Daniel 12:1 and Luke 21 same event?

Are Daniel 12:1 and Luke 21:23 same event?

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LittleLambofJesus

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Note: I am attaching a poll thread and allowing members to change their vote if they wish .

I was studying more on Luke 21 and while looking at the greek word used in vs 21 for "distress", I decided to look to look at the hebrew word used in Daniel 12.

First, let me put the 2 verses up:



Daniel 12:1

“At that time<6256> Michael, the great prince/chief<8269>standing over sons of that people
And becomes a time<6256> of distress<6869> which not occurred from to become<1961> of a nation until that time<6256
and in that time, shall escape<4422> thy people, everyone being found being written in scroll.

8269 sar from 8323;
a head person (of any rank or class):--captain (that had rule), chief (captain), general, governor, keeper, lord, ((-task- ))master, prince(-ipal), ruler, steward.
1961 hayah a primitive root (Compare 1933);
to exist, i.e. be or become, come to pass (always emphatic, and not a mere copula or auxiliary):--beacon, X altogether, be(-come), accomplished, committed, like), break, cause, come (to pass)...................
6869 tsarah tsaw-raw' feminine of 6862;
tightness (i.e. figuratively, trouble); transitively, a female rival:--adversary, adversity, affliction, anguish, distress, tribulation, trouble.

6256 `eth from 5703;
time, especially (adverb with preposition) now, when, etc.:--+ after, (al-)ways, X certain, + continually, + evening, long, (due) season, so (long) as, (even-, evening-, noon-)tide, ((meal-)), what) time, when.
4422 malata primitive root;
properly, to be smooth, i.e. (by implication) to escape (as if by slipperiness); causatively, to release or rescue; specifically, to bring forth young, emit sparks:--deliver (self), escape, lay, leap out, let alone, let go, preserve, save, X speedily, X surely.

=============================

Luke 21:23
“But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days!
For shall be being<2701/1510> great distress/necessity<G318> upon the land and wrath<3709> to this people.

318. anagke from 303 and the base of 43;
constraint (literally or figuratively); by implication, distress:--distress, must needs, (of) necessity(-sary), needeth, needful.

3709. orge from 3713; properly,
desire (as a reaching forth or excitement of the mind), i.e. (by analogy), violent passion (ire, or (justifiable) abhorrence); by implication punishment:--anger, indignation, vengeance, wrath.

.
 
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bcbsr

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Note: I am attaching a poll thread and allowing members to change their vote if they wish .

I was studying more on Luke 21 and while looking at the greek word used in vs 21 for "distress", I decided to look to look at the hebrew word used in Daniel 12.

Let me put the verses down 1st:


6869 tsarah tsaw-raw'
feminine of 6862; tightness (i.e. figuratively, trouble); transitively, a female rival:--adversary, adversity, affliction, anguish, distress, tribulation, trouble.

Daniel 12:
1“At that time Michael, the great prince who protects your people, will arise.
There will be a time of distress<H6869> such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then.
But at that time your people—everyone whose name is found written in the book—will be delivered.


318. anagke an-ang-kay'
from 303 and the base of 43; constraint (literally or figuratively); by implication, distress:--distress, must needs, (of) necessity(-sary), needeth, needful.

Luke 21:23
“But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days!
For there will be great distress<G318> in the land and wrath upon this people.
I would agree with that premise. Not only because of mentioned the great distress or great tribulation, but because the passage also mentions of the resurrection.

Dan 12:
1 "At that time Michael, the great prince who protects your people, will arise. There will be a time of distress such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then. But at that time your people— everyone whose name is found written in the book— will be delivered.
2 Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.
3 Those who are wise will shine like the brightness of the heavens, and those who lead many to righteousness, like the stars for ever and ever.


So it's relative to the resurrection, which frames it in the final days.
 
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Douggg

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Note: I am attaching a poll thread and allowing members to change their vote if they wish .

I was studying more on Luke 21 and while looking at the greek word used in vs 21 for "distress", I decided to look to look at the hebrew word used in Daniel 12.

Let me put the verses down 1st:


6869 tsarah tsaw-raw'
feminine of 6862; tightness (i.e. figuratively, trouble); transitively, a female rival:--adversary, adversity, affliction, anguish, distress, tribulation, trouble.

Daniel 12:
1“At that time Michael, the great prince who protects your people, will arise.
There will be a time of distress<H6869> such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then.
But at that time your people—everyone whose name is found written in the book—will be delivered.


318. anagke an-ang-kay'
from 303 and the base of 43; constraint (literally or figuratively); by implication, distress:--distress, must needs, (of) necessity(-sary), needeth, needful.

Luke 21:23
“But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days!
For there will be great distress<G318> in the land and wrath upon this people.
No, Luke 21:23 is 70 AD. Daniel 12:1 is end times.
 
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JIMINZ

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Note: I am attaching a poll thread and allowing members to change their vote if they wish .

I was studying more on Luke 21 and while looking at the greek word used in vs 21 for "distress", I decided to look to look at the hebrew word used in Daniel 12.

Let me put the verses down 1st:


6869 tsarah tsaw-raw'
feminine of 6862; tightness (i.e. figuratively, trouble); transitively, a female rival:--adversary, adversity, affliction, anguish, distress, tribulation, trouble.

Daniel 12:
1“At that time Michael, the great prince who protects your people, will arise.
There will be a time of distress<H6869> such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then.
But at that time your people—everyone whose name is found written in the book—will be delivered.


318. anagke an-ang-kay'
from 303 and the base of 43; constraint (literally or figuratively); by implication, distress:--distress, must needs, (of) necessity(-sary), needeth, needful.

Luke 21:23
“But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days!
For there will be great distress<G318> in the land and wrath upon this people.

There the same to me.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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You had to many choices, it becomes confusing for Christians.
Possible. In the past, I have been told that I did not put enough choices up, so I added more.
 
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Douggg

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Aren't they the same event?....No your right can't be.....Right?
Luke 21:23,

23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.

24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

That puts it at 70AD because Luke 23 is followed the 2000 year time of gentiles.
_____________________________________________________________________

Differently, Daniel 12:1 is end times, the great tribulation. Daniel 12:1 is actually talking about when Michael and in his angels are going to fight against Satan and his angels in Revelation 12:7-9. And Satan is going to be cast down to earth, and will have great wrath, because he only has a short time left - of a time, times, half time.

Which is going to the worst time of trouble for the children of Israel ever. Also the rest of the world.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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This verse uses both of the words Luke 21:23 uses:

Zephaniah 1:15
That day is a day of wrath, A day of trouble and distress,
A day of devastation and desolation,
A day of darkness and gloominess,
A day of clouds and thick darkness,

Luke 21:23
“But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days!

For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people.

The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

Meanwhile the horrors of famine grew still more melancholy and afflictive. The Jews, for of food were at length compelled to eat their belts, their sandals, the skins of their shields, dried grass, and even the ordure of oxen.

In the depth or this horrible extremity, a Jewess of noble family urged by the intolerable cravings of hunger, slew her infant child, and prepared it for a meal ; and had actually eaten one half thereof, when the soldiers, allured by tile smell of food, threatened her with instant death if she refused to discover it.

'Intimidated by this menace, she immediately produced the remains of her son, which petrified them with horror. At the recital of this melancholy and affecting occurrence, the whole city stood aghast, and poured forth their congratulations on those whom death had hurried away from such heartrending scenes.

.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Here we have the prophecy of both the desolation and the voice of the bride and bridegroom concerning 1st century Jerusalem, in my humble view......

Jeremiah 7:34 [Revelation 18:19, 23]
And I cause to cease from cities of Y@huwdah, and from streets of Y@ruwshalaim voice of elation and voice of rejoicing,
voice of bridegroom, and voice of bride,
that to desolation the Land shall become.

Luke 21:20
"whenever yet ye may be seeing Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, then be ye knowing! that has-neared the desolating<2050> of Her"

Revelation 18:
19 And they cast dust upon their heads and cried-out, weeping and mourning, saying "Woe! Woe! the great City, wherein all were made rich, that had ships at sea, by reason of her prices.
That to one hour She was desolated<2049>.

Bride and bridegroom are used together in only 2 verses of the NT, and who else but John the Revelator:

John 3:29
He who has the bride is the Bridegroom;
but the friend of the Bridegroom, who stands and hears him, rejoices greatly because of the Bridegroom's voice.
Therefore this joy of mine is fulfilled.

Revelation 18:
23
and light of a lamp shall not no be appearing in Thee still
and voice of bridegroom and of bride not no should be being heard in Thee still............
[Jeremiah 7:34]


.

 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Luke 21:23,

24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
That puts it at 70AD because Luke 23 is followed the 2000 year time of gentiles.
I haven't studied that much on the "time of the Gentiles", but I found this on a keyword search.

Ezekiel 30:
1 And a word of Yahweh is coming to me to say of:
2 "Son of adam! prophesy thou! and thou say,
'Thus says 'Adonay Yahweh: 'Wail ye! 'Woe! for Day!'
3 that near Day, and near Day of Yahweh,
a Day of cloud, Time/`ethעֵת (`eth) <06256> of Nations shall become.

6256 `eth ayth from 5703; time, especially (adverb with preposition) now, when, etc.:-

That same hebrew word is used in Daniel 12:11.

Daniel 12:11
and from the time/`ethעֵת (`eth) <06256> of the turning aside of the continually,
and to the giving of an abomination one desolating,
are days, a thousand, two hundreds, and ninety.

Luke 21:
24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations:
and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles/Nations, until the times of the Gentiles/Nations be fulfilled.

.
 
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claninja

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Note: I am attaching a poll thread and allowing members to change their vote if they wish .

I was studying more on Luke 21 and while looking at the greek word used in vs 21 for "distress", I decided to look to look at the hebrew word used in Daniel 12.

Let me put the verses down 1st:


6869 tsarah tsaw-raw'
feminine of 6862; tightness (i.e. figuratively, trouble); transitively, a female rival:--adversary, adversity, affliction, anguish, distress, tribulation, trouble.

Daniel 12:
1“At that time Michael, the great prince who protects your people, will arise.
There will be a time of distress<H6869> such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then.
But at that time your people—everyone whose name is found written in the book—will be delivered.


318. anagke an-ang-kay'
from 303 and the base of 43; constraint (literally or figuratively); by implication, distress:--distress, must needs, (of) necessity(-sary), needeth, needful.

Luke 21:23
“But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days!
For there will be great distress<G318> in the land and wrath upon this people.

The angel tells daniel that all these things (great tribulation, your people delivered, those who sleep rise again to contempt or life, and the righteous shining like the sun) will be completed after a time, times, and half of time when the power of israel is scattered.
Daniel 12:7 “It will be for a time, times and half a time.b When the power of the holy people has been finally broken, all these things will be completed.”

Does this mean that the tribulation, christians fleeing jerusalem, the resurrection, and the righteous shining like the sun, occurred in the 1st century?

If the time period is 42 months (time, times, half a time), then it was all finished a long time ago.
 
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claninja

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No, Luke 21:23 is 70 AD. Daniel 12:1 is end times.

so if 70ad is when the days of vengeance occur, to fulfill ALL that is written, what is left to be fulfilled at a 2000+ year later end time.
Luke 21:22 for these are days of vengeance, to fulfill all that is written.
 
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claninja

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I haven't studied that much on the "time of the Gentiles", but I found this on a keyword search.

I am also interested in the what the old testament has to say on the times of the gentiles with regards to trampling jerusalem.

The only similar reference to gentiles trampling Jerusalem in the NT is Revelation 11:2, which has the gentiles trampling the city for 42 months


revelation 11:2 But exclude the outer court; do not measure it, because it has been given to the Gentiles. They will trample on the holy city for 42 months.
 
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Douggg

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I haven't studied that much on the "time of the Gentiles", but I found this on a keyword search.
It just means while the gentiles are occupying Jerusalem while Israel has been scattered among the nations.
 
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