dad'd "Box"

[zilch]

Dad,

First off, from what I understand, the sun will expand to the point where most if not all life could survive on earth anyway before it burns out.

Second, the sun is fueled by a finite source of hydrogen, what would keep the sun burning after the source runs out?

The sun is a star and stars die. Why would whatever you claim that will prevent the sun from burning out not do the same for other stars?

 

[zilch]

The earth will be the center of the universe, as it was. You will see this when the new heaven is revealed, and we see not just the physical part of things.

Do you have any evidence that this is not all in your head?

 

[dad]

Dad,

First off, from what I understand, the sun will expand to the point where most if not all life could survive on earth anyway before it burns out.

Second, the sun is fueled by a finite source of hydrogen, what would keep the sun burning after the source runs out?

The sun is a star and stars die. Why would whatever you claim that will prevent the sun from burning out not do the same for other stars?

The bible says that it is forever! What could keep it from that? The merge! Only in the physical only does decay as such exist, in a merged stste, we have eternity, where even time shall be no more!

 

[dad]

Do you have any evidence that this is not all in your head?

Bible is evidence. All we see now is the physical only. That will pass away. Nothing to do with my head or yours.

 

[nvxplorer]

A book is evidence of a book. I think he was asking for corroborating evidence.

 

[dad]

A book is evidence of a book. I think he was asking for corroborating evidence.

Apiritual book is a spiritual book! A physical only book is a physical only book! To corroborate a merge, we need more than a silly physical only book! The world of corroborating evience to the bible is not of the currency assumptions that a lifeform 'appeared', or the creator big bang speck soup appeared. One is science, the other, merely witnesses, and doctors giving testimony of healings, etc.

 

[nvxplorer]

Apiritual book is a spiritual book! A physical only book is a physical only book! To corroborate a merge, we need more than a silly physical only book! The world of corroborating evience to the bible is not of the currency assumptions that a lifeform 'appeared', or the creator big bang speck soup appeared. One is science, the other, merely witnesses, and doctors giving testimony of healings, etc.

In other words, you have no corroborating evidence. My oh my.

(I hope you're not referring to Benny Hinn. If you are, I also hope you don't patronize the carnival when it's in town. For your sake, dad. I wouldn't want to see you swindled.)

 

[zilch]

The bible says that it is forever! What could keep it from that? The merge! Only in the physical only does decay as such exist, in a merged stste, we have eternity, where even time shall be no more!

Then forever must only have about 5 billion years left.

Do you have any evidence of this "merge," or is this another one of your snipe hunts?

Bible is evidence. All we see now is the physical only. That will pass away. Nothing to do with my head or yours.

Your fantasy world that you make out of the bible is all in your head.

 

[dad]

In other words, you have no corroborating evidence. My oh my.

(I hope you're not referring to Benny Hinn. If you are, I also hope you don't patronize the carnival when it's in town. For your sake, dad. I wouldn't want to see you swindled.)

Aimee Semple McPherson comes to mind. Jesus, and the apostles as well . Do you have problems accepting things as real if they actually have witnesses, rather than none, like granny and the speck?

 

[zilch]

One is science, the other, merely witnesses, and doctors giving testimony of healings, etc.

And we all know how reliable eyewitnesses can be.

 

[dad]

Then forever must only have about 5 billion years left.

Do you have any evidence of this "merge," or is this another one of your snipe hunts?



Your fantasy world that you make out of the bible is all in your head.

Only 5 billion if all there ever will be is the physical only. Jesus had a physical/spiritual body after rising.
And as for writing the bible out of my head, even PO ers will tell you I was not around to write it before I was born.

 

[nvxplorer]

Aimee Semple McPherson comes to mind. Jesus, and the apostles as well . Do you have problems accepting things as real if they actually have witnesses, rather than none, like granny and the speck?

I have no problem with credible witnesses. Since no one has witnessed Jesus or the Apostles, I can reject them. I'm interested in Ms. McPherson. Can you describe her relevance?

 

[dad]

I have no problem with credible witnesses. Since no one has witnessed Jesus or the Apostles, I can reject them. I'm interested in Ms. McPherson. Can you describe her relevance?

I think she is said to have healed more people than any other human being in earth's history, through Jesus , of course.

 

[zilch]

Only 5 billion if all there ever will be is the physical only. Jesus had a physical/spiritual body after rising.
And as for writing the bible out of my head, even PO ers will tell you I was not around to write it before I was born.

The only evidence we have points to a "physical only" world anything else is all in your head.

Jesus only rose according to people who claim to have seen him. However I have no way of knowing if those people were credible or if the story didn't changed as it was retold prior to being written.

And I didn't say you wrote the bible. I am saying you have made up a fantasy world incorporating the bible.

 

[dad]

The only evidence we have points to a "physical only" world anything else is all in your head.

Jesus only rose according to people who claim to have seen him. However I have no way of knowing if those people were credible or if the story didn't changed as it was retold prior to being written.

And I didn't say you wrote the bible. I am saying you have made up a fantasy world incorporating the bible.

Since you don't believe in Jesus rising, or the witnesses to it, you think the bible is fantasy. Why would I worry about what you think is fantasy in my head?

 

[Numenor]

dad's whole assertion that the spiritual world, including God himself, is subject to some kind of repeatable tests is completely unbiblical.

"Do not put the Lord your God to the test" - Matt 4:7 & Deut 6:16

I just hope people here have realised by now that dad speaks entirely for himself and nobody else in Christendom.

He was saying to the devil in Matthew that the punk shouldn't tempt Him. How could you be so far afield? I already showed how He likes to be tested and proved. You cannot dispute it, and I've seldom seen such a silly, unspiritual, lame attempt. Hardly worthy of a response, but since kids might read it, I guess I better [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] ip the artillary, in case you peep up any more.

I think I will dispute it dad as you continue to show you don't know the Bible nor do you read what people post. Jesus was quoting Deuteronomy 6:16 wasn't he, and who was being spoken to and by whom in that verse? God himself was telling the Israelites not to put him to the test, as they had done before. Your bravado makes you look even more foolish than your pontificating.

 

[nvxplorer]

I think she is said to have healed more people than any other human being in earth's history, through Jesus , of course.

You think she was a faith healer? You don't know? Credibility, dad, that's what we're discussing.

Aimee McPherson became the first woman televangelist in 1921. Her healing abilities are both praised and described as a hoax. Not much different from Benny Hinn.

Sorry dad, zero credibility on this one.

Show me a "healer" who does so only to help mankind, without invoking Jesus, has no religious, political or financial interest, and then you'll have something.

 

[zilch]

Since you don't believe in Jesus rising, or the witnesses to it, you think the bible is fantasy. Why would I worry about what you think is fantasy in my head?

The only evidence we have for Jesus rising or anything else in the bible is the witnesses and the writers.

A witness or witnesses whether giving testimony in a courtroom, to alien abductions or anything else are not great evidence.

And I have no way of knowing if the writers wrote anything more factual than say Homer's epic poems.

I think your literal interpretation is all in your head. If you don't care what others think then why post on a board that is for discussion?

 

[Electric Sceptic]

He was saying to the devil in Matthew that the punk shouldn't tempt Him.

Actually, he said that you should not test God...something you like to claim can be done.

I already showed how He likes to be tested and proved.

You have not shown it; you have claimed it and, despite repeated requests, have not supported your claim in any way.

You cannot dispute it

Everyone in this thread, christians included, with the exception of you, can and is disputing it, since you've not supported it in any way.

and I've seldom seen such a silly, unspiritual, lame attempt.

Not since your last post?

OK, lets look at this. Are you saying that the sun will burn out, or that it will never burn out and die?

I'm saying precisely what I said. That disagreeing with YOUR interpretation is not disagreeing with god.

It is not a total flop at all.

Well gee, you better make up your mind. 'Total flop' was YOUR phrase, nobody else's.

My beef is with WOMD, and abotion, and cloning, and some of these misuses of it, and especially it's dreams of old ages based on PO processes.

Your beef is with anything that disagrees with your religious belief. Science is fine - great in fact - until it disagrees with you. Then, of course, it's wrong. And 'a total flop'.

And we all notice that you have completely ignored attempts to reasonably discuss your 'spiriscience' or 'spirycs' or whatever you want to call it. I'll try again with part of an earlier post that you completely ignored...

So which is it...is the spiritual testable and repeatable, and consequently approachable via the scientific method, or is it not testable and repeatable, and consequently not approachable via the scientific method?

Now, if it is testable and repeatable (as you have claimed), then you should be able to show some repeatable tests for it. You've attempted to do this for one particular spiritual claim (that asking Jesus into your life actually has an effect), but your attempt was badly flawed. You repeatedly stated that if you ask Jesus into your life, you WOULD get a result...but you were unable to specify what that result was. You even stated that no result might be discernable until after death! This makes me think you don't know what 'testable' means in this context. Let me give you an example, using science.

I claim that the force of gravity at sea level on our planet is 9.8 m/s^2. To support this, I propose a simple experiment. Drop a weight from a height of ten metres at (approximately) sea level. It should take slightly over one second to hit the ground. This test is repeatable by anyone, at any time. Every time it is performed and the weight does take slightly over one second to hit the ground, the claim gets a bit more support. Conversely, if at any time the weight takes (say) half a second, or two seconds to hit the ground, the claim is falsified. This test encompasses the core of the scientific method - a hypothethesis (force of gravity is 9.8 m/s^2 at sea level), an experiment (drop a weight from ten metres), expected results (weight takes just over a second to hit the ground), and conclusions (hypothesis either supported or falsified by the actual results). This is what testable means in this context. Anything that is testable in similar fashion is approachable via the scientific method.

Now, is the spiritual testable in this fashion? Note that your famous 'physical only' objection doesn't work here. There are no reasons why the expected results need be physical. For example, if you were to claim that, after inviting Jesus into your life, people will experience a supreme feeling of peace and tranquility, that would be valid (and obviously not physical). It would be rather subjective and difficult to quantify, but it would be something. It would be an expected result. If you can't provide a meaningful expected result (ie., more than 'something will happen, sometime'), then it's not testable. The same applies to all your other claims of 'spiritual laws' that are inviolate. What are they, and how do we test them?

Now, if it's not testable, my question is just how does your 'spiriscience' work? What does it achieve? For example, how does it tell us that evolutionary theory is false? Science tells us evolutionary theory is true; how does 'spiriscience' work to tell us differently? Is 'spiriscience' anything more than 'science until my interpretation of the bible is contradicted by it, and then my interpretation of the bible'? Remember, you are the one putting forward this 'spiriscience', wanting to teach it to children, and so forth - it's quite reasonable for me to ask exactly what it is and how it works.

 

[dad]

You think she was a faith healer? You don't know? Credibility, dad, that's what we're discussing.

Aimee McPherson became the first woman televangelist in 1921. Her healing abilities are both praised and described as a hoax. Not much different from Benny Hinn.

Sorry dad, zero credibility on this one.

Show me a "healer" who does so only to help mankind, without invoking Jesus, has no religious, political or financial interest, and then you'll have something.

I looked into this one. Can't handwave it away at all. Show me one university which teaches evolution, cosmology, biology, and the paleo junk, and all for free? Where is the bookstore where they give the free books I'd like to burn anyhow away? Where is there hospitals, and medicine for free, and doctors who worh for free as well? Jesus praised the widow for throwing in the bit she had, and we don't need your insinuations, or moral superiority that men should not have the blessing of being able to give to God a little. They did this from the beginning, right outside the garden they were sacrificing to God, Cain and Able.
They did it in the old temple, and while Moses was in the desert, and God didn't part the sea, send pillars of fire and smoke to guide them, drop manna from heaven, and make water come out of a rock for their paltry donnations. Miracles are not sesibly priced- they are free, the tips we may give God are an afterthought, or token.