Creationists: Explain how life was created.

[AV1611VET]

I (honestly) expected better from you guys.

You're actually making our case for us.

Our Bible is the one offensive Weapon mentioned in the chapter on spiritual armor (Ephesians 6).

Your OP is challenging us to lay It down and fight on your terms.

We have a saying for that:

Don't argue with an academian; he will drag you down to his level, then beat you to death with experience.

 

[pitabread]

You're actually making our case for us.

What case? That you want to replace knowledge with ignorance?

Because that's really what is going on in this thread. You guys continually claim that fully-formed life was created, but when push comes to shove not only can you not explain it but you keep going out of your way to find excuses not to have to explain it.

Is this really all creationism is? Just an empty box?

 

[AV1611VET]

Because that's really what is going on in this thread. You guys continually claim that fully-formed life was created, but when push comes to shove not only can you not explain it but you keep going out of your way to find excuses not to have to explain it.

Is this really all creationism is? Just an empty box?

You thought I was kidding all these years when I said creationism has NOTHING to do with science, didn't you?

Now you're trying to squeeze science out of us and finding out I was right all along.

Alas though, you're acting like you haven't learned yet.

And believe me, I know why.

 

[pitabread]

You thought I was kidding all these years when I said creationism has NOTHING to do with science, didn't you?

Now you're trying to squeeze science out of us and finding out I was right all along.

You're trying to replace science. You can't replace science with religion though; that never works.

And as we've seen from the lack of explanatory power of creationism, it's a dead end.

And believe me, I know why.

Dude, you claimed I was sent here by Satan. I'm sure whatever you think my motivations are, I'm not putting any stock in what you think. You're off the rails on that one.

 

[AV1611VET]

You're trying to replace science.

What science, pitabread?

Show me science in Genesis 1, or give it up.

 

[pitabread]

What science, pitabread?

Um, the science of biological evolution (and specifically that all organisms are biologically related via common descent)? Maybe you've heard of it?

 

[AV1611VET]

Um, the science of biological evolution (and specifically that all organisms are biologically related via common descent)? Maybe you've heard of it?

Fine ... then show it.

Genesis 1.

(I know ... I know ... [you] were smart enough to disallow the Bible; but not smart enough to realize you're making a point I've been making here for over a decade.)

 

[pitabread]

Fine ... then show it.

Genesis 1.

What is this, role reversal?

Look you are smart enough to know that science is not dependent on what is written in the Bible. Science is agnostic; it's simply a way to investigate the universe and report back what it shows us.

How you interpret your Bible is up to you. Scientific conclusions don't change because of it.

(I know ... I know ... [you] were smart enough to disallow the Bible; but not smart enough to realize you're making a point I've been making here for over a decade.)

I have no idea what you're trying to say. Instead of playing games, just make your point.

 

[AV1611VET]

I have no idea what you're trying to say. Instead of playing games, just make your point.

Science has NOTHING to do with that chapter in the Bible that tells us when life got started, where it started, Who started it, what order He started it in, and how long it took Him to do it.

If you want to insist on we explain HOW it got started, then you're not going to get a scientific answer; because science was NOT involved in starting it.

If Jesus ... sitting at the right hand of the Father ... started my car right now, don't even think of asking me how He did it.

It was a miracle.

 

[DogmaHunter]

Because you can't research the unknowable

And yet, you claim to know anyway.
Again: something isn't adding up here.....

 

[AV1611VET]

And yet, you claim to know anyway.
Again: something isn't adding up here.....

Do you know what "apocalyptic truth" is?

It is something known only by the person holding it; and only he can convey it.

For example, I'm thinking of a number between one and ten.

What's the number? (It's seven.)

I can give you ten guesses, and you'll get it right; but you won't KNOW which is right until I tell you.

Genesis 1 is apocalyptic truth.

 

[DogmaHunter]

Do you know what "apocalyptic truth" is?

It is something known only by the person holding it; and only he can convey it.

For example, I'm thinking of a number between one and ten.

What's the number? (It's seven.)

I can give you ten guesses, and you'll get it right; but you won't KNOW which is right until I tell you.

Genesis 1 is apocalyptic truth.

I won't know after you tell me either.
Suppose I guess 7 on the first go.
You can then just say "no, it was 6" and I would never know.

And also: this thing would be dependend on the workings of your brain and memory, which are subject to error by definition.

So in summary: truth is that which corresponds to reality.
I can't crawl inside your brain to independently verify the "truth" of you thinking about 7. At least, not yet... perhaps at some time in the future we'll have reliable technology to "read" thoughts, but till then, what you are thinking about exactly isn't a matter of true or false. It's just a matter of your word that can only be taken at face value.

 

[AV1611VET]

I won't know after you tell me either.
Suppose I guess 7 on the first go.
You can then just say "no, it was 6" and I would never know.

Now we're getting somewhere.

According to the Bible, God cannot lie.

Titus 1:2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

This is where faith comes in.

So if you want to have FAITH that I was holding the number seven in mind (which I was), then you would be right; and anyone who says otherwise would be wrong.

How would you express your faith in me?

Simple, you would claim you know I was thinking of the number, even if it meant you would be martyred for it.

 

[DogmaHunter]

Now we're getting somewhere.
According to the Bible, God cannot lie.

Since the claims of the bible are exactly the claims that are under discussion, using claims from the bible to try and support claims from the bible is a big circular no-no.

This is where faith comes in.

yeah, sorry, I don't do "faith".
I don't consider "faith" to be a good thing or a virtue. Au contraire. I consider "faith" to be the equivalent of gullibility.

So if you catch me appealing to faith somewhere, please tell me, so that I can stop doing it.

So if you want to have FAITH that I was holding the number seven in mind (which I was), then you would be right; and anyone who says otherwise would be wrong.

Anyone who says otherwise would be believe to be wrong.
"would be wrong", is a knowledge claim and knowledge is demonstrable.

Beliefs and knowledge, are not the same thing.

How would you express your faith in me?

non-existing.

Simple, you would claim you know I was thinking of the number, even if it meant you would be martyred for it.

That makes no sense.

 

[AV1611VET]

CAUSE:

I don't do "faith".

EFFECT:

That makes no sense.

 

[pitabread]

Science has NOTHING to do with that chapter in the Bible that tells us when life got started, where it started, Who started it, what order He started it in, and how long it took Him to do it.

What science does do is function as a tool by which we can investigate the natural universe and deduce things that way.

Which leads us to the origin of species being the result of evolutionary development over time from common ancestral populations.

 

[Aman777]

Um, the science of biological evolution (and specifically that all organisms are biologically related via common descent)? Maybe you've heard of it?

False teaching caused by rejecting God's Truth in Genesis. Humans (descendants of Adam) were made long BEFORE any other living creature, on the 3rd Day. Genesis 2:4-7 Every other living creature came forth from water on the 5th Day. Genesis 1:21

Humans did NOT evolve from ANY other living creature since we were FIRST made, no matter how confused today's false ToE proclaims.

 

[pitabread]

Humans did NOT evolve from ANY other living creature since we were FIRST made, no matter how confused today's false ToE proclaims.

We sure look that way though. Makes you wonder that if we were created, why were we created with the appearance of having evolved?

If creationists bothered to investigate how species were created maybe they could start answering some of those questions.

 

[Aman777]

Which leads us to the origin of species being the result of evolutionary development over time from common ancestral populations.

False assumption since Humans (descendants of Adam) were made long BEFORE every other living being. The common ancestor of Humans was Adam and he did NOT evolve from an Ape. The ToE is the biggest Satanic Lie ever forced upon our children in Public Schools. In the end, evolution will be discredited as nothing but a False Assumption of people who reject God's Truth of descent with modification within kinds.

 

[pitabread]

False assumption since Humans (descendants of Adam) were made long BEFORE every other living being.

It's not an assumption. It's a conclusion.

In the end, evolution will be discredited as nothing but a False Assumption of people who reject God's Truth of descent with modification within kinds.

The Imminent Demise of Evolution: The Longest Running Falsehood in Creationism

If you really want to replace biological evolution as an explanation for the diversity of species on Earth, you need something equivalent to replace it with. Unfortunately as this thread demonstrates, creationists not only don't have anything but can't even seem to be bothered to undertake that.

Creationism is screwed by its' adherents own apathy.