Day of The Lord - Day of Jesus' Future Return

[Spiritual Jew]

No, that's not the way God's Word declares it will happen. The "day of the Lord" is about a number of events that happen on the last day of this present world, and they happen very quickly, probably taking no more than an hour to complete.

1. Christ's 2nd coming with the "asleep" saints from the Heavenly that are resurrected.
2. Then Christ and those descend from Heaven to the earth.
3. On their way to earth, Jesus changes the alive saints on earth to their spiritual body and gathers them to Him and His resurrected saints.
4. Jesus with ALL His saints go to Jerusalem where His feet touch down upon the Mount of Olives where He ascended to Heaven from.
5. God's consuming fire burns mans works up, and the flesh of the wicked, but not their spirit with soul.
6. The Heavenly dimension is revealed to 'all' on earth, and they will see Jesus coming in the clouds with His saints.
7. The "resurrection of damnation" about the wicked are raised on that day too.
8. Then Christ's future "thousand years" reign with His elect over all peoples on earth will begin, here, not up in the sky.

Who exactly do you think Christ will rule over during this future thousand years? What will qualify someone with a mortal body to survive His second coming?

Can you tell me how you interpret these passages:

2 Thess 1:6 God is just: He will pay back trouble to those who trouble you 7 and give relief to you who are troubled, and to us as well. This will happen when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven in blazing fire with his powerful angels. 8 He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. 9 They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might 10 on the day he comes to be glorified in his holy people and to be marveled at among all those who have believed. This includes you, because you believed our testimony to you.

Matthew 24:35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away. 36 “But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. 37 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38 For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39 and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man.

 

[Davy]

I guess the 86 verses didn't impress you.

I didn't read that link. I saw no need to, since you raised doubt that the "day of the Lord" is when Jesus returns, which I well know what God's Word says about it.

Why are the accumulated references to the return of Jesus in the Bible so weird?

If a reference to the return of Jesus is actually about the return of Jesus then we are pretty much left with no insight. You know you need to watch for his return but don't understand why. You can't fully understand what it means to watch and be ready. You have to guess but can never be sure.

Something else is going on.

I don't see God's Word about the "day of the Lord" verse weird at all. God said in the prophets that before He does something He tells His people about it. So it's really just a matter of listening to Him in His Word. If those you are listening to aren't showing you His Word about what to be watching, then maybe you ought to consider that they don't know, when they should know.

What to Watch:
1. Firstly, if we listen to God in His Word, we will understand His prophecy through Amos for the end that He would send a famine, not for food or water, but a famine for hearing the words of The LORD (Amos 8:9-13). This has happened with the majority of Churches today, as systems of men rule over them and all one gets are leaven fragments from God's Word, and not the whole Loaf. The believer must come to understanding about this, and get down to business of learning God's written Word for theirself, and comparing each word out the preacher's mouth with it.

2. Lord Jesus gave us, His Church, the main Signs of the end of this world to be watching for leading up to His return. That is specifically what His Olivet discourse is about, and it parallels the Signs given in His Book of Revelation (Matthew 24; Mark 13: Luke 21; Revelation 6). Jesus commanded His servants to 'watch'. But many of the systems of men over today's Churches shun Christ's Olivet discourse, and thus understanding about those 7 Signs of the end of this world. Once again, that's the famine for hearing the words of The LORD that is happening today. Solution? Get down to business and study to know those Signs. Those Signs Jesus gave are specifically the subject of "the times and the seasons" Apostle Paul was talking about in 1 Thessalonians 5. That idea he gave of the deceived saying, "Peace and safety" is right out of Christ's Olivet discourse about the end being the opposite of wars and rumors of war. Are we hearing that "Peace and safety" by the deceived today? Somewhat, but not to the level when all wars and fighting have stopped at the very end when the pseudo-Christ shows up and rules as king over all nations (another Sign Jesus gave).

So if you don't know those Signs, you've got some catching up to do.

 

[Davy]

I do not currently believe in the standard description of rapture theology . The meek shall inherit the earth. There are numerous Scriptures that Speak of the evil being removed.

I wasn't declaring man's theories of a rapture. I was declaring Scripture that reveals Christ's future coming and events associated with it.

 

[lsume]

I wasn't declaring man's theories of a rapture. I was declaring Scripture that reveals Christ's future coming and events associated with it.

The mystery of Christ being seen a second time to those who look for Him is powerful.

 

[Davy]

The mystery of Christ being seen a second time to those who look for Him is powerful.

Yet Revelation 1:7 says 'every eye' will see Him coming in the clouds. So does Matthew 24:29-31, so do many Bible Scriptures declare the wicked seeing His appearance at His coming.

What does that mean for all the Tim LaHaye "Left Behind" movies and books? It means those are all... dung, fit to be burned in the fire along with the rest of the lies from the children of darkness.

 

[nolidad]

Brethren in Christ Jesus, when we keep to God's Word as written, then understanding becomes simple as we stay with it, and not with listening to all sorts of traditions of men. Understanding the timing of the "day of the Lord" when Jesus returns is simple when we do this keeping to what is written. (In my writings I refer to the KJV Bible).

Apostle Peter declared the "day of the Lord" as a final event of destruction on the last day of this present world earth age. In 2 Peter 3, he was covering the idea of 3 earth ages, the "world that then was", which was destroyed by water, and then "the heavens and the earth, which are now", which he said is preserved for destruction by fire (2 Peter 3:5-7).

Peter proclaimed that day of destruction on the final day of this present world as the "day of the Lord" timing:

2 Peter 3:10-12
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
KJV


Apostle Paul also proclaimed that "day of the Lord" event coupled with a destruction upon the earth...

1 Thess 5:1-4
5:1 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
3 For when they shall say, "Peace and safety"; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
KJV


And again at the end of Hebrews 12, Apostle Paul proclaimed that day of destruction upon the earth coupled with God's consuming fire...

Heb 12:25-29
25 See that ye refuse not Him That speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused Him That spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from Him That speaketh from heaven:
26 Whose voice then shook the earth: but now He hath promised, saying, "Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven."
27 And this word, 'Yet once more', signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.
28 Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:
29 For our God is a consuming fire.
KJV

Who didn't know about that coming shaking God will do on that day also? If you don't know about it, then why not, because we were well told about it in Isaiah 2 about that coming great shaking on the future "day of the Lord"? This not taught in your Church you say? What else have you missed from not studying God's Word for yourself? And make no mistake. This Hebrews 12 passage is about that same event of the "day of the Lord" that Peter and Paul were talking about.

Did you know our Lord Jesus pointed to His coming on that "day of the Lord"? In Revelation 16:15 He did, when He forewarned us that He comes "as a thief", and to keep our righteous garments lest we appear naked and in shame (spiritually). The next event described there is the battle of Armageddon on the 7th Vial. That "as a thief" idea He taught in His Olivet discourse in relation to His coming for His Church...

Matt 24:42-44
42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.
43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.
44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.
KJV

That is also the "as a thief in the night" idea that Apostles Paul and Peter were preaching in the above Scripture I posted about the "day of the Lord".

But places like below, in the Old Testament Book of Isaiah is where our Lord Jesus had already foretold about His coming on that "day of the Lord" to end this present world...

Isa 2:10-21
10 Enter into the rock, and hide thee in the dust, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of His majesty.
11 The lofty looks of man shall be humbled, and the haughtiness of men shall be bowed down, and the LORD alone shall be exalted in that day.
12 For the day of the LORD of hosts shall be upon every one that is proud and lofty, and upon every one that is lifted up; and he shall be brought low:
13 And upon all the cedars of Lebanon, that are high and lifted up, and upon all the oaks of Bashan,
14 And upon all the high mountains, and upon all the hills that are lifted up,
15 And upon every high tower, and upon every fenced wall,
16 And upon all the ships of Tarshish, and upon all pleasant pictures.
17 And the loftiness of man shall be bowed down, and the haughtiness of men shall be made low: and the LORD alone shall be exalted in that day.
18 And the idols He shall utterly abolish.
19 And they shall go into the holes of the rocks, and into the caves of the earth, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of His majesty, when He ariseth to shake terribly the earth.
20 In that day a man shall cast his idols of silver, and his idols of gold, which they made each one for himself to worship, to the moles and to the bats;
21 To go into the clefts of the rocks, and into the tops of the ragged rocks, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of His majesty, when He ariseth to shake terribly the earth.
KJV

So make no mistake, the "day of the Lord" event is the day of Christ's return to gather His Church, and reign over all nations on earth. It is when He will literally rule over all His enemies with His elect saints. That day has not arrived yet, because it will be when He will subdue 'all' the wicked on this earth.

I knew this was going to be biblically incorrect as soon as you added "traditions of men" in . You imply you got it right and that no one in 20 centuries did!

Well after the 6th seal we have a day of the Lord declaration. And it is not the end of teh wqorld like in Peter!

Zechariah 14
Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee. For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city. Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. ..

Isaiah 3:18
In that day the Lord will take away the bravery of their tinkling ornaments about their feet, and their cauls, and their round tires like the moon,

Isaiah 13:6-13
King James Version

6 Howl ye; for the day of the Lord is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.

7 Therefore shall all hands be faint, and every man's heart shall melt:

8 And they shall be afraid: pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them; they shall be in pain as a woman that travaileth: they shall be amazed one at another; their faces shall be as flames.

9 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.

10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

12 I will make a man more precious than fine gold; even a man than the golden wedge of Ophir.

13 Therefore I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall remove out of her place, in the wrath of the Lord of hosts, and in the day of his fierce anger.

Joel 2
King James Version

2 Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the Lord cometh, for it is nigh at hand;

2 A day of darkness and of gloominess, a day of clouds and of thick darkness, as the morning spread upon the mountains: a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after it, even to the years of many generations.

3 A fire devoureth before them; and behind them a flame burneth: the land is as the garden of Eden before them, and behind them a desolate wilderness; yea, and nothing shall escape them.

4 The appearance of them is as the appearance of horses; and as horsemen, so shall they run.

5 Like the noise of chariots on the tops of mountains shall they leap, like the noise of a flame of fire that devoureth the stubble, as a strong people set in battle array.

6 Before their face the people shall be much pained: all faces shall gather blackness.

Context determines whether it is the end of the World or the time of the tribulation period being spoken of!

 

[Davy]

I knew this was going to be biblically incorrect as soon as you added "traditions of men" in . You imply you got it right and that no one in 20 centuries did!

No, that's just a germ idea that came up in your mind. All I'm doing is 'keeping' to the Bible Scriptures as written. So let's do that, stick to God's Word as written. And if you can't do that, then the error in your mind will be apparent.

Well after the 6th seal we have a day of the Lord declaration. And it is not the end of teh wqorld like in Peter!

Your statement simply does not match these Scriptures you quote. Didn't you notice in the Isaiah 13:9 about God coming to lay the land desolate, and destroy the sinners out of it?!? That is what God's consuming fire will do on that "day of the Lord" per Peter in 2 Peter 3:10! Uh, you are not... keeping to God's Word already, which means what in your mind? Error.

Zechariah 14
Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee. For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city. Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. ..

Isaiah 3:18
In that day the Lord will take away the bravery of their tinkling ornaments about their feet, and their cauls, and their round tires like the moon,

Isaiah 13:6-13
King James Version

6 Howl ye; for the day of the Lord is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.

7 Therefore shall all hands be faint, and every man's heart shall melt:

8 And they shall be afraid: pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them; they shall be in pain as a woman that travaileth: they shall be amazed one at another; their faces shall be as flames.

9 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.

10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

12 I will make a man more precious than fine gold; even a man than the golden wedge of Ophir.

13 Therefore I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall remove out of her place, in the wrath of the Lord of hosts, and in the day of his fierce anger.

Joel 2
King James Version

2 Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the Lord cometh, for it is nigh at hand;

2 A day of darkness and of gloominess, a day of clouds and of thick darkness, as the morning spread upon the mountains: a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after it, even to the years of many generations.

3 A fire devoureth before them; and behind them a flame burneth: the land is as the garden of Eden before them, and behind them a desolate wilderness; yea, and nothing shall escape them.

4 The appearance of them is as the appearance of horses; and as horsemen, so shall they run.

5 Like the noise of chariots on the tops of mountains shall they leap, like the noise of a flame of fire that devoureth the stubble, as a strong people set in battle array.

6 Before their face the people shall be much pained: all faces shall gather blackness.

Context determines whether it is the end of the World or the time of the tribulation period being spoken of!

You apparently haven't actually read that Joel 2 Scripture to understand its timing either. Joel 2:1 right off the bat says the "day of the Lord" is "at hand". That means the "day of the Lord" is soon coming when those events of the locusts appear. It does not mean the "day of the Lord" happens at that moment.

The fire the locusts represent doing to devour is about their working against God's people for the end of this world, just prior to Christ's return on the "day of the Lord". It's that simple. That locust army we discover in Joel 2:25 God Himself sends for the end times. And they are further described in Revelation 9 on the 5th Trumpet - 1st Woe period, and 6th Trumpet - 2nd Woe period. Jesus returns on the "day of the Lord" on the 7th Trumpet - 3rd Woe per Rev.11.

 

[nolidad]

No, that's just a germ idea that came up in your mind. All I'm doing is 'keeping' to the Bible Scriptures as written. So let's do that, stick to God's Word as written. And if you can't do that, then the error in your mind will be apparent.

If only you were.

I won't answer the rest of your last post until you reconcile these verses as all occuring at the end of time.

Joel 2
King James Version

2 Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the Lord cometh, for it is nigh at hand;

2 A day of darkness and of gloominess, a day of clouds and of thick darkness, as the morning spread upon the mountains: a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after it, even to the years of many generations.

3 A fire devoureth before them; and behind them a flame burneth: the land is as the garden of Eden before them, and behind them a desolate wilderness; yea, and nothing shall escape them.

4 The appearance of them is as the appearance of horses; and as horsemen, so shall they run.

5 Like the noise of chariots on the tops of mountains shall they leap, like the noise of a flame of fire that devoureth the stubble, as a strong people set in battle array.

6 Before their face the people shall be much pained: all faces shall gather blackness.

1 Thessalonians 5:1-3
King James Version

5 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.

2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

2 Peter 3:10-11
King James Version

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Can't have armies marching when the universe is melting.

Zechariah 14
King James Version

14 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.

2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

3 Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.

4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

6 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:

7 But it shall be one day which shall be known to the Lord, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.

8 And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.

9 And the Lord shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one.

How can people flee when you say there will be no place found for them???????

I await you answer. But it is simply that teh bible as written shows several days.

You cannot take one phrase and then gerrymander it to fit all times that phrase is uses, especially when the Bible as written shows very differing circumstances. This is basic hermeneutics 101.

 

[lsume]

Yet Revelation 1:7 says 'every eye' will see Him coming in the clouds. So does Matthew 24:29-31, so do many Bible Scriptures declare the wicked seeing His appearance at His coming.

What does that mean for all the Tim LaHaye "Left Behind" movies and books? It means those are all... dung, fit to be burned in the fire along with the rest of the lies from the children of darkness.

I try not to put any stock in works of fiction written by man. God’s Word is Spiritual.

 

[lsume]

The "day of the Lord" will come "as a thief in the night" with a "sudden destruction" upon the wicked, as Apostle Paul showed in 1 Thess.5. That Scripture fact has already been established as written.

So how can the time of "great tribulation" just be starting on that "day of the Lord"? Your theory from the Pretribulationalists defies common sense in God's Word. And that's not to mention even Apostle Peter's witness in 2 Peter 3:10-12 about the burning up of man's works off this earth on that "day of the Lord"!

Thus God's Word plainly declares the "day of the Lord" will end... the tribulation, the reign of the wicked on earth, man's works, and is linked with the time of Christ's coming in the clouds to gather His Church on the last day of this world.

The making of captivity made captive by Christ is a powerful Thing.

 

[Online.Gamer.79]

First, But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. Secondly there are know signs that it is happening. Plain and simple nothing is different now than a 1000 or 2000 or 3000 years ago. The only difference is satellites in orbit observing and reporting on everything at once. Everyone is so focused on the end that they are ignoring the now.

For all we know the end might be when the sun goes supernova 5 billion years from now. You use the end times as an excuse to rape the environment to spread discontent. Honestly considering how hateful a good number of people are I would not be in such a rush.

 

[sparow]

You mean symbolic language has no real literal meaning, and is more like a fable in a nursery rhyme book? Afraid not. You have been misled. Symbolic language used in God's Word is always pointing to something literal and real, even when used as an expression or allegory. The symbols only serve as pointers. Thus trying to say taking symbolic language as literal is really an oxymoron statement that defies common sense. That's how many throw that kind of statement out too, as they have heard it used by others in false arguments.



If you believe those above verses are just metaphor, and not about a real destruction, then you have a huge surprise coming when Jesus appears coming in the clouds with His saints on the "day of the Lord". You don't understand the Power of God, nor His creation.

Symbolic language is hieroglyphics, revelation without detail, abstraction.

 

[lsume]

Yet Revelation 1:7 says 'every eye' will see Him coming in the clouds. So does Matthew 24:29-31, so do many Bible Scriptures declare the wicked seeing His appearance at His coming.

What does that mean for all the Tim LaHaye "Left Behind" movies and books? It means those are all... dung, fit to be burned in the fire along with the rest of the lies from the children of darkness.

Seek and ye shall find is powerful. The fiction writers might have somethings partially right but that’s far from Truth. Christ Teaches God’s elect and is our high priest forever. The only way to know The Truth is by being born into Christ.

 

[Davy]

If only you were.

I won't answer the rest of your last post until you reconcile these verses as all occuring at the end of time.

Joel 2
King James Version

2 Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the Lord cometh, for it is nigh at hand;

I already explained that one. Joel 3 is when the 'actual' "day of the Lord" event happens per the Book of Joel. Until that 3rd chapter, it is only describing the time of the end of this world, just prior, warning about the locust army and their destruction, and then warning about the coming destruction by God. You have to PAY ATTENTION to the flow of the Scripture line upon line and cover all of it, not just pieces of it.

1 Thessalonians 5:1-3
King James Version

5 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.

2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

I don't see how you could NOT... understand how that is about the last day of this world with the "day of the Lord" event, and... with the day of Christ's return "as a thief in the night". That idea of the deceived saying "Peace and safety", and then that "sudden destruction" comes upon 'them', IS... what the "day of the Lord" events are about on the day of Christ's return! Already covered that. Paul was even pulling from the Book of Isaiah about that "sudden destruction" coming suddenly, at an instant, on that day of the Lord.

2 Peter 3:10-11
King James Version
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Can't have armies marching when the universe is melting.

And that's the point, it's THAT "day of the Lord" event that will END those armies coming out of the northern quarters against Israel on the final day of this world! You quoted Joel 2, but obviously you haven't even read Joel 3 which points to the destruction of those armies on that day!

Joel 3:2
2 I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for My people and for My heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted My land.
KJV

Joel 3:9-16
9 Proclaim ye this among the Gentiles; Prepare war, wake up the mighty men, let all the men of war draw near; let them come up:
10 Beat your plowshares into swords, and your pruninghooks into spears: let the weak say, I am strong.
11 Assemble yourselves, and come, all ye heathen, and gather yourselves together round about: thither cause Thy mighty ones to come down, O LORD.
12 Let the heathen be wakened, and come up to the valley of Jehoshaphat: for there will I sit to judge all the heathen round about.
13 Put ye in the sickle, for the harvest is ripe: come, get you down; for the press is full, the fats overflow; for their wickedness is great.
14 Multitudes, multitudes in the valley of decision: for the day of the LORD is near in the valley of decision.
15 The sun and the moon shall be darkened, and the stars shall withdraw their shining.
16 The LORD also shall roar out of Zion, and utter His voice from Jerusalem; and the heavens and the earth shall shake: but the LORD will be the hope of His people, and the strength of the children of Israel.
KJV

How could you miss that in Joel 3, especially after quoting from Joel 2?

God's consuming fire is what will destroy those armies that come up against Israel and surround it on the last day of this world, what Revelation 16 calls Armageddon for the 7th Vial, the day of God's Wrath poured out upon the earth!

Zechariah 14
King James Version

14 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.

2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

3 Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.

4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

6 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark:

7 But it shall be one day which shall be known to the Lord, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.

8 And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be.

9 And the Lord shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one.

How can people flee when you say there will be no place found for them???????

I await you answer. But it is simply that teh bible as written shows several days.

You cannot take one phrase and then gerrymander it to fit all times that phrase is uses, especially when the Bible as written shows very differing circumstances. This is basic hermeneutics 101.

That's funny, 'gerrymandering' is exactly... what you seem to be doing!

The Zechariah 14 description of the "day of the Lord" events ALSO describes it as a day of battle by The LORD. Can't you see that? Well let's see, does that point to Christ's coming with His army per Rev.19?? Yes!!! It does!!! Does it point to the day of "sudden destruction" Paul pointed to on the "day of the Lord"?? YES!!! It does!! TRUE hermeneutics always... involves common sense in the Scriptures, but you have totally left it with your interpretation!

 

[Davy]

I try not to put any stock in works of fiction written by man. God’s Word is Spiritual.

What? Are you saying Revelation 1:7 is fiction?!? Shame, shame, shame!

 

[Davy]

Symbolic language is hieroglyphics, revelation without detail, abstraction.

That wrongly suggests that symbols used in God's Word mean confusion and chaos.

In reality, all... languages uses symbols, allegories, metaphors, etc., to draw a type of picture in one's mind, to make it easier to get the point across. It's just a method of communication that can impart a whole lot more information in a shorter period of time.

For example, I'll describe an automobile wreck. "He dodged that tree like a bullfighter in the ring dodges a bull, and his car slammed instead into that telephone pole like a nuclear missile destroying a city!"

There's several symbols used in that, makes it more interesting and emotional, and gets the attention so as to clearly get the point across. But just saying, "his car missed the tree and hit the pole" isn't an attention getter. God wants to get our attention usually when He uses that kind of expressive language...

Isa 24:1-3
24:1 Behold, the LORD maketh the earth empty, and maketh it waste, and turneth it upside down, and scattereth abroad the inhabitants thereof.

2 And it shall be, as with the people, so with the priest; as with the servant, so with his master; as with the maid, so with her mistress; as with the buyer, so with the seller; as with the lender, so with the borrower; as with the taker of usury, so with the giver of usury to him.

3 The land shall be utterly emptied, and utterly spoiled: for the LORD hath spoken this word.
KJV

In the Hebrew, that phrase "utterly emptied, and utterly spoiled" is an expression... to mimic the sound of liquid being poured out of a bottle suddenly turned upside down:

hibbok tibbok hibboz tibboz

That... gets the point across. Thus the use of symbols, expressions, figures of speech, allegory, and metaphor, in God's Word. It's not to make things harder to understand, but more simple.

 

[Timtofly]

Those who say that, the wicked, on the 6th Seal, also include the unbelieving Jews in Jerusalem, for those are who Jesus showed will wish for the hills and mountains to fall upon them...

Luke 23:26-31
26 And as they led Him away, they laid hold upon one Simon, a Cyrenian, coming out of the country, and on him they laid the cross, that he might bear it after Jesus.

27 And there followed Him a great company of people, and of women, which also bewailed and lamented Him.

28 But Jesus turning unto them said, "Daughters of Jerusalem, weep not for Me, but weep for yourselves, and for your children.

29 For, behold, the days are coming, in the which they shall say, 'Blessed are the barren, and the wombs that never bare, and the paps which never gave suck.'

30 Then shall they begin to say to the mountains, "Fall on us"; and to the hills, "Cover us."

31 For if they do these things in a green tree, what shall be done in the dry?
KJV

Yet I do not consider that sudden destruction on the day of the Lord meaning a destruction of their spirit/soul, but only their flesh, like the Zechariah 14 Scripture reveals. The nations deceived by the Antichrist at the end of this world are going to be present for Christ's future "thousand years" reign, and they won't have flesh bodies.

Men's traditions in the Church have cause many to miss this, but this is where Paul was pulling from about the idea of death being swallowed up in victory in regards to the day of Christ's return. It's not just for the Church, it is for all peoples. But Rev.20 stipulates not all then will have put on immortality in Christ Jesus. Those wicked will still be subject to the "second death", i.e., the death of their spirit with soul in the lake of fire.

Isa 25:5-9
5 Thou shalt bring down the noise of strangers, as the heat in a dry place; even the heat with the shadow of a cloud: the branch of the terrible ones shall be brought low.

6 And in this mountain shall the LORD of hosts make unto all people a feast of fat things, a feast of wines on the lees, of fat things full of marrow, of wines on the lees well refined.

7 And He will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations.
8 He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of His people shall He take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

9 And it shall be said in that day, "Lo, this is our God; we have waited for Him, and He will save us: this is the LORD; we have waited for Him, we will be glad and rejoice in His salvation."
KJV

All of Adam's flesh will die. Some will be resurrected and live forever, including the 1000 years. At the end, the rest will be thrown into the lake of fire forever. The second death and the "second resurrection" out of Death and into the lake of fire, is not the same type of resurrection in Revelation 20:4 to everlasting life that prevents one from ever dying again. But the second generation will have to obey Christ. The first resurrection and eternal life does not produce children and grandchildren. Every generation after the first will have to choose death or life for themselves on an individual basis. If they choose life, then they will never die. If they choose rebellion and death, then they will go to Death, and at the end of the 1000 years, be cast into the Lake of Fire.

The nations in the millennium are going to be populated by those in incorruptible bodies. No sin nature, but ruled directly by Christ with a rod of iron. Any disobedience will lead to eternal "life" in the lake of fire.

 

[Timtofly]

How did I slander you? You said you believe the earth is flat and you get understanding from Einstein. It would be slander if I said that you said those things but you actually didn't. But, I was just repeating what you said, so that is not slander.

Nope that is not what I said. I do not get understanding from Einstein. That is slander. As for saying the earth is flat, that would be understood from it not being a round planet in the solar system. Which is only mathematical numbers that cause us to believe Satan's deception of a 14 billion year old universe, with the Sun and current system forming 5 billion years ago. Why would I claim the earth is flat, even if it is? So making me look like your normal garden variety flat earther is slander if you are attempting to make me look bad just to prove a point. Some claim the universe is flat with no curve. What does that mean? That we cannot really see a curve at all? If we cannot see a curve, how is the earth round? Do you keep up with this line of thought to derail the thread? I said what I did to show how Satan has deceived us with western science since 500BC, 2500 years ago. It is not just in theology that we are decieved. To deceive the whole world, Satan used science. God did not create a universe that looks like it is 14 billion years old. Satan created that in the minds of humanity using math. God created a finite creation lasting 8000 finite years. And if time is the 4th dimension, we live in a cube that will only last 8000 years, and then vanish from reality. Read Ephesians 3, and it talks about God's hidden plan, that God as creator set in motion and in verse 18, it is all about creation.

14 For this reason, I fall on my knees before the Father,
15 from whom every family in heaven and on earth receives its character.
16 I pray that from the treasures of his glory he will empower you with inner strength by his Spirit,
17 so that the Messiah may live in your hearts through your trusting. Also I pray that you will be rooted and founded in love,
18 so that you, with all God’s people, will be given strength to grasp the breadth, length, height and depth of the Messiah’s love,
19 yes, to know it, even though it is beyond all knowing, so that you will be filled with all the fullness of God.

Breadth is representative of time. The other 3 are spatial dimensions. What other dimensions would that be other than physical creation? All things being equal, the size of this cube is 8000 years and all sides are equal to that 8000 number. Can I prove it with physical observation? Not in a spiritual blind body inherited from fallen Adam. Genesis 1:6-7

6 And God saith, `Let an expanse be in the midst of the waters, and let it be separating between waters and waters.'
7 And God maketh the expanse, and it separateth between the waters which [are] under the expanse, and the waters which [are] above the expanse: and it is so.

There was a body of water equal in proportion above the sky and below the sky. The sun and moon and all the stars were placed between two bodies of water. That can only be physically possible if the 3 areas were equal in size. The water above all the stars and the sun and moon is in an area equal to the sky where these "bodies" exist and equal to the water below. If the water encircled a globe, and you then placed all the stars, the sun and moon in between these two bodies of water, it would be physically impossible. Yet that is what God did. Should it not be 3 levels of equal area, because the body of water that surrounds all of this earth would have to be a larger sphere just to circle around the inner two spheres. Then how small all the stars and the sun and moon must be to fit in the sphere between the other two spheres of water.

Many verses on the heavens, the earth and under the earth. In Noah's day, how did the water pass through the sun moon and stars to get back to earth if the earth is a sphere? And the outer sphere emptied out some of it's water? It did it normally, and not like a sphere. The release from a sphere would be way too much pressure and would literally burn the earth up instead of causing a Flood. I am just pointing out that the way God put things in the Bible is not always conducive to modern science.

 

[lsume]

What? Are you saying Revelation 1:7 is fiction?!? Shame, shame, shame!

Of course not and rhetorical questions don’t yield much I’ve found. I’ve experienced some of The Terror of God The Father. This seminal experience is The Beginning of Wisdom. This Spiritual Truth must be experienced. The fear of The Lord is the beginning of knowledge. Don’t rely on man including yourself and yield to Christ. I pray you do. Ye shall through much tribulation enter into the kingdom.


Acts.14

1. [22] Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that we must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God.

2Cor.5

1. [11] Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences

 

[lsume]

What? Are you saying Revelation 1:7 is fiction?!? Shame, shame, shame!

My mission is to share The Truth. This public forum has varied interests expressed. I have prayed that Truth will come to some. Only Christ can carry us through the rebirth. This is a powerful Spiritual Truth.