Courts really are, Serial-Killers

[rocknanchor]

To everything there is a season,
and a time to every purpose under
the heaven, , A time to kill, and a time to heal

(Ecclesiastes 3:1,3)​

You follow Jesus? Good! Lots of people like to think they do. Trouble there is V-3 has been fulfilled and now jurist methods incorporate man’s methods rather than the NT model, otherwise known as the fulfillment of God’s will.

The hour is coming when whoever kills you
will think he is offering service to God

(John 16:2b)​

IMO, man’s reason is why we curtail the blessings that are on hold. But don’t look to jurisprudence for wisdom we may be missing when they trample NT wisdom with such opinions as ”irredeemable”.

CP vs NT.

Though proponents gather unbridled clergymen in attempts to use the New Testament to justify the use of Capital Punishment in weak extrapolations here and there, it will forever stand as an unproven Christian logic, otherwise known as faithlessness (“sin”).

Take away prisoners cell-phones and flat-screens and subject them to what God sees fit in the NT realities dealing with imprisoned offenders.

 

[HTacianas]

To everything there is a season,
and a time to every purpose under
the heaven, , A time to kill, and a time to heal

(Ecclesiastes 3:1,3)​

You follow Jesus? Good! Lots of people like to think they do. Trouble there is V-3 has been fulfilled and now jurist methods incorporate man’s methods rather than the NT model, otherwise known as the fulfillment of God’s will.

The hour is coming when whoever kills you
will think he is offering service to God

(John 16:2b)​

IMO, man’s reason is why we curtail the blessings that are on hold. But don’t look to jurisprudence for wisdom we may be missing when they trample NT wisdom with such opinions as ”irredeemable”.

CP vs NT.

Though proponents gather unbridled clergymen in attempts to use the New Testament to justify the use of Capital Punishment in weak extrapolations here and there, it will forever stand as an unproven Christian logic, otherwise known as faithlessness (“sin”).

Take away prisoners cell-phones and flat-screens and subject them to what God sees fit in the NT realities dealing with imprisoned offenders.

There is nothing in the new testament that prohibits the death penalty. To attempt to use the new testament against the death penalty inevitably leads to the idea of forgiveness for offenses. Forgiveness means full pardon for the offense, not merely some lesser punishment.

 

[nonaeroterraqueous]

Well, you certainly took that scripture out of context.

The hour is coming when whoever kills you
will think he is offering service to God

I think it's pretty obvious he was talking about Christians being persecuted because of Christ by religious Jews. That actually happened, and that's what the verse is about. Don't twist it.

 

[rocknanchor]

Remaining untouched ladies and gents; CP's Unproven justification.

Still open to points though.

 

[Anthony2019]

To everything there is a season,
and a time to every purpose under
the heaven, , A time to kill, and a time to heal

(Ecclesiastes 3:1,3)​

You follow Jesus? Good! Lots of people like to think they do. Trouble there is V-3 has been fulfilled and now jurist methods incorporate man’s methods rather than the NT model, otherwise known as the fulfillment of God’s will.

The hour is coming when whoever kills you
will think he is offering service to God

(John 16:2b)​

IMO, man’s reason is why we curtail the blessings that are on hold. But don’t look to jurisprudence for wisdom we may be missing when they trample NT wisdom with such opinions as ”irredeemable”.

CP vs NT.

Though proponents gather unbridled clergymen in attempts to use the New Testament to justify the use of Capital Punishment in weak extrapolations here and there, it will forever stand as an unproven Christian logic, otherwise known as faithlessness (“sin”).

Take away prisoners cell-phones and flat-screens and subject them to what God sees fit in the NT realities dealing with imprisoned offenders.

I am personally against capital punishment and am glad it was abolished years ago in the UK.

 

[Dave-W]

I think it's pretty obvious he was talking about Christians being persecuted because of Christ by religious Jews. That actually happened, and that's what the verse is about.

That was in the first century.
It happens today with ISIS.

 

[Nithavela]

To everything there is a season,
and a time to every purpose under
the heaven, , A time to kill, and a time to heal

(Ecclesiastes 3:1,3)​

You follow Jesus? Good! Lots of people like to think they do. Trouble there is V-3 has been fulfilled and now jurist methods incorporate man’s methods rather than the NT model, otherwise known as the fulfillment of God’s will.

The hour is coming when whoever kills you
will think he is offering service to God

(John 16:2b)​

IMO, man’s reason is why we curtail the blessings that are on hold. But don’t look to jurisprudence for wisdom we may be missing when they trample NT wisdom with such opinions as ”irredeemable”.

CP vs NT.

Though proponents gather unbridled clergymen in attempts to use the New Testament to justify the use of Capital Punishment in weak extrapolations here and there, it will forever stand as an unproven Christian logic, otherwise known as faithlessness (“sin”).

Take away prisoners cell-phones and flat-screens and subject them to what God sees fit in the NT realities dealing with imprisoned offenders.

You think prisoners have cell phones?

 

[rocknanchor]

You think prisoners have cell phones?

Greetings! Well, as for Germany, I have not researched that and therefore cannot comment. If not, are there findings of their absence to be had?

 

[wonderkins]

God is for capital punishment. You see it taking place in the Bible. What do you think is happening when God casts sinners into the lake of fire? Look at what happens to Achen and his family. Or Haman. Or the false prophets on Mount Carmel. If you point out that those were old testament, don't forget about Ananias and Sapphir.

Romans 13:1-4
1 Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God.
2 Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment.
3 For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval,
4 for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer. - Romans 13:1-4

 

[tulc]

Greetings! Well, as for Germany, I have not researched that and therefore cannot comment. If not, are there findings of their absence to be had?

you mean like this?
Mobile phones in prison - Wikipedia

In most prisons, inmates are forbidden from possessing mobile phones due to their ability to communicate with the outside world and other security issues. Mobile phones are one of the most smuggled items into prisons. They provide inmates the ability to make and receive unauthorized phone calls, send email and text messages, use social media, and follow news pertaining to their case, among other forbidden uses.[1][2]

tulc(hopes that helps)

 

[rocknanchor]

Ananias and Sapphir.

Was this the Apostle's doing, or the one to whom vengeance belongs and sometimes uses man to show His mighty deeds?

But in fairness, look at what happens when the rubber meets-the-road in Romans 13, and savagery or the like runs wild, Romans 13:4 exhibits God's will for the tranquility in real-time as in swords-a-swinging. God's truth exhibits mercy to the above "irredeemable". That is man's reason, not God's.

When the offender is brought under subjection, he still is given chance by God to receive the glorious Gospel of light. Not the feeble attempt to play God with 20,000-volts.

 

[com7fy8]

Forgiveness means full pardon for the offense, not merely some lesser punishment.

There has been such emphasis on stopping the death penalty because ones should be considered redeemable; and so I did not consider there could be need to stop the lesser punishments, too, if this anti-execution argument of redeem-ability is applicable to everyone >

a very helpful clarification

Of course, now I see, if you hold someone in custody but do not kill the person, you can test if the person has become redeemed or not exactly.

God is for capital punishment. You see it taking place in the Bible. What do you think is happening when God casts sinners into the lake of fire? Look at what happens to Achen and his family. Or Haman. Or the false prophets on Mount Carmel. If you point out that those were old testament, don't forget about Ananias and Sapphir.

Yes, but these examples are in the Old Testament; so technically they might not go for how we in Jesus need to do things according to His New Covenant. Even so >

he does not bear the sword in vain.

Even so > this could be what God uses unsaved ones in power to do. I consider it might not be our specialization in God's plan. We in Jesus are specialists in love and mercy and forgiveness.

But Jesus did say, let the one without sin cast the first stone, didn't He? That woman would have been guilty of a capital offense, under Mosaic Law.

Are you going to pick and choose which Mosaic Law capital offenses get execution?

Striking or cursing a parent is capital offense.

Lying in order to fool a guy into thinking you are a virgin so he will marry you > capital offense!

Working on the Sabbath . . . death penalty.

And there are others.

 

[Anthony2019]

To the woman caught in adultery, Jesus stated "let him without sin cast the first stone". When he was executed by the authorities, he said "Father forgive them". There is simply no record of Jesus telling his disciples to take an "eye for an eye", or exacting revenge or retribution on anyone, whatever they had done. It would be impossible to persuade me that God is in favour of capital punishment of any form. Jesus spent his time loving people, healing them and showing them his forgiveness. The good news of the gospel is that the vilest offender can receive mercy and the grace to change their lives.

 

[com7fy8]

It would be impossible to persuade me that God is in favour of capital punishment of any form.

Of course, God approves of someone trusting in Jesus on the cross. Jesus suffered and died like He did, with hope for any evil person, at all.

However, God can use humans to do His purpose. And there are times God decides to take out certain evil people. But in order to do this which could be dirty work, He can use a person who is not a believer.

By the way, what do you think about stopping ISIS? This included killing people. If they were not stopped, they would be allowed to kill and ruin a lot of people. So, what do you think about something like that?

My personal take is God does work in mysterious ways, including using humans for His resisting of wrong people >

"God resists the proud" (in James 4:6, 1 Peter 5:5).

But I pray for even evil people, for however God will have mercy on them and bless them.

 

[Anthony2019]

By the way, what do you think about stopping ISIS? This included killing people. If they were not stopped, they would be allowed to kill and ruin a lot of people. So, what do you think about something like that?

I would say that there would be a legitimate case for protecting oneself or another innocent party against an aggressor if there was an imminent risk of harm. Someone who is already in prison for a crime can no longer harm anyone, is defenceless against any sentence that may have been passed upon them, and there is also the potential for contrition and repentance. Executing a murderer doesn't bring back the victim and just adds to the number of people who have lost their lives. I would say that the desire of most victims of crime is that the perpetrator learns something from the pain or loss that they have inflicted, therefore I think the ultimate form of justice would be to experience true sorrow for the crime, an understanding of the gravity of what they have done, and the determination to change their lives.

 

[rocknanchor]

By the way, what do you think about stopping ISIS?

Same as I and others propose, with Romans 13:4. If Paul had his druthers to choose from when he took an active part against the beast in Ephesus, understood where the true profit laid. Not in the lifeless strewn about, but in His power to raise the dead (1 Corinthians 15:32).
.

 

[HTacianas]

There has been such emphasis on stopping the death penalty because ones should be considered redeemable; and so I did not consider there could be need to stop the lesser punishments, too, if this anti-execution argument of redeem-ability is applicable to everyone >

a very helpful clarification

Of course, now I see, if you hold someone in custody but do not kill the person, you can test if the person has become redeemed or not exactly.

Yes, but these examples are in the Old Testament; so technically they might not go for how we in Jesus need to do things according to His New Covenant. Even so >

Even so > this could be what God uses unsaved ones in power to do. I consider it might not be our specialization in God's plan. We in Jesus are specialists in love and mercy and forgiveness.

But Jesus did say, let the one without sin cast the first stone, didn't He? That woman would have been guilty of a capital offense, under Mosaic Law.

Are you going to pick and choose which Mosaic Law capital offenses get execution?

Striking or cursing a parent is capital offense.

Lying in order to fool a guy into thinking you are a virgin so he will marry you > capital offense!

Working on the Sabbath . . . death penalty.

And there are others.

The argument against the death penalty is only rarely based on the redeemability of the accused. That is often touted by those who oppose the death penalty but it isn't the issue. The death penalty remains "low hanging fruit" in the culture wars.

 

[Anthony2019]

In the middle ages, heresy and witchcraft were treated as the ultimate capital crime where perpetrators were disposed of in the most grisly way imaginable. But even in their primitive stupidity, they at least showed mercy to those who recanted.

 

[Nithavela]

Greetings! Well, as for Germany, I have not researched that and therefore cannot comment. If not, are there findings of their absence to be had?

What are you talking about? I was asking of their existence in thé hands of US prisoners.

For your info, prisoners may not have cellphones. Actually, it's one of the biggest no nos you can do in prison, short of killing someone.

Pharma Bro Martin Shkreli: Feds investigate alleged prison cellphone use by 'Pharma Bro' Martin Shkreli - CBS News

 

[rocknanchor]

Though proponents gather unbridled clergymen in attempts to use the New Testament to justify the use of Capital Punishment in weak extrapolations here and there, it will forever stand as an unproven Christian logic, otherwise known as faithlessness (“sin”).

I have seen this in action, , recurring inner shakes of wardens in need of spiritual council. Oh, still, there are some who would willingly profess this has nothing to do with God sending us ground-level conviction!!!