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Defending a religious person...

Discussion in 'Ethics & Morality' started by Hestha, Jan 30, 2013.

  1. Lee M

    Lee M Well-Known Member

    +7
    Deist
    Single
    and you trying to troll me
     
  2. Lee M

    Lee M Well-Known Member

    +7
    Deist
    Single
    LOL... the mormons know more than you.... :D
     
  3. Tomk80

    Tomk80 Titleless

    +384
    Agnostic
    I'd say you have basically conceded Lee M's original claim here. Remember, his original claim was that "the average atheist" is more knowledgeable about Christianity than the "average theist". Note that Lee M never claimed that certain subgroups might not be more knowledgeable.

    The explanation you give is also the explanation given by the researchers, that atheists in the US come from a Christian culture, and therefore probably have to be more informed than the average "cultural Christian", because they are the ones to have their beliefs questioned.

    Now, of course this does not show which side is correct or not. It at best shows that atheists are very much aware of the arguments in favor of God put forward by your average theist. You may find the arguments by the average atheist on message boards unconvincing, but that may just mean that the arguments by the average theist are even less convincing. Note that not very many people have an active interest of theology or philosophy, especially when it comes to the somewhat more complicated arguments for and against God. Even among those who know those arguments, there are quite a few who just regurgitate them without thinking.

    Now, your contention about the arguments from atheists against God being underwhelming and unimpressive I'd say is at the least up to grabs. I personally am not convinced that by the answers to atheist arguments provided by Aquinas and Augustine. For example, while I definitely admire Aquinas for so deftly demonstrating the total poppycock that is the ontological argument, I find his arguments in favor of God very far from convincing. Philosophers have given detailed answers to these arguments in following centuries that show why these arguments fall flat. You are of course allowed to disagree, but it seems to me that the measure of this should be the arguments proposed in favor and against as explained at their best, not as explained on a forum.
     
  4. Verv

    Verv Senior Veteran

    +574
    United States
    Eastern Orthodox
    In Relationship
    US-Republican
    Lee, you lost some composure there.

    To some extent there was a concession but sometimes we have to have... integrity. Even in an internet debate.

    Well, no, not really.

    I think the average Christian puts forward no coherent responses and that the average atheist has a total misunderstanding of theology and science.

    Basically, I think the average level of debate is so low it is not even worthy of commentary.

    Let it be put on the record: I do not even have faith in democracy for very similar reasons.

    None of the arguments are new. Our minds are already made up.

    It is, frankly, half silly that we are even discussing it. But I get some amount of entertainment doing this.
     
  5. Lee M

    Lee M Well-Known Member

    +7
    Deist
    Single
    :D JEJEJEJEJEJEJEJEEEEEE so funny...
     
  6. Tomk80

    Tomk80 Titleless

    +384
    Agnostic
    :)

    Theology? Perhaps. Science, I disagree. At least on the forums I frequent. I'd say that on this forum (the physical sciences part) many atheists show a quite good understanding of science. In general on the internet, I would agree with you.

    And I do agree to some extent on your faith in democracy. Pity I haven't come up with a better system yet :)

    I agree to some extent. When I began discussing this I did come across a lot of new arguments and the learning curve was quite steep. That edged of after a year or so.
     
  7. Belk

    Belk Senior Member Supporter

    +6,432
    Agnostic
    Married
    I find it humorous that a thread on defending people of faith has devolved into a general free for all. ^_^
     
  8. FrenchyBearpaw

    FrenchyBearpaw Take time for granite.

    +64
    Atheist
    Married
    Atheists, continuously underwhelmed and unimpressed with your evidence for a god/s since the 7th grade.
     
  9. Catherineanne

    Catherineanne Well-Known Member

    +4,395
    United Kingdom
    Anglican
    Widowed
    What kind of God do you think would provide easy evidence for his existence, at the same time as putting a premium on faith?

    Once again, this is underestimating how big the Deity really is. :)
     
  10. FrenchyBearpaw

    FrenchyBearpaw Take time for granite.

    +64
    Atheist
    Married
    The kind of god who wouldn't be so hard to find and puts a premium on easing pain and suffering.

    What's so important about faith?

    But then again, maybe he's just too big to really care.
     
  11. seeking Christ

    seeking Christ Guest

    +0
    :confused: Your Inquisition did not revolve around said creed, and therefore the contents of your post here are irrelevant. I was talking about the same things you were - why move the goalposts?

    The comment from the Church of the East is perfectly relevant because it says what you said they would never say, and corroborated my point you disagreed with. Non Salvific things can be forfeited for Unity, filioque included, because at the end of the day it just doesn't affect our daily life.

    Perhaps faith and religion are not synonyms after all ...
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 8, 2013
  12. Verv

    Verv Senior Veteran

    +574
    United States
    Eastern Orthodox
    In Relationship
    US-Republican
    I have never seen a conflict between religion and science.

    Some massive gross misunderstanding of theology committed by primarily Baptists in the American south is responsible for this giant debacle where we have STEM pinheads inserting themselves into what traditionally has always been a philosophical/theological discussion.

    I have never contended that the Bible is a scientific book; nor have I ever consulted the Bible for answers on science.

    But I am glad you are similarly laughing at democracy. :)


    I know. You can bring a horse to water but you can't make him drink.

    I think you are misunderstanding a lot of basic Christian concepts...

    First, part of our reason to be here would be the easing of pain and suffering as acts of charity and, second, suffering and pain are edifying.

    Third, our temporary time in this physical form is irrelevant in the timespan of infinity.

    Fourth, faith is important for the same reason that your teacher's do not give you the answer key when you take a test...

    But, then again, you are probably just willfully ignorant of all of these points.:thumbsup:
     
  13. FrenchyBearpaw

    FrenchyBearpaw Take time for granite.

    +64
    Atheist
    Married
    ^_^ As if you ever had any water.

    As for your stupid comment regarding pain being edifying, I call BS. Tell that to the millions of children who will go to bed tonight without eating or clean drinking water. Mighty swell god you swoon over.
     
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