Defending Orthodoxy - My Response to J.D. Hall

Light of the East

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Although I am not totally there yet, having my body still in an "Orthodox in Communion with Rome" parish, I will nonetheless tolerate no trashing of the faith which Christ left with the Apostles.

While hardly on the par of the apologia of men such as Fr. Thomas Hopko, or the many saints of Orthodoxy, when I read Mr. Hall's vituperative and ill-tempered screed regarding the wonderful conversion of Hank Hanegraaf to the true faith, I felt compelled to produce an answer.

If you feel that I have erred in any place, please bring it to my attention.

A Response to Pulpit & Pen
 

AMM

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I listened to a presentation from a hieromonk last week (Seraphim Aldea, I believe). He said this and it resonated with me then, and now as I read your response: "I actually think focusing on contemporary issues of any kind is a big mistake... when you focus exclusively on the social issues, the political issues, the economic issues, it doesn't really work, because the Church is here to tell us about one thing only, and that is that through Christ we have a chance at life eternal."

He then goes on to talk about prayer, which he says is the most important thing, far more important than engaging in debate and polemics. Sure, there is a place to speak with others. Neither I nor Hieromonk Seraphim are saying everyone should become hermits. But what is gained by this post? I'm not judging you for doing so -- heck, I'm essentially doing the same thing now on your thread by posting this -- but just wondering about the purpose behind this
 
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RobNJ

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Oh.. Light... You're doing it again!
You need to immerse your self in Orthodoxy, MUCH more than you need to spend your time reading, debating with, and getting serious agita over the heterodox... It will be much better for your spiritual well being

IF you feel have an uncontrollable compulsion to find arguments,.,, Go to Facebook, and start in with politics ;)
 
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Light of the East

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Why do you feel compelled to answer? I don’t need to know, but meditating on the answer might help you.

I am here today, believing in Orthodox theology and waiting for the green light to go from the Lord precisely because when I was posting my Calvinist diatribes against the Church, some people enlightened me out of my ignorance in the same manner - debate. Mr. Hall and his ilk are in darkness and need someone to respond to them. I am a writer. I have won awards for my writing and have been published in a national magazine. It's what I do. It's my gift, and I intend to use it without apology.

I have prayed for Mr. Hall, that his eyes be opened. May my efforts help to achieve this if God will use them.
 
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ArmyMatt

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I am here today, believing in Orthodox theology and waiting for the green light to go from the Lord precisely because when I was posting my Calvinist diatribes against the Church, some people enlightened me out of my ignorance in the same manner - debate. Mr. Hall and his ilk are in darkness and need someone to respond to them. I am a writer. I have won awards for my writing and have been published in a national magazine. It's what I do. It's my gift, and I intend to use it without apology.

I have prayed for Mr. Hall, that his eyes be opened. May my efforts help to achieve this if God will use them.

I still gotta ask, you didn't send it to him did you?
 
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ArmyMatt

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Okay, I went back and re-read it. It has .....shall we say, a bit of "tone" to it, n'est ce pas?

I probably should have waited a day or two before responding.

no, there should have been no response. JD Hall at best will just delete what you sent, and at worst will just trash us and rant about Orthodoxy again.
 
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Light of the East

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no, there should have been no response. JD Hall at best will just delete what you sent, and at worst will just trash us and rant about Orthodoxy again.

If I had been treated that way, I would still be Protestant today. I'm rather glad someone kindly but firmly got in my face and corrected my distortions. The best thing I can do for Mr. Hall now is to pray for enlightenment for him, just as it happened to me. (And I was very, VERY anti-Catholic/Orthodox)
 
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ArmyMatt

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If I had been treated that way, I would still be Protestant today. I'm rather glad someone kindly but firmly got in my face and corrected my distortions. The best thing I can do for Mr. Hall now is to pray for enlightenment for him, just as it happened to me. (And I was very, VERY anti-Catholic/Orthodox)

yes, that's you. you're not him. Hall's "ministry" makes it's money through conflict. that's why he's so abrasive. responding to his nonsense just gives him what he wants.
 
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TheLostCoin

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Although I am not totally there yet, having my body still in an "Orthodox in Communion with Rome" parish, I will nonetheless tolerate no trashing of the faith which Christ left with the Apostles.

While hardly on the par of the apologia of men such as Fr. Thomas Hopko, or the many saints of Orthodoxy, when I read Mr. Hall's vituperative and ill-tempered screed regarding the wonderful conversion of Hank Hanegraaf to the true faith, I felt compelled to produce an answer.

If you feel that I have erred in any place, please bring it to my attention.

A Response to Pulpit & Pen

Light of the East,
Although I'm not Orthodox yet (due to some circumstances, I've decided to delay my Reception into the Church), I can warn you immensely - DO NOT engage in materials that will needlessly anger you.

Unless it's of necessity (which you should determine by your conscience and talking with your Priest), it is my experience that it will be to your spiritual detriment to do so.

It's only the Devil playing with your pride, giving you the illusion that God has appointed you prophet

Believe me - having gone through a small Traditional Catholic phase, there is a lot of material produced by adherents of that movement that needlessly filled my heart with anger and pure malice towards Roman Catholicism and their adherents, as well as people in Orthodoxy who are more enthusiastic towards Ecumenism (the video "What we have lost and the Road to Restoration" comes to mind), and even now I still suffer the consequences of it (to the point that I'm banned on OBOB through my own pride) - even though I had no reason to engage in those specific materials in the first place, even given the place I was at at the time.
 
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Light of the East

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Light of the East,
Although I'm not Orthodox yet (due to some circumstances, I've decided to delay my Reception into the Church), I can warn you immensely - DO NOT engage in materials that will needlessly anger you.

Unless it's of necessity (which you should determine by your conscience and talking with your Priest), it is my experience that it will be to your spiritual detriment to do so.

It's only the Devil playing with your pride, giving you the illusion that God has appointed you prophet

Believe me - having gone through a small Traditional Catholic phase, there is a lot of material produced by adherents of that movement that needlessly filled my heart with anger and pure malice towards Roman Catholicism and their adherents, as well as people in Orthodoxy who are more enthusiastic towards Ecumenism (the video "What we have lost and the Road to Restoration" comes to mind), and even now I still suffer the consequences of it (to the point that I'm banned on OBOB through my own pride) - even though I had no reason to engage in those specific materials in the first place, even given the place I was at at the time.

Pride is always something that is on my mind in regards to my spiritual walk. It is a known danger to me and something that I have more than once confessed to my priest.

Do I allow myself to not wield the sword of truth simply because I may not be handling it with the best of intentions, sloppily, or with pride? It is an exercise in learning for me to write these things because I learn how to be in forums and debate without rancor. If you could see some of the things I wrote 20 years ago, you would understand what I am talking about here.

I can say that I didn't so much feel anger as a desire to put forth a correction. Why? Because one of the things that Protestantism does to its adherents is to keep them in the dark. In 25 years of dedicated Protestantism, I never once heard about the Early Fathers of the Church. My only reference to any of those who came before me was limited quotes from St. Augustine which support the doctrines of Calvinism. It wasn't until I was challenged and began to actually read that which the Early Fathers had said that I began to realize that I had been theologically duped.

I think, therefore, that it is necessary if we are to bring people out of their errors, to attempt to state the truth, just as was done for me. I don't know Mr. Hall personally. He may have read the Early Fathers of the Church, he may have had someone discuss with him Orthodox Liturgy and the symbolism and he may have rejected it all.

And on the other hand, maybe he has been trained by people who, like I was, have kept him in the dark.

I do appreciate your concern for my spiritual state, and it is well-founded, but I will never learn to be humble in a vacuum. In contests, one goes in and engages the opponent, then goes back and after the fray, assesses what happened. The wise man sees his mistakes and learns from them, then enters the fray again, seeking to do better this time.

I think, however, that given your concern, which is valid, I shall run this by my spiritual director. Thanks!
 
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