Court allows Ohio to defund Planned Parenthood

[Archaeopteryx]

What is the abortion doctor doing to the child then, if not murdering him or her?

Murder involves the deliberate act of killing a person. Abortion does not involve the deliberate act of killing a person. It is not murder.

 

[TLK Valentine]

an AR-15, a long gun, is actually permissible to carry openly in most states: Open carry in the United States - Wikipedia

Sorry, OT, but wanted to address the facts.

I stand corrected, and I thank you for it.

Ban abortion after heart beat is detected!

I personally think lung development should be the cut off point... 22-23 weeks is the bare minimum that they could survive outside the womb, anyway...

Of course, I also think cases of rape, incest, or the health of the mother should be given special consideration...

But on top of all that, seeing as how it's not my body and I will never have to be in a position to make this decision, but have known several women who did (for the record, not through any action on my part), I think my opinion on the matter us more or less academic, and none of my darn business.

 

[Hammster]

Yes, and under those laws, guns are legal. We currently have abortion laws, and under those laws, abortion is legal.

In both cases, there are reasonable limitations... you can't legally walk down the street with an AR-15 slung over your shoulder without a permit (in most states), and you can't legally perform an abortion without a medical license (in any state).

There are people on both sides of the political spectrum looking to restrict these legal rights... for the most part, those seeking to restrict guns fail... the anti abortion advocates enjoy greater success.

I know you are desperate to make the comparison, but there are multitudes of gun laws which make it more difficult to obtain guns. Let’s do the same thing with abortions.

 

[Hammster]

Murder involves the deliberate act of killing a person. Abortion does not involve the deliberate act of killing a person. It is not murder.

Baby is alive in the womb. Doctor performs procedure. Baby is dead.

Seems intentional to me.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Do we currently have gun laws?

I know you are desperate to make the comparison,

As long as you're going to debate yourself, I'm just going to slip out for a slice of pizza... let me know who wins!

 

[TLK Valentine]

Baby is alive in the womb. Doctor performs procedure. Baby is dead.

Seems intentional to me.

And legal.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

Baby is alive in the womb. Doctor performs procedure. Baby is dead.

Seems intentional to me.

Could you clarify your use of the word "baby"? You are referring to a zygote, embryo, or fetus, correct?

 

[USincognito]

Um...okay.

 

[Hammster]

And legal.

Sadly. But at least you admit it’s a baby.

That’s always a good step.

 

[Hammster]

Could you clarify your use of the word "baby"? You are referring to a zygote, embryo, or fetus, correct?

Stages of development don’t change the fact that it’s still a human baby.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

Stages of development don’t change the fact that it’s still a human baby.

So you are deliberately conflating several stages of development?

 

[Hammster]

So you are deliberately conflating several stages of development?

No.

 

[98cwitr]

Murder involves the deliberate act of killing a person. Abortion does not involve the deliberate act of killing a person. It is not murder.

And that's a fundamental disagreement we have. It's more than common sense that abortion is intentionally killing a person.

 

[Speedwell]

an AR-15, a long gun, is actually permissible to carry openly in most states: Open carry in the United States - Wikipedia

Sorry, OT, but wanted to address the facts. Ban abortion after heart beat is detected!

Why a heartbeat? Why is that the unique point when humanity begins? Is that when your church teaches that ensoulment takes place?

 

[TLK Valentine]

Sadly. But at least you admit it’s a baby.

That’s always a good step.

I said no such thing.

PROTIP: Save the "gotcha!" statements for when you actually get someone. They're just sad otherwise.

 

[Hammster]

I said no such thing.

PROTIP: Save the "gotcha!" statements for when you actually get someone. They're just sad otherwise.

Now you are just walking it back.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Now you are just walking it back.

Walking what back?

"Gotcha!"s are pathetic even under ideal circumstances, but here,I didn't even say what you said I said.

If you can't make an honest argument, what exactly are you arguing for?

 

[Hammster]

Walking what back?

"Gotcha!"s are pathetic even under ideal circumstances, but here,I didn't even say what you said I said.

If you can't make an honest argument, what exactly are you arguing for?

Okay. Stick with that.

 

[98cwitr]

Why a heartbeat? Why is that the unique point when humanity begins? Is that when your church teaches that ensoulment takes place?

Honestly, I'd prefer we go conception, because I believe that's when life begins, but I'm trying to find a compromise in order to reduce the number of children killed by abortion doctors. As I've already stated, I'd also be willing to compromise on rape/incest w/ due process, and terminal babies <= 12 weeks. This doesn't mean I don't consider the others not murder, but the potential for success in advocating for heatbeat bills is higher than going conception, and we prolife folks can make a stronger case there. Yes, the ultimate goal is to have society see abortion, ALL abortion for what it is: the murder of innocent life, but we're not going to get there without compromises now.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Okay. Stick with that.

Sorry your "gotcha!" failed. Better luck next time?