighbour, and to believe in the man He send - His Son Jesus Christ.

    To do God's will is to love God above all, and our neighbour as ourselves. When we have a personal relationship with Christ then we will go to Him in our inabilities and walk away with His ability. That is what loving Jesus is all about. That is how we learn to love and respect Him. He does as He says.

    Follow the truth of Scripture in the Spirit of love and you will always arrive Home. Follow the truth of Scripture the spirit of fear, doubt, shame and guilt and you will never be good enough. It are these realities we need to repent of. For it is the truth that sets us free.

    Peace.
     
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  7. A_Thinker

    A_Thinker Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Matthew 7

    21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

    22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy by thy name, and by thy name cast out demons, and by thy name do many mighty works?

    23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

    Jesus says, ... unreservedly, that HE KNOWS HIS SHEEP. These claimants that stand before Him on judgement day, ... He says He NEVER knew.

    John 10

    14 I am the good shepherd; and I know My sheep, and am known by My own. 15 As the Father knows Me, even so I know the Father; and I lay down My life for the sheep.

    Surely you've witnessed the claimants to Christ who use trickery and deceit to obtain worldly gain from their followers. Jesus spoke to such as these in Matthew chapter 6. Jesus says that these have already received their reward from men, ... and that they should not expect anything further from the Father.

    In the Old Testament, God sent word to the Israelites ... to STOP their fakery of false piety to Him on worship days, ... only to return to their lives of greed and debauchery on non-worship days.

    God's will is that we KNOW ... and BELIEVE Him. He is not interested in lives of pretended obeisance ... His will is that we allow Him to TRANSFORM us into His children ... per our BELIEF in His Son.

    John 8

    28 Then they said to Him, “What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?”

    29 Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”

    Our works do not save us ... because our works cannot bring us into (or sustain) our relationship with Christ.

    OTOH, entering into relationship with Christ (through belief) WILL CHANGE US ... so that the works that we do will flow from a heart that has been transformed to be like that of the Father.
     
  8. St_Worm2

    St_Worm2 Simul Justus et Peccator Supporter

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    Hello Hopeful37, the folks in v22 were not Christians, no matter what their claim and/or belief about themselves may have been in this life. We also know that they did not do the mighty works that they claimed to have done (in Jesus' name/by His power), because the Lord Jesus tells them plainly, "I NEVER knew you" (v23).

    Our knowing Him, and His knowing us is absolutely necessary if we hope to know and accomplish His will for us (of course) .. e.g. 1 Corinthians 1:18, 2:14, but it is vital for a number of other reasons as well, yes?

    John 17
    3 This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.

    Perhaps they were deceived into believing they were Christians in this life, or they may have simply been deceivers making a last ditch effort to escape the Lake of Fire. Sadly, it seems that the church is filled with CINO (Christians In Name Only), "tares" who are deceived and/or deceivers .. e.g. Matthew 13:24-30, 36-43.

    That said, those in v22 trusted in ~their~ works to save them, rather than believing/trusting in the ~only~ works that could (save them), the works that were done on our behalf by the Lord Jesus Christ. He is therefore our only innocence, our only righteousness, and the only atonement and satisfaction for our sins, and for His Father's wrath .. Romans 5:8-10; 2 Corinthians 5:21.

    God bless you!

    --David

    John 6
    29 Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent.”

    Romans 4
    5 To the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness.

    2 Corinthians 5
    21 He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2020
  9. Mountainmanbob

    Mountainmanbob Goat Whisperer Supporter

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    They were not ones that the
    Father had given to Him.

    His sheep hear his voice.
    They had not the ability.

    M
     
  10. tturt

    tturt Senior Veteran Supporter

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    For your consideration. By reading the rest of Matt 7, it means they didnt love Christ, the rock, and hold His sayings, His commandments in their hearts and minds (I COR 10:4). They had never come to Him. "Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself." Matt 22:37-39.
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2020
  11. Maria Billingsley

    Maria Billingsley Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The only way to do the will of the Father is to be filled with His Holy Spirit. The flesh is weak and unable. Many who say they are Christians do not have the Holy Spirit, therefore Jesus Christ of Nazareth can not be their advocate. Be blessed.
     
  12. longwait

    longwait Well-Known Member

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    Read the verses before the ones you quoted.

    “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them. Matthew 7:15-20

    By these words Jesus is saying that having the fruit of the Holy Spirit is more important than having the gifts of the Holy Spirit. All the works they did came from gifts. But their fruits were rotten. Their heart was sinful. Our heart intent should be pure. We need to be really careful about our hearts.
     
  13. Hopeful37

    Hopeful37 Active Member

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    Thank u for all responses.
     
  14. Justified_By_Christ_Alone

    Justified_By_Christ_Alone Member

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    You answered your own question. What will those people be boasting in on judgement day? Their works... "Didn't we do wonderful works in your name". It doesn't say on judgement day people will be saying "Lord Lord didn't we trust solely in your name?". If God asks you why you should enter into heaven unbelievers will reply with "I". Believers will reply with "Jesus" because it's about what he did, not what we do. So to answer your question, the people who will hear this are the religious pharisees who have not trusted in Jesus alone but trusted partly in their works to save them as well. These people were never saved, they were simply religious and believed in works-based salvation.
     
  15. Justified_By_Christ_Alone

    Justified_By_Christ_Alone Member

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    The will of the Father is to believe on the Son. Scripture says this directly, there is no confusion here.

    John 6:40
    "And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day."
     
  16. Tradidi

    Tradidi Member

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    If you mean "The will of the Father is to believe on the Son and then do whatever you like..", you think like Luther and every other Protestant after him.

    If you mean "The will of the Father is to believe on the Son and then do whatever He tells you..", you think like a Catholic.
     
  17. Tradidi

    Tradidi Member

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    From Steve Ray's book, Crossing the Tiber:

    How does one receive salvation, justification, new birth and eternal life?

    By believing in Christ (Jn 3:16; Acts 16:31)?
    By repentance (Acts 2:38; 2 Pet 3:9)?
    By baptism (Jn 3:5; 1 Pet 3:21; Titus 3:5)?
    By the work of the Spirit (Jn 3:5; 2 Cor 3:6)?
    By declaring with our mouths (Lu 12:8; Rom 10:9)?
    By coming to a knowledge of the Truth (1 Tim 2:4; Heb 10:26)?
    By maintaining the faith (Col 1:22-23; Mt 24:13)?
    By works (John 5:28-29; Rom 2:6, 7; James 2:24)?
    By grace (Acts 15:11; Eph 2:8)?
    By His blood (Rom 5:9; Heb 9:22)?
    By His righteousness (Rom 5:17; 2 Pet 1:1)?
    By His cross (Eph 2:16; Col 2:14)?

    Can we cut any one of these out of the list and proclaim it alone as the means of salvation? Can we be saved without faith? without God's grace? without repentance? without baptism? without the Spirit? These are all involved and necessary; not one of them can be dismissed as a means of obtaining eternal life.

    Neither can one be emphasized to the exclusion of another. They are all involved in salvation and entry into the Church. The Catholic Church does not divide these various elements of salvation up, overemphasizing some while ignoring others; rather she holds them all in their fullness.
     
  18. Justified_By_Christ_Alone

    Justified_By_Christ_Alone Member

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    I just follow the scripture and what it says directly. It is clear what you must do to be saved.. Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ as Paul said. It's simple yet unfortunately many people don't obey the gospel and add to it.
     
  19. FutureAndAHope

    FutureAndAHope Just me Supporter

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    It may be a warning to his followers. Like Judas, Judas worked with Jesus, and I am sure he performed a miracle or two. But Judas's love was money, and he stole from the money bag. Eventually his sin overcame the light and he rejected Jesus for the love of money.

    Luke 12:45-46 But and if that servant say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to beat the menservants and maidens, and to eat and drink, and to be drunken; The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.

    We can be a servant of Jesus, perform signs, even cast out devils. But if we are not cultivating a good heart, a heart of obedience, we may end up denying Jesus, and replacing His truth, with sin down the track.

    So a person can say "LORD, LORD" ... but end up in the departed state, for the love of their sin.

    Also beware not to become critical, as some do, of people who perform signs. For the bible says:

    Mar 9:38-41 And John answered him, saying, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name, and he followeth not us: and we forbad him, because he followeth not us. But Jesus said, Forbid him not: for there is no man which shall do a miracle in my name, that can lightly speak evil of me. For he that is not against us is on our part. For whosoever shall give you a cup of water to drink in my name, because ye belong to Christ, verily I say unto you, he shall not lose his reward.

    Those who are currently performing signs in Jesus name are doing God's work. They will not loose their reward. As the bible says they can not soon after performing a sign speak evil of Jesus.

    Yet they too have the same warning, as do all people, don't sin, least it overcome you, and you loose your reward.
     
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2020
  20. Justified_By_Christ_Alone

    Justified_By_Christ_Alone Member

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    Actually you can be a servant of Christ but not be a believer... That's the point. It has nothing to do with obedience to the law. A person can be a very "good person" extremely religious and follow Jesus but does that mean they are saved? Not if they attach it to salvation... Salvation is not about being a servant, it's about being a believer. If you have believed Jesus really did pay for all your sins on the cross and none of your works which are like filthy rags are added to it you are a real believer. Unfortunately many religious people will be surprised on judgement day because they have not fully trusted in Jesus alone for their salvation, they trusted partly in how obedient they were, how remorseful and how good their heart is, how many sins they've repented of and turned away from, how many works they've done... Trusting in any of that to save you and not Jesus alone makes you lost. Religion doesn't save, Jesus saves. Your works don't save, Jesus saves. That's the point of the verse in Matthew. The reason Jesus calls them workers of inequity is because sin is still on their account because they never got saved because they trusted in their works "didn't we do many wonderful works in your name" rather than the finished work of Christ alone.
     
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