Creationism and Geocentricity

[Maccie]

What really puzzles me is why YEC's hold so closely to a 6-day creation, and yet deny Geocentricity (Sun going round the earth).

The Bible clearly states that it is the sun which moves round the earth, and indeed Galileo was accused of being a heretic when he suggested, after conducting several scientific experiments, that in fact the earth goes round the sun.

So why is the Bible so right in one thing, and allowed to be wrong in another?

Or could it be that YEC's are illogical and just using the Bible to suit their own beliefs?

 

[rmwilliamsll]

What really puzzles me is why YEC's hold so closely to a 6-day creation, and yet deny Geocentricity (Sun going round the earth).

The Bible clearly states that it is the sun which moves round the earth, and indeed Galileo was accused of being a heretic when he suggested, after conducting several scientific experiments, that in fact the earth goes round the sun.

So why is the Bible so right in one thing, and allowed to be wrong in another?

Or could it be that YEC's are illogical and just using the Bible to suit their own beliefs?

Appears to be more the simple passage of time. Given 450 years, 15-20 generations of Bible readers, people have adjusted their interpretation so that the cognitive dissonance has been minimized.

No longer is the physical center of the universe equated with the central concern for the Lord of the universe, we think we can just as well love us on the very peripheral edge of the galaxy which is just one of billions.

No longer are the direct and indirect allusion to the corners of the earth or the ability to see everywhere from a single point at once interpreted as supportive of a geocentric POV.

What was a great distance between the geocentric, God loves us because we are central, and the modern astronomy has evolved to minimize the distress of each new generation learning the major ideas.

It is the major way for all intellectual revolutions summed in the .sig


true scientific change proceeds by one funeral after another.

 

[Apoapsis]

What really puzzles me is why YEC's hold so closely to a 6-day creation, and yet deny Geocentricity (Sun going round the earth).

I first became aware of the C/E controversy because of Geocentrists. At the time I was volunteering time helping answer questions on a board set up to help grade school children with space and astronomy.

The board was eventually shut down after being spammed into uselessness by a small number of Geocentric posters.

 

[mark kennedy]

What really puzzles me is why YEC's hold so closely to a 6-day creation, and yet deny Geocentricity (Sun going round the earth).

The Bible clearly states that it is the sun which moves round the earth, and indeed Galileo was accused of being a heretic when he suggested, after conducting several scientific experiments, that in fact the earth goes round the sun.

So why is the Bible so right in one thing, and allowed to be wrong in another?

Or could it be that YEC's are illogical and just using the Bible to suit their own beliefs?

The Bible does not say that the sun revolves around the earth. Galileo was on trial not for contradicting the Bible but for contradicting Aristotle. It was believed at that time that the heavens were perfect but he discovered mountains and craters on the moon. That would have been a lot like someone saying that Mary had a big wart on here nose, just outrageous.

At his trial Galileo said, 'The Bible tells you how to get to heaven, not how the heavens work.' They still made him recant his work which was nonesense because his work was allready out there. There were also a lot of Jesuits who would eventually build observatories and come to the same conclusions.

 

[rmwilliamsll]

'The Bible tells you how to get to heaven, not how the heavens work.'


sounds better as:
the bible tells you how to go to heaven not how the heavens go.

the parallelism is lost in your paraphrase.


the issue is if geocentricism arises in Aristotle or in the ANE proto-science.

1-even if it is Aristotle, everyone believed that it was what the Scriptures taught. sort of like YECism today.

2-there is no reason to believe that God revealed the true of heliocentricism to the ancient Hebrews, there is no evidence for it in the OT and lots of verses to demonstrate that they believed not only that the sun revolved around earth but that the earth was flat.

 

[jereth]

Appears to be more the simple passage of time. Given 450 years, 15-20 generations of Bible readers, people have adjusted their interpretation so that the cognitive dissonance has been minimized.

No longer is the physical center of the universe equated with the central concern for the Lord of the universe, we think we can just as well love us on the very peripheral edge of the galaxy which is just one of billions.

No longer are the direct and indirect allusion to the corners of the earth or the ability to see everywhere from a single point at once interpreted as supportive of a geocentric POV.

What was a great distance between the geocentric, God loves us because we are central, and the modern astronomy has evolved to minimize the distress of each new generation learning the major ideas.

It is the major way for all intellectual revolutions summed in the .sig

true scientific change proceeds by one funeral after another.

A fantastic response! Don't think I can beat it.

No longer is the physical center of the universe equated with the central concern for the Lord of the universe, we think we can just as well love us on the very peripheral edge of the galaxy which is just one of billions.

One of the chief fears of YECism, it seems, is that God cannot really love humanity if it took billions of years of evolutionary processes to create us. Perhaps one day a similar shift will occur, and Christendom will finally be able to accept that God can truly love us despite a vast distance of 13.7 billion years spanning the beginning of creation and the beginning of humanity.

 

[RichardT]

Geocentrism is in the scriptures.

 

[rmwilliamsll]

Geocentrism IS IN THE SCRIPTURES. Compromisers..

I really appreciate the fact that there are real geocentrics out there. There are a few flatearthers as well but we haven't seen any here for awhile.

By having a group to the right of YECism, who use the exact same arguments towards YECism as YECism uses towards OEC or TE. To see YECism have to deal with their right wing, either or alternetly ignoring and rebuttaling them, is a study in rhetoric and how ideas form continuums not these discrete, compact, distinct schools that we like to imagine things.

For flat-earth, geocentric, YECism, OEC, TE do form a continuum on how the Church has reacted over time to the pressure of science on Scriptural hermeneutics. And that is what makes investigation of the issues interesting and worthwhile. Bring up issues and ideas that are helpful in our long term understanding of Scripture and what and how God is speaking in it.

 

[Markus6]

For flat-earth, geocentric, YECism, OEC, TE do form a continuum on how the Church has reacted over time to the pressure of science on Scriptural hermeneutics.

Can I be a geocentrist TE? And if so where does this put me on the continuum?

 

[random_guy]

Can I be a geocentrist TE? And if so where does this put me on the continuum?

I don't see why not. I'm a Flat Earth Helocentric TEist.

 

[SH89]

Geocentrism IS IN THE SCRIPTURES. Compromisers..

Where does the Scriptures state that the Earth is at the center of the universe?

 

[jereth]

I don't see why not. I'm a Flat Earth Helocentric TEist.

Do you believe in the Great A'Tuin?

 

[Markus6]

So if I say I'm a geocentrist TE do I just get mocked? I'm actually serious.

 

[RichardT]

I don't see why not. I'm a Flat Earth Helocentric TEist.

lol, funny..

 

[RichardT]

So if I say I'm a geocentrist TE do I just get mocked? I'm actually serious.

Well, not by me of course..

 

[rmwilliamsll]

They do not want to admit how substantial a lot of creation science is.


all that has to be done is tell us what these substantial pieces of evidence are and let us discuss them. AFAIK there is NO scientific evidence for the distinctive pieces of creationist theory:
young earth
kinds
barrier to evolution
distinction of micro from macro evolution
hyperevolution since the fall
founders effect and bottlenecks from global flood


but i'd listen if any YECists actually wanted to present evidence and discuss it. that is why i for one am here.

 

[rmwilliamsll]

So if I say I'm a geocentrist TE do I just get mocked? I'm actually serious.

present your case.
see what happens.

what is the evidence for a geocentric solar system?
why would taking the Bible literally and believing in a geocentric solar system despite modern astronomy and physics logically go with taking modern biology seriously and understanding the TofE?

 

[SH89]

why would taking the Bible literally and believing in a geocentric solar system. . . ?

Again, where do the Scriptures state that the solar system is geocentric?

 

[RichardT]

Again, where do the Scriptures state that the solar system is geocentric?

I showed you a whole list of verese before in another thread... Hold on let me find it...

 

[Jase]

Again, where do the Scriptures state that the solar system is geocentric?

How about God stopping the sun for a day for Joshua? The sun doesn't revolve around the Earth, so the sun wouldn't be what God stops.