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Featured Debating the Existence of the Pre-Trib Rapture

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by Matisyahu8898, Oct 19, 2017.

  1. Truth7t7

    Truth7t7 Newbie

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    Bout time we got a hit, over the fence!
     
  2. jgr

    jgr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Keras, brother, what Israel did or did not do in or with the land is not the issue. The issue is whether God fulfilled His part of the covenant of Genesis 15:18.

    He did.
     
  3. Truth7t7

    Truth7t7 Newbie

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    [QUOTEqueost: 71987801, member: 324545"]Wrong.
    In the Millennium Kingdom on earth there will still be death. Isaiah 65:20
    Only after the Millennium, after the Great White Throne Judgement, will Death be no more. Revelation 21:1-7
    But in actual fact, Ezekiel 40 to 48 prophesies about the time before Jesus Returns. The time that all the faithful Christians will live as God always wanted His people to be. Ezekiel 34:11-16, Isaiah 35:1-10, Romans 9:24-26, Revelation 7:1-14[/QUOTE]
    The claim is Ezekiel Chapter 47 is the "Eternal Kingdom" :)

    Millennialist falsely teach this, to be so?

    100% False, as Ezekiel Chapter 47 is the eternal kingdom :)

    Isaiah Chapter 65 is also the "Eternal Kingdom"
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
  4. keras

    keras Writer of Bible prophecy studies.

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    No, the 1000 year Millennium is a Bible truth. Stated 6 times in Revelation 20.
    It is the Seventh 1000 year period, that will constitute the Sabbath of the previous 6000 years of mankind. And as we are now at 5988 years since Adam, we have not long to wait!
     
  5. keras

    keras Writer of Bible prophecy studies.

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    Yes, maybe Ezekiel 47 is about the Eternal state. We shall see in due course.
     
  6. Truth7t7

    Truth7t7 Newbie

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    There is no earthly kingdom found in Revelation 20:1-6, you can try to build one, ain't there :)

    Angel, Heaven, Devil/Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ, 100% Spiritual Realm :)

    The 1000 Year Earthly Millennial Kingdom Is A "Zionist Fairy Tale", Found No Place In The Scripture :)
     
  7. keras

    keras Writer of Bible prophecy studies.

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    Yes God fulfilled His promise to the ancient Israelites. They failed to fulfil their part and as a consequence, took to worshipping false idols and God threw them out of the Land. Twice now; Judah has returned to a part of the holy Land, but always in apostasy.
    The Day will soon come when the Lord Himself will clear and cleanse all the holy Land. Deuteronomy 32:34-43. Zephaniah 1:14-18, +, and then the Lord's righteous people, all faithful, born again Christians, will migrate there and live as Children of the Living God. Romans 9:24-26
     
  8. keras

    keras Writer of Bible prophecy studies.

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    But it is plainly stated in Revelation 5:9-10 ...they shall reign on earth.
    Why do you so adamantly refute the idea of Jesus reigning on earth for 1000 years?
     
  9. Truth7t7

    Truth7t7 Newbie

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    Keras I respect your honesty, yes Ezekiel Chapter 47 Is the Eternal Kingdom as verse 12 tells you so :)

    Just As Isaiah Chapter 65 is, as verses 17-19 tell you so.

    Somewhat deceptive on how Millennialiast are misrepresenting the eternal kingdom, for a false earthly 1000 year kingdom.

    Amazing how far one will go in denial of the truth, not speaking of you Keras.

    You were honest on Ezekiel 47:12 as being "Eternal", I'll give ya that!

    Lets see how you do on Isaiah 65:17-20
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
  10. Truth7t7

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    The righteous will reign on Earth, Jerusalem, for "Eternity" :)

    However it will be a New Heaven, Earth, And Jerusalem, Behold I Make All Things New :)Revelation 21:1-5
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
  11. Truth7t7

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    No Keras the present unholy land of Jerusalem wont be cleansed by the Lord?

    The entire earth will be dissolved by the Lords fire at the "Second Advent"

    2 Peter 3:10-13, 2 Thessalonians 1:7-8, Malachi 3:2, Luke 17:29-30, 1 Corinthians 3:13, Isaiah 24:20
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
  12. keras

    keras Writer of Bible prophecy studies.

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    There is quite a lot that must happen before Revelation 21 takes place.
    We simply aren't given enough information to be sure of how and when. What I am sure of, is there will soon happen a dramatic event, that will reset our civilization to a similar degree as what happened in Noah's time.
    That is what we should all be aware of, not in the dark about and prepared for: physically and spiritually.
     
  13. Truth7t7

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    There will be a future man of sin/ Antichrist in Jerusalem, there will be a future 3.5 year tribulation, where prophets return I believe Enoch/Elijah, plagues will be brought by the two as the Church is present and protected.
    At the end of the tribulation they will be killed, lay in the street for 3.5 days, as the birth pangs of the second advent takes place as Jesus returns in glory the resurrection of all takes place, final judgment, eternal kingdom revealed on thelast day, immediately after the tribulation.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
  14. Biblewriter

    Biblewriter Senior Member Supporter

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    No they are the millennial kingdom, which comes before the eternal kingdom, which Matthew 25 does not say begins when Jesus returns.

    Although Revelation 20 is the only passage that says how long this period will last, a very large number of scriptures give us highly detailed descriptions of this time and this kingdom. All of these prophecies are explicitly stated. That is, the conclusion that these things will happen is not based on any interpretation of any kind. Rather, it is simply based on believing what the Holy Spirit explicitly said.

    These explicitly stated promises include:

    That Israel will be brought back to her land after Messiah has come, not before. (Isaiah 66)

    That when she is brought back, the rebels will be purged from their midst. Notice that it explicitly says of these rebels that "I will bring them out of the country where they dwell, but they shall not enter the land of Israel." (Ezekiel 20:38)

    That "all the families that remain" shall repent with butter weeping. (Zechariah 12:10-14)

    That Ephraim and Judah will be reunited, as one nation with one king, and will never be two kingdoms again, and that "they shall not defile themselves anymore." (Ezekiel 37:22-23)

    That everyone who is still living (notice, not who is resurrected) in Jerusalem "will be called holy." (Isaiah 4:3)

    That "all the house of Israel, even all of it," will again inhabit "the mountains of Israel," with "the hills, the rivers, the valleys, the desolate wastes, and the cities that have been forsaken." And that the Lord will do "better for " them "than at your beginnings." (Ezekiel 36:1-10)

    That the land will have borders which are precisely defined. (and which it has never had.) (Ezekiel 47:13-20)

    that the land will be dived among the twelve tribes in a why that has never taken place (Ezekiel 48:1-29)

    And all this only scratches the surface of the many promises explicitly made concerning this time.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
  15. Truth7t7

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    You reference Ezekiel Chapter 47 once again, this is the "Eternal Kingdom" as you comment about others knowing the scripture :)
     
  16. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    The Final Judgment (subtitle from eSword)

    Mat 25:31  When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: 
    Mat 25:32  And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 
    Mat 25:33  And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left. 
    Mat 25:34  Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 
    Mat 25:35  For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: 
    Mat 25:36  Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. 
    Mat 25:37  Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? 
    Mat 25:38  When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee? 
    Mat 25:39  Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee? 
    Mat 25:40  And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me. 
    Mat 25:41  Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: 
    Mat 25:42  For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: 
    Mat 25:43  I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. 
    Mat 25:44  Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? 
    Mat 25:45  Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. 
    Mat 25:46  And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal. 

    How long is the word "eternal" in the verse above?

    .
     
  17. Truth7t7

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    Ezekiel 47:12 & Revelation 22:1-2 are the same place, the "Eternal Kingdom"

    "Tree and River of Life Present", fruit every month, leaves for healing/medicine.

    Can you see how your comment made of others, applies to you.

    As you falsely teach Ezekiel Chapter 47 represents a earthly Millennial Kingdom, 100% False!
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
  18. Biblewriter

    Biblewriter Senior Member Supporter

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    The fact that these are similar, does not prove that they are identical. These two passages are speaking of different times.
     
  19. Biblewriter

    Biblewriter Senior Member Supporter

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    Scripture very explicitly says otherwise.

    20 "No more shall an infant from there live but a few days, Nor an old man who has not fulfilled his days; For the child shall die one hundred years old, But the sinner being one hundred years old shall be accursed. 21 They shall build houses and inhabit them; They shall plant vineyards and eat their fruit. 22 They shall not build and another inhabit; They shall not plant and another eat; For as the days of a tree, so shall be the days of My people, And My elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands. 23 They shall not labor in vain, Nor bring forth children for trouble; For they shall be the descendants of the blessed of the LORD, And their offspring with them. Isaiah 65:20-23

    And again:

    8 And in that day it shall be That living waters shall flow from Jerusalem, Half of them toward the eastern sea And half of them toward the western sea; In both summer and winter it shall occur. 9 And the LORD shall be King over all the earth. In that day it shall be-- "The LORD is one," And His name one. 10 All the land shall be turned into a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem. Jerusalem shall be raised up and inhabited in her place from Benjamin's Gate to the place of the First Gate and the Corner Gate, and from the Tower of Hananeel to the king's winepresses. 11 The people shall dwell in it; And no longer shall there be utter destruction, But Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited. 12 And this shall be the plague with which the LORD will strike all the people who fought against Jerusalem: Their flesh shall dissolve while they stand on their feet, Their eyes shall dissolve in their sockets, And their tongues shall dissolve in their mouths. 13 It shall come to pass in that day That a great panic from the LORD will be among them. Everyone will seize the hand of his neighbor, And raise his hand against his neighbor's hand; 14 Judah also will fight at Jerusalem. And the wealth of all the surrounding nations Shall be gathered together: Gold, silver, and apparel in great abundance. 15 Such also shall be the plague On the horse and the mule, On the camel and the donkey, And on all the cattle that will be in those camps. So shall this plague be. 16 And it shall come to pass that everyone who is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the Feast of Tabernacles. 17 And it shall be that whichever of the families of the earth do not come up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, on them there will be no rain. 18 If the family of Egypt will not come up and enter in, they shall have no rain; they shall receive the plague with which the LORD strikes the nations who do not come up to keep the Feast of Tabernacles. 19 This shall be the punishment of Egypt and the punishment of all the nations that do not come up to keep the Feast of Tabernacles. Zechariah 14:8-19

    Here we see reproduction, birth and death, as well as fighting and wars all during or at the beginning of that blessed time. and this is not interpretation, but is explicitly stated.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
  20. Truth7t7

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    Ezekiel 47:12 & Revelation 22:1-2 Are The Same Exact "Eternal Kingdom" you can deny this truth all ya want!

    Only one place "The Tree of Eternal Life" Is present, and it ain't gonna be on this earth with mortal humans running around dying physical death for a 1000 years :)

    Ezekiel 47:12 is the "Eternal Kingdom" :)
     
  21. Truth7t7

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    Well ya struck out on Ezekiel 47,& Did the same with Isaiah 65 & Zechariah 14, they all represent the "Eternal Kingdom"
     
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